RustyTools Posted January 5, 2020 Share Posted January 5, 2020 Hey Joe - I was retracing some of our troubleshooting steps, and I just noticed there's an LED on the VIP board itself. DUH!! Dunno why I never noticed it before, except maybe because of the contorted positions I had to get in to access the board in the first place. Anyways, whenever ignition is in RUN or ACC, the LED is green, and while any SmartWheel button is being pressed it goes to yellow. Does that help you any? I don't think I saw you mention it above (or in the VIP troubleshooting guide). HTH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSHappyCampers Posted January 5, 2020 Author Share Posted January 5, 2020 On 1/4/2020 at 3:07 PM, jacwjames said: Joe Looking at the VIP wiring schematic power going to the J12-2 pin is provided prior to the light switch. At least you know that if you bypass this you can get power to the headlights. The power from the light switch goes to the J11 harness pin 6. This provides power to the Headlamp / Marker Control box, which is what probably controls the headlights and interacts with the wiper function to turn them on. Once power for the headlights leave the control box it goes to the turn signal & Hi/Low function. The High/Low function is either or, the lights will either be on high or low beam. but the on/off function comes from the VIP control box. My guess is that there is a latching function so that the power goes to the headlight when the switch is ON or the wipers are activated. I went back and checked the Chassis wiring diagram and power to the headlights has to come through the VIP module and then the trun signal with Hi/Low function, no other way to get there. May be time to VIP and see what they recommend. I just verified that I am getting voltage on J11 pin 6 when the dash headlight switch is on. I don't see anywhere that the headlight power comes out of the controller back to the lights. J12 pins 1 & 2 are just relay contacts to flash the headlights from the SmartWheel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacwjames Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 Joe, My guess is that there is a latching circuit for the headlight within the Head/Marker Lamp Control Block. Based on the Chassis wiring diagram the power to the headlights does go through J12 wiring harness and should be pin 2 that then goes through the turn signal Hi/Low beam switch. You indicated in an earlier post that when you use the flash button on the steering wheel the head light comes on so this tells me the turn signal Hi/Low beam switch is good. So my guess is that the latching device within the control block is not working and you'll have to replace the Smart Wheel controller. I would recommend calling VIP and get some advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacwjames Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 Joe, I looked at the troubleshooting guide for the VIP system. There are a couple of continuity test you could do the VIP system to determine whether it is bad or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSHappyCampers Posted January 6, 2020 Author Share Posted January 6, 2020 (edited) 16 hours ago, jacwjames said: Joe, My guess is that there is a latching circuit for the headlight within the Head/Marker Lamp Control Block. Based on the Chassis wiring diagram the power to the headlights does go through J12 wiring harness and should be pin 2 that then goes through the turn signal Hi/Low beam switch. You indicated in an earlier post that when you use the flash button on the steering wheel the head light comes on so this tells me the turn signal Hi/Low beam switch is good. So my guess is that the latching device within the control block is not working and you'll have to replace the Smart Wheel controller. I would recommend calling VIP and get some advice. The flash button on the SmartWheel is not working at all now. Don't remember if it ever did! I can short out J12 pins 1 & 2 and the headlights come on. That tells me that the flash circuit in the controller is not working. Just got off the phone with tech support at VIP. Found out that J11 pin 6 is the sensing circuit for the headlamp relay on J12 pins 1 & 2. If 12VDC is present on J11 pin 6 then the relay contacts on J12 pins 1 & 2 should be closed, completing the circuit to the headlights! Since I can short out J12 pins 1 & 2 and the headlights come on, that means that the SM209 controller is defective! The SM209 is replaced by the SM210 so I guess I will be ordering one today. The cost is $185, unless I can find a used one somewhere. Edited January 6, 2020 by jminyard1@gmail.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacwjames Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 (edited) OK, understand. Same conclusion though, your HI/LOW circuit on the steering must be OK because the headlight power go through it. Pretty much narrows it down to the VIP controller Edited January 6, 2020 by jacwjames Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSHappyCampers Posted January 6, 2020 Author Share Posted January 6, 2020 38 minutes ago, jacwjames said: OK, understand. Same conclusion though, your HI/LOW circuit on the steering must be OK because the headlight power go through it. Pretty much narrows it down to the VIP controller There is one final thing I need to check before ordering the module. I need to be sure I am getting 12VDC to J2 Pins 5 & 6 which looks like the main power source to the module. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivan K Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 I don't know how you feel about getting into the guts of the controller but often a part like a relay can be cheaply sourced and replaced. I have seen relay pins unsoldering themselves from the board when the contacts spark and burn, like in the AH controller for instance. Given that all the headlight power goes through that one relay in your case, it might be a possibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSHappyCampers Posted January 6, 2020 Author Share Posted January 6, 2020 27 minutes ago, Ivan K said: I don't know how you feel about getting into the guts of the controller but often a part like a relay can be cheaply sourced and replaced. I have seen relay pins unsoldering themselves from the board when the contacts spark and burn, like in the AH controller for instance. Given that all the headlight power goes through that one relay in your case, it might be a possibility. I'm tired of messing with it! I ordered the SM210 controller from VIP who manufactures them for $185. Northwest RV sells them for $242! The SM210 is a direct replacement for the SM209 that is in my MH. Hopefully they've made some improvements in it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSHappyCampers Posted January 16, 2020 Author Share Posted January 16, 2020 Received the new SM210 SmartWheel controller yesterday and it solved the problem! All the functions work, including headlights, except I don't have fog lights. That could be just a blown fuse since I haven't checked it yet. Will be working on that today. Thanks to all of you who helped me figure out this problem! Hope I can return the favor someday! 🙂 Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RustyTools Posted January 16, 2020 Share Posted January 16, 2020 Congrats! All you needed to do, Joe, was to keep throwing more money at the (or any) problem! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSHappyCampers Posted January 16, 2020 Author Share Posted January 16, 2020 Now I can't figure out how to turn on the fog lights! There is a button on the SmartWheel with two lights back-to-back that I thought might be the fog lights, but it doesn't turn them on. I can't find any mention of fog lights in the owner's manual or the info on the SM210 controller! Any ideas? Joe 10 minutes ago, jminyard1@gmail.com said: Now I can't figure out how to turn on the fog lights! There is a button on the SmartWheel with two lights back-to-back that I thought might be the fog lights, but it doesn't turn them on. I can't find any mention of fog lights in the owner's manual or the info on the SM210 controller! Any ideas? Joe Just found out that the back-to-back button on the SmartWheel flashes the marker lights! Can't figure out what turns on the fog lights!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr4Film Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 16 hours ago, jminyard1@gmail.com said: Now I can't figure out how to turn on the fog lights! There is a button on the SmartWheel with two lights back-to-back that I thought might be the fog lights, but it doesn't turn them on. I can't find any mention of fog lights in the owner's manual or the info on the SM210 controller! Any ideas? Joe Just found out that the back-to-back button on the SmartWheel flashes the marker lights! Can't figure out what turns on the fog lights!!!! Joe, You are correct! It flashes the marker lights and it is located on the right side of the Smart-Wheel. There is another button on the left side at the top of the Smart-Wheel which flashes the headlights. My fog lights have a switch on the master dash which is located all the way to the left of the dash panel. If I remember correctly the way Monaco wired the coach the fog lights will only come on if the headlights are not on high beams and the switch is on. There is a relay in the FRB which controls the operation correctly. Some people including me have removed the relay , installed a jumper between two contacts of the relay base which allows to use the fog lights anytime you choose. I now use the fog lights for my DRL plus i removed the Hella Fog lamps and installed bright LED lights purchased from Amazon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSHappyCampers Posted January 17, 2020 Author Share Posted January 17, 2020 3 hours ago, Dr4Film said: Joe, You are correct! It flashes the marker lights and it is located on the right side of the Smart-Wheel. There is another button on the left side at the top of the Smart-Wheel which flashes the headlights. My fog lights have a switch on the master dash which is located all the way to the left of the dash panel. If I remember correctly the way Monaco wired the coach the fog lights will only come on if the headlights are not on high beams and the switch is on. There is a relay in the FRB which controls the operation correctly. Some people including me have removed the relay , installed a jumper between two contacts of the relay base which allows to use the fog lights anytime you choose. I now use the fog lights for my DRL plus i removed the Hella Fog lamps and installed bright LED lights purchased from Amazon. I think the dash switch on the far left is labeled Driving Lights on my coach. I will check that out later and see if that turns on the fog lights. Thanks! Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSHappyCampers Posted January 17, 2020 Author Share Posted January 17, 2020 (edited) MYSTERY SOLVED! Thanks to the comments of you guys and those on IRV2 I figured out how they work. The fog lights are controlled by the far left switch on the dash labeled "Driving Lights". The fog lights only come on when the engine is running, that switch is on and the headlights are on high beam. That seems weird to me since I don't think anybody drives in fog with the high beams on! My owner's manual talks about the Driving Light switch as setting the low beam headlights at 80% voltage, with no mention of fog lights! I assume that it's saying that when this switch is on both low and high beams are turned on at the same time? Anyway, thanks again for your help! Joe Edited January 17, 2020 by jminyard1@gmail.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacwjames Posted January 17, 2020 Share Posted January 17, 2020 The conversation on fog lights peaked my interest yesterday so I looked at both the chassis wiring diagram and the manual and no mention of fogs lights But what Joe described above is the way mine works, I didn't try just the high beams and applying the driving lights to see if the intensity reduces but either way mine are working. I hardly ever drive in the dark but there was one time coming back from NM we hit some rain and fog, miserable driving but didn't try the driving lights to see if it would have helped. It might be nice to be able to activate the fog lights by themselves so I may investigate adding the jumper as described in one of the posts I read. Glad you got all your issues worked out Joe, like they say "you learn something new every day". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSHappyCampers Posted January 17, 2020 Author Share Posted January 17, 2020 4 hours ago, jacwjames said: The conversation on fog lights peaked my interest yesterday so I looked at both the chassis wiring diagram and the manual and no mention of fogs lights But what Joe described above is the way mine works, I didn't try just the high beams and applying the driving lights to see if the intensity reduces but either way mine are working. I hardly ever drive in the dark but there was one time coming back from NM we hit some rain and fog, miserable driving but didn't try the driving lights to see if it would have helped. It might be nice to be able to activate the fog lights by themselves so I may investigate adding the jumper as described in one of the posts I read. Glad you got all your issues worked out Joe, like they say "you learn something new every day". If I understand it correctly, turning on the Driving/fog lights when the high beam headlights does not reduce the high beam but also turns on the low beam at the same time at 80% voltage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSHappyCampers Posted February 5, 2020 Author Share Posted February 5, 2020 On 1/2/2020 at 7:48 AM, jacwjames said: Not sure on this, but I know that when I turn on my wipers the headlights will come on and stay on until I turn the key off. Because of this I reason that there "could" be a possibility that the VIP Smart Wheel might be the problem. Joe, That's how I found the VIP module, I actually found it by accident. My CB radio was not working so I replaced it and had to access behind the radio to get to it. When I was moving things around I dislodged a wire on the VIP module, upon inspection I found it must have happen before and the PO tried to recrimp the connection, I ended up soldering. Jim, I've been banned from IRV2 through February 18th. If you see someone on there trying to contact me please give them my e-mail address, jminyard1@gmail.com. Thanks! Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jacwjames Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 Will do Joe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSHappyCampers Posted February 5, 2020 Author Share Posted February 5, 2020 29 minutes ago, jacwjames said: Will do Joe. Give them my e-mail address through a PM, NOT on the forum, or else they will nail you too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel S - '96 Safari Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 2 hours ago, jminyard1@gmail.com said: Jim, I've been banned from IRV2 through February 18th. If you see someone on there trying to contact me please give them my e-mail address, jminyard1@gmail.com. Thanks! Joe Joe i RV2 has banned me for LIFE. Not to worry.... there is life here http://www.rvforum.net/SMF_forum/.....after i RV2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSHappyCampers Posted February 5, 2020 Author Share Posted February 5, 2020 3 hours ago, Mel S - '96 Safari said: Joe i RV2 has banned me for LIFE. Not to worry.... there is life here http://www.rvforum.net/SMF_forum/.....after i RV2. I just signed up on that forum! Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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