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Towing with the ISC


JetAburner
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Hey guys, I'm  new to this and am really impressed with all of your knowledge and advise. Our new to us coach is a very nice low mileage '99 Windsor 40' with the ISC 330 equipped  with a Banks power pack tuned to 400hp. EGT tops at 1200 wot on a 5mi 6%er making 25lbs of boost. Coach drives and pulls hills great. In my former work, I owned big rigs with 525hp pulling 80k so I've been around that block. Question:  Will this coach comfortably pull an '02 F250 4x4 weighing in at 7300lbs. Coach is rated to tow 10,000. Doesn't have to rocket up the grades, but would like to see at least 45mph on a 6%er. Let the thoughts begin.  Thanks

 

 

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You are Flat-Towing 7300 lbs so your tongue weight will be negligible. 7300 lbs is well within the 10,000 lb hitch rating.

Having a diesel PLUS the added benefit of the Banks Power Pack, there won't be a highway grade that you can't climb. You may not get to the top the fastest but you WILL get there.

I have climbed grades from the west coast to the east coast and from Alaska to the Key's (LOL) and there wasn't one that I couldn't get over.

I also have the Banks Power Pack however, on my last trip to New Hampshire I think the Ottomind took a dump. I had to install the By-Pass Plug to continue on to my destination here on Ossipee Lake. Without the Banks Ottomind working I had no boost. It is now back to factory stock with the ByPass Plug. I still have to do some troubleshooting to see if the Ottomind is completely dead.

Do NOT pay any attention to speed while climbing grades. It's your RPM that you need to watch. Always try to keep your RPM's around the 2000 mark. That will give you the proper torque in your Cummins ISC so that you are not lugging the engine while climbing. Downshift manually to keep those RPM's at that level.

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Great info. Thank you. I know that the smaller 8.3s are going to want more rpm than the big 14L Cummins we used to run. They liked to settle in at 1600. What kind of boost were you seeing before the Ottomans quit?

Gotta love spell check

Ottomind

Good to know re the Temps

Thanks

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It's a power upgrade that was offered by Banks for the ISC8.3. Consisted of an electronics package, turbo hot bowl replacement, and a gauge package with  boost and pyrometer. To my knowledge,  it's no longer available. 

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2 minutes ago, Donflem said:

What is a banks power pack?

Don, it is no longer available. The company supplying Banks with the Ottomind stopped making them. But you can read about it here.

https://official.bankspower.com/magazine/powerpack/

14 minutes ago, JetAburner said:

Great info. Thank you. I know that the smaller 8.3s are going to want more rpm than the big 14L Cummins we used to run. They liked to settle in at 1600. What kind of boost were you seeing before the Ottomans quit?

Gotta love spell check

Ottomind

Good to know re the Temps

Thanks

When running stock my stock boost gauge would max out at about 24 lbs. After the Banks Power Pack install, the Banks Boost Gauge would provide about 32 lbs of boost. The stock gauge remained the same. Another Banks gauge which is extremely important is the EGT gauge when climbing grades.

Temps will always go up for the coolant and transmission when climbing grades.

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21 hours ago, Donflem said:

I’ll check it out thanks Dr.

I have to retract the post I made below. It appears that Banks has stopped making Power Pack or Stinger kits for any RV Cummins engines.

Banks still offers a Power Pack Bundle for the Cummins ISB.

Edited by Dr4Film
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I'm not running any "extra power" but I had a leaking lift pump gasket and the first thing I did was bypass the original lift pump and install a "tap" for a pressure gauge in it's place, mounted and plumbed the FASS pump/filter at the original "primary fuel filter" location and installed a separate return fuel line to the tank.  I now can "see" the inlet pressure to the injector pump and the injector pump is running with inlet pressure rather than suction.... the FASS pump is providing 100% filtered and air free diesel fuel to the injector pump.  I believe it is the best thing I have done to assure solid engine performance.  I have made two round trips to Salt Lake City from Memphis area this summer with it running solid and strong. I can not imagine running extra power with the stock fuel system.

Ken

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Since you cannot compress a liquid, the amount of fuel getting to the injectors is limited by the gear pump in the injection pump regardless on the psi before the gear pump.

OP, you could have the wife drive the F250 up to the top if you need to go 45.

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13 hours ago, Cubflyer said:

Are you guys running the Banks power pack systems still using the stock "lift pump" (that only runs for a few seconds at engine start)..??

 

Yes, stock lift pump. The factory original lift pump was replaced due to a VERY tiny leak back in 2012 that was discovered by the Cummins shop in Coburg OR when they were replacing a small section of heater hose that failed at the rear top of the engine.

I was not aware of the leak as it wasn't causing any diesel to drip onto the ground. They found it after they hooked up their Insight System to the engine and found codes leading them to look closer at the engine for a potential problem. The pump was leaking onto the top of the starter, never reaching the ground.

After reading Vanwill's post on his installation of the FASS fuel pump and his two BIG reasons for doing it, I plan to have my shop in Orlando install one this winter when they are doing the routine engine service. My main reason for doing it is to protect the integrity of the CAPS Fuel System. I don't need to have a fuel polishing system with extra filters so that part doesn't interest me for now. That can always be done later if I feel a BIG need for it.

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Dick B,

I agree, you are correct, solid liquid does not compress.  Having positive pressure on the input of the pump is not intended to increase injector pump output (except that if the pump is not pumping a solid liquid, it's not pumping at 100% designed output) The Capps pump is lubed and cooled by fuel, again, not getting 100% fuel (without air) is not good for it. Having a positive pressure on the input of a pump assures that it is not sucking air

My lift pump gasket was leaking.... like Richard Smith's, without leaking on the ground (with the engine running), I only discovered it leaking while I was troubleshooting another problem that required my turning the ignition key on and off without starting the engine.  The pump would run but the fuel had no where to go except (finally) on the ground.  My theory is, if the gasket leaks fuel out it would leak air in (physics).  

Expecting top performance and reliability out of a pump that is cavitating....? 

Ken 

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46 minutes ago, tmw188 said:

Where is this lift pump located, above the starter? Is it easy to see leaks? 

Todd,

I was aware of the potential problem for years.  Cummins actually had a TSB on it.  So anytime I was under the coach I would inspect.  The transfer pump is directly above the starter.  But the problem is that if it is a small leak none would be easily visible.  You would probably be better pulling the small hatch in the bedroom and doing a wipe test on the fuel pump. 

The problem isn't necessarily the leak but when the pump isn't running while driving down the road you are probably sucking air which will cause problems with the injector pump.

Last Nov I was doing some work on my coach, I did a lube job and decided to take and fill it with fuel.  When I got back I decided to clean the jack stems as they came up very slow.  Crawled underneath and found the fuel pump dripping, couldn't miss it.  Tightened the 3 bolts on top which stopped the leak but after seeing more and more posts on injector pump problems I decided to install the FASS system.   

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Yes, Lift pump is above the starter. 

My experience with a 'leaking lift pump' the pump was fine, but the gasket between the pump and the housing it is bolted to was bad.

The leak first showed up as a dampness on the starter and bellhousing.  Really 'showed' itself while I was t/s'ing a ABS light, that required me to cycle the ignition switch causing the pump to run without the engine running.  That created a puddle under the engine about 2 ft in diameter.

The pump is held to the housing with three bolts (8mm socket if I remember correctly) from the top, accessible with a long 1/4" extension (18").  Gasket gets old and hard, bolts loosen up and fuel can seep out and air can be drawn in (bad thing for the injector $ pump. 

I bypassed the stock lift pump by installing a union fitting with a pressure tap (1/8" pipe thread) in the fuel feed hose and pipe. Then replaced the 'primary filter' with a FASS pump and filter system.

I feel it was a great improvement in the fuel system, and highly recommend it. 

 

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Ok I’ll need to look for this. I did a major clean and wipe down around the engine especially on top of the bell housing underneath and around the oil pan and at the rear of the valve cover area. Didn’t know at the time that this could be the leak you’re speaking of. I have everything cleaned up now so I can monitor. I also put a bottle on the vent tube that hangs down along side the oil pan. Don’t know if we need to start a new thread it’s up to the monitors I guess. Probably shouldn’t go much further than it is now, if so we can start a new thread.

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Image 1 - Cummins ISC 8.3 Engine; GOOD RUNNER!! CPL 2691;  260 Hp; 1CEXH0505CAO

My 8.3 ISC looks more like this.... the lift pump is hard to see but the three mounting bolts (vertical) on the housing that has the brass fitting by the bell housing and the silver colored hard line coming out the front going to the white fuel filter is easy to see.... 

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