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Manual slide retraction


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Motorhome is a 2009 Monaco Camelot 42 PDQ. The pump for the two front slides has quit working, I do believe it is a bad solenoid causing the issue. My manual states to open one control valve on the pump, remove cover to expose pump shaft , place 1/4" drive bit into end of said shaft and rotate counter clockwise with a cordless drill to retract slide, close the first control valve and repeat for other slide. When I removed the cover to expose the pump shaft I discovered that mine is equipped with a 1/2 " nut threaded on the shaft (no 1/4" socket for a bit). Well we all know what happens when you turn a nut on a shaft counter clockwise, it just spins off. After a couple of attempts to secure the nut with red loctite, I finally used JB weld to secure the nut and now have both slides retracted. Hope I never have to rebuild the pump.

Now after that rant here is my question. Will operating the pump manually in the clockwise direction with cordless drill and control valve open extend the slides?

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40 minutes ago, JBMB1212 said:

 Will operating the pump manually in the clockwise direction with cordless drill and control valve open extend the slides?

"Probably" . . . . 😁

Instead of JB Weld maybe a second nut jammed onto the first nut. 

Red Loctite should have held - 750 ft lb strength if I remember right (on larger nuts).  Not recommended for anything you might want to remove later without getting  a torch on it. 

Let us know how it works out.

- bob

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Thanks guys

cbr046   thought about a second nut, not enough threads for one

 

Frank   That is my plan but slides were not fully extended so not sealed and rain was coming

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All three of my pump motors had the 1/4 drive. Even my spare motor has the 1/4 drive. Never have seen one with a nut. Learn something new every day.

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There are some members here who know a lot about your particular system. Can't reverse pump direction in a complex hydraulic system. If I had your system I would want to know if the spools are closed center or open center. Generally should know if one is going to manually operate a hydraulic system without possibly causing excessive high pressure. If the problem was the solenoid I would have jumped around it with a battery cable after I made sure the spool was in the correct position either manually or if no manual option with a jumper. Or using the control valve as you did. If the spools are open center then you can make that selection after the pump is started.

Edited by Gary Cole
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19 hours ago, JBMB1212 said:

Motorhome is a 2009 Monaco Camelot 42 PDQ. The pump for the two front slides has quit working, I do believe it is a bad solenoid causing the issue. My manual states to open one control valve on the pump, remove cover to expose pump shaft , place 1/4" drive bit into end of said shaft and rotate counter clockwise with a cordless drill to retract slide, close the first control valve and repeat for other slide. When I removed the cover to expose the pump shaft I discovered that mine is equipped with a 1/2 " nut threaded on the shaft (no 1/4" socket for a bit). Well we all know what happens when you turn a nut on a shaft counter clockwise, it just spins off. After a couple of attempts to secure the nut with red loctite, I finally used JB weld to secure the nut and now have both slides retracted. Hope I never have to rebuild the pump.

Now after that rant here is my question. Will operating the pump manually in the clockwise direction with cordless drill and control valve open extend the slides?

Been THERE....DONE THAT....

Fortunately, mine worked.  I pulled off the over plate.  Our OEM pumps only run ONE DIRECTION. We have NO reversing Solenoid.  As BEST, I can NOODLE out in my Non Hydraulic Thinking Brain...The two allen screw valves are separated.  One is for the MAIN or the Big, Long Refrigerator Slide.  The OTHER is for the shorter one.

Here is a link to my really long post....I have had slide issues for YEARS and there is an electrical gremlin in the line from the 200 Amp ANL fuse to the front. The 150 Amp resettable CB is way oversized.  You will have to read my ramblings....but I DO offer some thoughts so scroll down after you go to the link and read it....

I ASSUMED that since there is only ONE SOLENOID....that the motor always has to TURN in that direction.  Now...how does it extend...My ONLY LOGIC...it is in the valves....or the "solenoids".  The pump will run either way....and on the majority of the Lippert systems, there is a REVERSING SOLENOID.  Our don't have one.  SO...the hex valve has to be OPENED....and then, instead of the electric valves reversing, you run the pump backwards.  I hope that makes sense...

OK...As to your quandary....this is what I would do before I went crazy.  And THIS is based on a LOT of posts and helping out a LOT of other folks....as well as fusing and fuming with mine.

STOP...Disconnect the Solenoid to Motor Cable.  That is that puny little #6 or so cable at the bottom.  I'm going to recommend a bit of PREVENTATIVE MAINTENANCE....takes only a few minutes.

Remove BOTH motor leads....the one from the solenoid and the ground...from the motor. Do some cleaning with contact cleaner. NOW, using a small wrench, tighten snuggly the NUTS on the Motor Studs.  These back out and will be high resistance and KILL the motor...I have the perfect storm of loose studs and a high resistance upstream connection and burned mine out.

OK...with all that disconnected, have someone OPERATE a slide....it doesn't matter which....you will be able to hear, or it you are outside with your head tucked in, feel or hear the solenoid. If it don't go CLICK....STOP.

I included a wiring diagram for all the systems in the other post. I can't remember WHICH side of the solenoid is grounded.  Use your Continuity tester and find that one.  The other side is the CONTROL signal. The "slide control" harness is actually a diode matrix and it takes the place of a purchases or relay controlled controller.  A MONACO COST REDUCTION IDEA...

Not knowing your electrical skills, I am NOT talking down to you...  BUT, it works this way.  There is ONLY ONE power lead to the two control buttons. On ours, there is a Lockout Solenoid, so the slides can NOT operate if the ignition switch is in the RUN position. That is UPSTREAM of the buttons.  The buttons are Double Throw, Single Pole, Center OFF, momentary contact switches. SO...you have to HOLD in the switch. When you hold in one of the switches, there is a diode logic that lets it give power to the SOLENOID.  It also powers one of the two solenoids above the 1/4" Hex valves. Folks have bought new pump systems and STILL not fixed the problem. 

I ASSUME that both the slides do NOT work....but, I would verify that the circuit is working before I put on a new solenoid.  Here is HOW to do that...

After you determine the CONTROL or the Positive going to the Solenoid, put a meter lead on it. THEN have someone push each slide switch....in each direction. IF you get 12 VDC....BINGO....the switches work and the Diode Matrix works....as there HAS to be a signal to the Solenoid...  SO...you are pretty safe in replacing the solenoid.

You can be a big spender and get if for $26 on Amazon.  If you have a large ratchetting cable crimper and cable, you can order a "universal" one for around $15....and then mount it somewhere near the unit and cut and make your own cables and run them....  I ordered one to see if my issue was a worn or high resistance set of contacts....but then I kept trouble shooting and realized my motor was toast.  This is the OEM solenoid that Lippert uses....and it is a plug and play.  PERSONALLY, I would get a replacement cable for that chincy one that Lippert used....I did that on my NEW pump....  

Trombetta 684-1211-212-06

I actually had it as a spare  If you put that in Amazon....about a dozen will pop up from $24.99 to $75.xx....so it is out there and is in stock. 

That should get you going.  NOW....here is something, if you are curious....and I started to do it....Take a test lead or a piece of wire and bypass the solenoid and get a quick "jolt of 12 VDC" to the motor.  Watch the nut spin and verify the direction.  MY GUT tells me ClockWise....but you need to know that.  That way, you KNOW if the solenoid was working....that is the direction the motor will spin. 

SO....if you are a curious cuss....you can YELL to your assistant...or have two cellphones. Tell the assistant to EXTEND...doesn't matter which....then, with you drill set in the PROPER DIRECTION...and ONE THE NUT....RUN THE DRILL.  The motor will be running, powered by the drill....the slide will run SLOW....but it should MOVE.  THEN, you stop and reverse the slide.  BINGO, you have, I think, tested the valves as well.  Repeat for the other slide...just bump them in and out....  That way, you KNOW you totally isolated the issue.

NOW....I have to ask this....did you verify that the stupid 150- Amp Resettable Circuit Breaker in the Front Run Bay on the lower left is NOT TRIPPED. That is SUPPOSED to trip to prevent an operload.

If you got anything from my long OTHER post....that Solenoid SHOULD have been an 80 Amp one.  Amazon sells them.  I still, even with my NEW pump, had intermittent issues with the original FEED. I carry a 100 Amp spare....as that gives some protection. I would URGE you to replace that Breaker with either an 80 or a 100....that will save the motor.

I also assume that you KNOW....and if NOT, this a learning experience, that the OEM hydraulic tank is hanging out like a cantilevered loaf of bread.  That ASSUMES you have the OEM system...and that post has pictures.  If someone has NOT fabricated a brace with a foam (HVAC tape works) pad and attached it to the frame to support the end of the tank....I would do that IMMEDIATELY.  I have been moderating since 2009 and that dangling pump reservoir is the main failure. The diode bridge and the Trombetti solenoid are next....and then, MINE....which was a bugger to figure out....

If you EVER have an issue, a SPARE cable to the Resettable Circuit Breaker from the CHASSIS Stud on the large PCB in the FRB is a life saver. I have a permanent one with a selector switch for the slide.  I now run my slides off the Chassis ....

Good Luck....and if you know are aware of all the above....it was not meant as "talking down to you".  I have had countless folks call me about the slides after reading of my "hands on FRUSTRATAION" and I still learn things.

Good Luck....

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