tmw188 Posted December 5, 2021 Share Posted December 5, 2021 Where can I purchase a specific ball joint for a steering link? RR8S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick A Posted December 5, 2021 Share Posted December 5, 2021 Call Roadmaster. They are totally awesome! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmw188 Posted December 5, 2021 Author Share Posted December 5, 2021 I’ll do that thanks. Didn’t know it would be that easy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick A Posted December 5, 2021 Share Posted December 5, 2021 Something all it takes is a nudge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony G. Posted December 5, 2021 Share Posted December 5, 2021 I thought REV group shuttered Roadmaster chassis when they bought Monaco? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr4Film Posted December 5, 2021 Share Posted December 5, 2021 Is that the Pitman Arm part of the steering linkage, the drag link or some other part? AFAIK the ends are not replaceable. Far better off replacing the entire part. Any reputable truck repair shop can obtain the part for you. I highly recommend Josam's in Orlando FL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmw188 Posted December 5, 2021 Author Share Posted December 5, 2021 Well it’s the steering link(pitman arm?)that comes off the top of the drivers side wheel. The bottom photo is looking fwd to the front, you can see the gen. From that connection it runs fwd to the steering box. The ball joint appears to be removable in that it is not fixed into the arm? While lubing I discovered it’s missing a pc of the plastic boot that contains the grease within. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hypoxia Posted December 5, 2021 Share Posted December 5, 2021 (edited) What axle do you have? My coach has a Spicer E1462W so I go to the Spicer manual to find parts. There should be a tag on the axle or your Monaco build sheet may have it, mine does. If a boot is torn but no damage to the ball joint you can replace the boot, just pop the ball joint loose for access. The drag link is a specific length with specific bends to make sure there is no interference when moving through its whole range of movement. Monaco installed a drag link with the ball joint crimped at the steering arm end to eliminate any chance of rotation resulting in interference. I cut mine out, put a new ball joint in and welded it back together, a $50 fix rather than a $1000 fix. All other ball joints are easily removed. Edited December 5, 2021 by Hypoxia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmw188 Posted December 5, 2021 Author Share Posted December 5, 2021 (edited) 26 minutes ago, Hypoxia said: What axle do you have? My coach has a Spicer E1462W so I go to the Spicer manual to find parts. There should be a tag on the axle or your Monaco build sheet may have it, mine does. If a boot is torn but no damage to the ball joint you can replace the boot, just pop the ball joint loose for access. The drag link is a specific length with specific bends to make sure there is no interference when moving through its whole range of movement. Monaco installed a drag link with the ball joint crimped at the steering arm end to eliminate any chance of rotation resulting in interference. I cut mine out, put a new ball joint in and welded it back together, a $50 fix rather than a $1000 fix. All other ball joints are easily removed. Not sure on the brand I’ll look into that. So that long arm running up to the steering box is the drag link? Yes it has a offset bent into it. I thought it appeared the ball joint threaded onto it and maybe clamped? Maybe that’s were your saying it’s crimped? It doesn’t have a rubber boot but appears to be plastic. I have a good large truck center that will probably suggest that if it’s possible. Edited December 5, 2021 by tmw188 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hypoxia Posted December 5, 2021 Share Posted December 5, 2021 Energy Suspension Boot Just one option depending on what yours is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmw188 Posted December 5, 2021 Author Share Posted December 5, 2021 46 minutes ago, Hypoxia said: Energy Suspension Boot Just one option depending on what yours is. I’ll definitely look into that thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StellaTariche Posted December 5, 2021 Share Posted December 5, 2021 How to replace your defective TRW steering Box, replace or adjust drag link and pitman arm, and re-center ("clock") your steering wheel: This spring, I just went through the whole "add the full Monaco Watts suspension upgrade", "replace the defective steering box (TRW in my case)" and "get the pitman arm and drag link aligned with the (straight) front wheels" fun and games. Woohoo! (insert sarc tag here): Tools and supplies needed: torque multiplier ratchet (you'll see why) Big cuss jar About $500 in dollar bills for said cuss jar PB Blaster, Nut Buster or similar rusted bolt spray 3" bi-metal hole saw and drill Metal electrical box cover (about 4" square) Sheet metal screws, sealant, vice grip pliers, various screw drivers - including a wide flat blade with a not-too-long handle that will fit in a 1/2" deep well socket that fits the TRW adjustment locking bolt. An assistant who can (a) hold the steering wheel straight as you mess with things, and (b) doesn't mind hearing a lot of cuss words. Some things I learned with a *lot* of help from the board members: Place half the $500 in the cuss jar up front to appease the rusted bolts, pitman arm and drag link gods. This seems to be the most over-looked step. Spray everything with PB Blaster, Nut Buster, or your favorite rusted bolt removal spray the day before. Spray again when you begin. Replace your steering box if worn or damaged. My TRW box would no longer adjust, so I replaced it. $1100, including shipping and $400 core charge from Weller Truck parts. (616) 724-2000 in Grand Rapids. Beware - it weighs about 70 lbs. The bolts on the steering box require a "big" torque multiplier ratchet to remove them, or a 20 ft cheater bar which won't fit, so a torque multiplier ratchet it is. Impact wrench won't fit. Face East and feed the cuss jar. If replacing the steering box, use new mounting bolts, washers, and ny-loc nuts. Bolts are about 4" long, Grade 8 (measure). Have fun finding the 3 or 4 of each part (bolt, washers, nuts) you'll need, instead of the box of 100 they'll want to sell you. Cuss and feed cuss jar. Steering box mounting bolt torque specs: 4 bolt mounting (5/8" or 3/4" Bolts) TRW 300-325 FT LBS 3 bolt mounting (3/4" or 7/8" bolts) 400-425 FT LBS. The drag link ends are not replaceable. Monaco crimped them on to save a few buck and make sure the bend stayed in the correct position. Cuss at Monaco (you'll be repeating this step - a LOT) If drag link ends are worn, replacement options include: (a) having a machine shop (or you if talented in that area) remove the worn tie rod ends, weld in threaded sleeves, screw in replacement ends, or (b) purchase a 3rd party replacement drag link (the right length and bend angle) that has new and replaceable ends. A replacement drag link is about $1100. Look on-line. Cuss and feed cuss jar. Aligning the marks on the steering box and the pitman arm is *very* hard to do accurately, even with mirrors, because of the location. I used a hole saw in my electrical bay to cut a sight hole for aligning. Move electrical things around so you can cut a 3" hole in the sheet metal. The hole should be exactly opposite steering output shaft. See attached photo below. Feed cuss jar. Make sure the front wheels are dead on straight. Measuring tape and multiple tries. Feed cuss jar. Remove plastic shroud around steering wheel shaft inside the RV if older than 2011 model year. Mine is a 2000 Diplomat. Remove the pitman arm from the steering box. Tons of fun (more accurately "ft-lbs of fun", or "newton-meters of fun" if you are German or Canadian). Remove the front drag link to pitman arm connection. More tons of fun. A big, strong impact wrench needed. A two-arm pulley remover is probably needed; A three arm won't fit. BF Hammer is often useful. Feed cuss jar. Recheck the front wheels for straightness. You'll get used to this step. Inspect drag link ends for wear and lash. See replacement options (above) if worn. Re-assemble in this order: (a) Make sure the front wheels are still straight. (b) Adjust drag link by spinning front tie rod end so the pitman arm / drag link combination easily slips onto the steering box. (c) Sight through the hole you cut to make sure the marks on the pitman arm and steering box output shaft marks align. (d) Re-check front wheels for straightness. Pulling on the drag link/pitman arm combo, even a little, will move the wheels or the steering wheel. (e) Yell/cuss at assistant who is not paying attention and let the steering wheel move. (f) Feed cuss jar and apologize to assistant. (g) Lather, rinse, repeat, until the pitman arm slides on with no effort and no pulling or movement on the front wheels or steering wheel Torque the drag link and pitman arm. Torque spec is online, but "really tight" is the answer. Adjust the steering box (TRW only) until tight but no friction to remove lash. Takes finesse to do both at the same time. Here's how to do it: Get up under the coach and grab the input shaft of the steering gear, the one that goes up to the steering wheel. Grab the input shaft just above the steering gear case, between the u-joint and the case itself. You will be able to rock the shaft back and fourth and feel any play, or gear lash. The pitman arm should not move, you are feeling the internal gear play. Loosen the adjustment lock nut and SLOWLY turn the adjustment screw in, a little at a time, as you continue to move, rock, the input shaft and feel for gear lash reduction. Once you have VERY little play, or even none, do not allow the adjustment screw to move and lock the lock nut good and tight. Helpful hint: Use a 1/2 socket, held by vice grips, to tighten/loosen the adjustment jam nut. Slip the wide blade screw driver through the 1/2" square hole in your socket. Hold socket and turn screw. To tighten jam nut, hold screw driver and turn vice-grips holding socket. Re-clock (center) the steering wheel like this: NEVER remove the steering wheel ! To center the steering wheel, there is a universal coupling under the plastic shroud at your knees. It is splined but has a grove for the bolt all the way around the shaft so you can adjust the wheel in very small, exact, increments. Pull shaft up to move to a different spline. On newer episodes coaches (2012' and newer) the steering wheel adjustment universal joint is outside against the firewall. The "knuckle" on the to TRW input shaft has a groove on the steering shaft input, and should have bolted right up with the same size bolt. Re-use the same bolt. A smaller bolt could induce play, defeat your efforts, cause damage, or come loose while driving and kill you. Test drive to see if the steering wheel is straight on typical crowned roads for a few miles at both low speed and highway speeds. Re-clock the steering wheel by moving over a spline or two in the correct direct. Repeat until steering wheel is straight. Re-torque everything again. A loose steering system is a death trap. Seal the sight hole you cut in the electrical bay with an electrical box cover and sealant when done. See attached photo. Donate contents of cuss jar to (a) your now PTSD assistant, or (b) your favorite charity or (c) your favorite liquor store. (Site hole - re-sealed) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr4Film Posted December 5, 2021 Share Posted December 5, 2021 2 hours ago, StellaTariche said: Re-clock (center) the steering wheel like this: NEVER remove the steering wheel ! My steering wheel has been removed two times now. Once by the service tech at Josam's in Orlando when they installed the TRW Steering Box, new drag ink and pitman arm. The steering wheel had been off center ever since owning the coach and I wanted it to be straighten. Then it was removed a second time to check the condition of the clock spring. It may be easier to re-clock the steering wheel as you have described in your post but for those that may need to remove the steering wheel it's not that difficult providing you have the proper tools. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmw188 Posted December 5, 2021 Author Share Posted December 5, 2021 (edited) 5 hours ago, Hypoxia said: What axle do you have? My coach has a Spicer E1462W so I go to the Spicer manual to find parts. There should be a tag on the axle or your Monaco build sheet may have it, mine does. If a boot is torn but no damage to the ball joint you can replace the boot, just pop the ball joint loose for access. The drag link is a specific length with specific bends to make sure there is no interference when moving through its whole range of movement. Monaco installed a drag link with the ball joint crimped at the steering arm end to eliminate any chance of rotation resulting in interference. I cut mine out, put a new ball joint in and welded it back together, a $50 fix rather than a $1000 fix. All other ball joints are easily removed. Ok I went back to look and take pictures. The BJ below the steering box(front end)on that steering arm is held into place with a clamp. The other end is crimped on yes. That’s the one that needs repair. I have some welding experience and I suppose what you may have done is removed the arm and get it on a table, clock the position of the old BJ before removing and grind down thru the crimps to be able to drive the old BJ out. Insert the new BJ to match the clocked position of the old and then fill weld back thru the crimps that were ground away. Possibly enlarging the fill weld areas of the crimps before welding if needed. There are probably more crimps than I can see around that arm. This long arm is that called the Drag Link? Todd Edited December 5, 2021 by tmw188 Additional info Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StellaTariche Posted December 5, 2021 Share Posted December 5, 2021 Clarification about "Never remove the steering wheel" I meant "there is no need to remove it to re-center your steering wheel" :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmw188 Posted December 5, 2021 Author Share Posted December 5, 2021 (edited) I see in this picture there are many more crimps as I suspected, so a little more work to get loose and to remove but more places to fill weld. I’m guessing maybe 4-5 rows of four crimps. Edited December 5, 2021 by tmw188 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StellaTariche Posted December 5, 2021 Share Posted December 5, 2021 Hi Todd, If you know a machine shop, perhaps they could take the replacement ball joint and create an internally threaded sleeve for you. It should not be an expensive piece to make. Welding the threaded sleeve into the original crimped area will fix the ball joint problem AND allow you to adjust the length of the drag link, which is critical to getting the rig to track straight, and for removing lash (play) in the steering. Plus, if needed in the future, you can replace the ball joint again. - John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmw188 Posted December 5, 2021 Author Share Posted December 5, 2021 4 minutes ago, StellaTariche said: Hi Todd, If you know a machine shop, perhaps they could take the replacement ball joint and create an internally threaded sleeve for you. It should not be an expensive piece to make. Welding the threaded sleeve into the original crimped area will fix the ball joint problem AND allow you to adjust the length of the drag link, which is critical to getting the rig to track straight, and for removing lash (play) in the steering. Plus, if needed in the future, you can replace the ball joint again. - John Not a bad idea, however finding a threaded BJ to screw into it could be a problem. The other end of the drag link allows for adjusting based on the clamp holding it. I don’t think there is clearance on the end in question to slot and clamp it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hypoxia Posted December 5, 2021 Share Posted December 5, 2021 14 minutes ago, StellaTariche said: Hi Todd, If you know a machine shop, perhaps they could take the replacement ball joint and create an internally threaded sleeve for you. It should not be an expensive piece to make. Welding the threaded sleeve into the original crimped area will fix the ball joint problem AND allow you to adjust the length of the drag link, which is critical to getting the rig to track straight, and for removing lash (play) in the steering. Plus, if needed in the future, you can replace the ball joint again. - John That is a good idea. I would have done that except there was a long turn around time at all of the machine shops I checked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmw188 Posted December 5, 2021 Author Share Posted December 5, 2021 But still you would have to have a threaded BJ, unless they come threaded and the steering gear company had to crimp it on. I don’t think I have the time to pull this together other than maybe the new boot if available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmw188 Posted December 6, 2021 Author Share Posted December 6, 2021 (edited) So I was told by my brother he’s a retired career auto mechanic, that is not really a ball joint as I keep calling it, it’s more like a tie rod end and I should be able to get that to come out pretty easily without a press or maybe a fork or just wack the part it’s pushed up into and tap down on the nut. He doubts very much that I can buy that by itself and do what I was proposing to possibly do? It’s just a non serviceable end. If I can find a dust cup or boot as I’m calling it, that it might be my only option other than replacing the drag link. Edited December 6, 2021 by tmw188 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivan K Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 If all you need is the dust boot and can't find it locally, I got mine from Howard Smith Equipment Services Inc, MS. Took only 2 days to have it in TX. Just give them the dimensions, they were good to deal with few years back. (228) 863-4655 I got this contact from the great Bill Groves back then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmw188 Posted December 6, 2021 Author Share Posted December 6, 2021 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Ivan K said: If all you need is the dust boot and can't find it locally, I got mine from Howard Smith Equipment Services Inc, MS. Took only 2 days to have it in TX. Just give them the dimensions, they were good to deal with few years back. (228) 863-4655 I got this contact from the great Bill Groves back then. That’s what I’m going to do either from your source or the one listed above. Energy Suspension Boot. Thank you both for those sources I’ll get back when resolved. I don’t believe the tie rod ball and socket is bad. Edited December 6, 2021 by tmw188 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmw188 Posted December 6, 2021 Author Share Posted December 6, 2021 21 hours ago, Ivan K said: If all you need is the dust boot and can't find it locally, I got mine from Howard Smith Equipment Services Inc, MS. Took only 2 days to have it in TX. Just give them the dimensions, they were good to deal with few years back. (228) 863-4655 I got this contact from the great Bill Groves back then. Thanks for the suggestion. I need to get it dropped from the steering knuckle to get some measurements. On 12/5/2021 at 7:28 AM, Hypoxia said: What axle do you have? My coach has a Spicer E1462W so I go to the Spicer manual to find parts. There should be a tag on the axle or your Monaco build sheet may have it, mine does. If a boot is torn but no damage to the ball joint you can replace the boot, just pop the ball joint loose for access. The drag link is a specific length with specific bends to make sure there is no interference when moving through its whole range of movement. Monaco installed a drag link with the ball joint crimped at the steering arm end to eliminate any chance of rotation resulting in interference. I cut mine out, put a new ball joint in and welded it back together, a $50 fix rather than a $1000 fix. All other ball joints are easily removed. A tag on the front axle? On 12/5/2021 at 7:52 AM, tmw188 said: Not sure on the brand I’ll look into that. So that long arm running up to the steering box is the drag link? Yes it has a offset bent into it. I thought it appeared the ball joint threaded onto it and maybe clamped? Maybe that’s were your saying it’s crimped? It doesn’t have a rubber boot but appears to be plastic. I have a good large truck center that will probably suggest that if it’s possible. So what I thought appeared to be plastic not rubber, was actually the old hardened rubber boot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmw188 Posted December 9, 2021 Author Share Posted December 9, 2021 On 12/4/2021 at 8:19 PM, Rick A said: Call Roadmaster. They are totally awesome! I’ll need call RM to get a torque value on the castle nut on the tie rod end. Unless someone has that info? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now