BATTERY DISCONNECT SWITCH (salesman switch)

[rambler07]

Looking for photos of salesman switch before and after wiring changes

[Gary M]

If u mean bypassing solenoid, here mine.

[Dennis H]

Gary, is that purple wire disconnected and taped? Hard to tell from the picture. Thanks ..Dennis

[Gary M]

Just now, Dennis H said:

Gary, is that purple wire disconnected and taped? Hard to tell from the picture. Thanks ..Dennis

Taped. As far as I know it goes back to salesman rocker switch.

[Bob Nodine]

3 hours ago, Gary M said:

Taped. As far as I know it goes back to salesman rocker switch.

That is correct. It is not to be confused with the much talked about purple wire that goes back to the battery compartment to energize the contactor that connects the two battery banks together.

 

[RobertL]

Here is a link to changing the salesman switch to a zero draw solenoid. The original salesman solenoid drew 3 amps of current to hold the switch on. There are further explanations on the other electrical systems as well.

Https://safaritoonces.org

Edited April 4, 2020 by robert.lewis.tl@gmail.com
Spelling error

[Gary M]

7 hours ago, Bob Nodine said:

That is correct. It is not to be confused with the much talked about purple wire that goes back to the battery compartment to energize the contactor that connects the two battery banks together.

 

Thank you for that confirmation.

[saflyer]

8 hours ago, robert.lewis.tl@gmail.com said:

Here is a link to changing the salesman switch to a zero draw solenoid. The original salesman solenoid drew 3 amps of current to hold the switch on. There are further explanations on the other electrical systems as well.

Https://safaritoonces.org

I’ll have to check my salesman switch solenoid to find out the type.  You say they draw about 3 amps just to remain closed.  I’ve tested my parasite draw and believe my coach draws less than 14 aH per day so only about .6 amp total for the coach. That would imply my salesman switch solenoid is drawing near 0 so wonder if there is any reason to replace it with the Intellitec  0 draw solenoid.  If not might I just jump the dash switch to remove the problem of it accidentally being turned off?  It’s a bit of an odd switch without very good tactile feed back as to it’s position.  For my occasional boondocking I’d like to get my parasite load as small as possible.

Ed

 ’05 Holiday Rambler Ambassador

[RobertL]

The Intellitec switch is a momentary flip flop bat that toggles and draws no current once in place. A momentary switch is used to toggle the state. My original salesman switch was on / off. All large solenoids draw amps of current to pull in and hold the plunger and spring contact. I measured the draw on mine with a meter at 3A. If your system is not drawing current when the switch is on you might have a switch similar to the intellitec. If the quiescent current reads  near zero it will depend on how the quiescent state was established for the power monitering device. On my system the monitor had to be calibrated for zero. I agree about the parasitic load, that was why I changed mine but you may not need to. A  current meter in series on the sense lines will tell the real draw.

Edited April 5, 2020 by robert.lewis.tl@gmail.com
Spelling

[Dr4Film]

22 hours ago, robert.lewis.tl@gmail.com said:

Here is a link to changing the salesman switch to a zero draw solenoid. The original salesman solenoid drew 3 amps of current to hold the switch on. There are further explanations on the other electrical systems as well.

Https://safaritoonces.org

That Latching Solenoid requires a completely different type of switch and wiring for it to work versus the original wiring and switch that are used for the Continuous Duty type solenoid.

[RobertL]

Yes you are correct, this is not just a change of one solenoid for another. That is why I posted the link to the menu of projects. Here is the link to the specific project, the first link was to the menu of Projects but I noticed that the title didn't include the words "salesman switch" so it might be overlooked. Because the project was just a simple wiring change I included  it as part of another project. But I will add it as a project with the parts and wiring diagram later today, failing anything unforseen.  

https://safaritoonces.org/project-tree-branches/repairs/branches-repairs-electrical-2/upgrading-the-house-solenoid-and-echo-charger/

Edited April 5, 2020 by robert.lewis.tl@gmail.com
clarification

[saflyer]

10 hours ago, robert.lewis.tl@gmail.com said:

Yes you are correct, this is not just a change of one solenoid for another. That is why I posted the link to the menu of projects. Here is the link to the specific project, the first link was to the menu of Projects but I noticed that the title didn't include the words "salesman switch" so it might be overlooked. Because the project was just a simple wiring change I included  it as part of another project. But I will add it as a project with the parts and wiring diagram later today, failing anything unforseen.  

https://safaritoonces.org/project-tree-branches/repairs/branches-repairs-electrical-2/upgrading-the-house-solenoid-and-echo-charger/

Thanks Robert.  Looking forward to the post.  I don’t know if what Gary M did with just eliminating the solenoid or replacing it with another is best.  My goal is to eliminate the salesman switch and the high draw solenoid.  I don’t think I need a salesman switch at all.  Am I correct?

[Gary M]

2 hours ago, saflyer said:

Thanks Robert.  Looking forward to the post.  I don’t know if what Gary M did with just eliminating the solenoid or replacing it with another is best.  My goal is to eliminate the salesman switch and the high draw solenoid.  I don’t think I need a salesman switch at all.  Am I correct?

I just eliminated and plan to use that switch to run some LED outside accent lighting.

[saflyer]

On 4/5/2020 at 2:02 AM, robert.lewis.tl@gmail.com said:

The Intellitec switch is a momentary flip flop bat that toggles and draws no current once in place. A momentary switch is used to toggle the state. My original salesman switch was on / off. All large solenoids draw amps of current to pull in and hold the plunger and spring contact. I measured the draw on mine with a meter at 3A. If your system is not drawing current when the switch is on you might have a switch similar to the intellitec. If the quiescent current reads  near zero it will depend on how the quiescent state was established for the power monitering device. On my system the monitor had to be calibrated for zero. I agree about the parasitic load, that was why I changed mine but you may not need to. A  current meter in series on the sense lines will tell the real draw.

I have a KIB LR9806 relay.  A site I found says “The KIB LR9806 Battery Disconnect Latching Relay is a single-pulse latching relay. It only requires a short "pulse" of voltage to activate or deactivate the relay.”  
 

So does that mean zero battery draw to hold it in either the open or cLosed position?  If so I don’t need to do anything.

Curiosity question.  What is the difference between a relay and a solenoid?

Edited April 9, 2020 by saflyer

[RobertL]

Yes, it sounds like you have a toggle solenoid similar to the one I used. You won't need to change this to reduce the on current, it is momentary. A solenoid is a open or close path, like a wall light switch. Some maintain the pass thru position by pulling a spring contact closed with power that produces a magnetic field to hold the contact closed ( or open depending on the design and requirement). If you remove the power then the, spring retracts the contact a n d the path is broken, hence the term disconnect switch. The fail/safe powered state is normally open or no path. A relay can be exactly the same but usually is much lower current because it it has contacts like the points in a old car distributor ( old...  as in pre 1970). Relays often have multiple paths and contacts. Solenoids can conduct 300 - 500 amps thru the large contacts or more, whereas relays are typically under 30 amps. 

[saflyer]

Thanks Robert.

[wamcneil]

On 4/9/2020 at 10:54 AM, saflyer said:

I have a KIB LR9806 relay.  A site I found says “The KIB LR9806 Battery Disconnect Latching Relay is a single-pulse latching relay. It only requires a short "pulse" of voltage to activate or deactivate the relay.”  
 

So does that mean zero battery draw to hold it in either the open or cLosed position?  If so I don’t need to do anything.

Curiosity question.  What is the difference between a relay and a solenoid?

My rig has a latching relay AND a conventional solenoid. The salesman switch is momentary contact that causes the latching relay to toggle state. The latching relay’s output feeds one branch of house loads and also feeds the conventional solenoid to keep it closed to feed the other branch of house loads. 
The latching relay uses no current to stay closed, but the conventional relay draws about 700 mA

Cheers

Walter