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2000 Signature Alternator issues after replacement.


engine103

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1 hour ago, myrontruex said:

Yes,

But there has always been some "Mystique" about battery isolators and "Big Boys" (actually there is a Trombetta as well as the Intellitec that get called BIG BOY).  Monaco evolved from the early 2000's and had all sorts of ways to get Bi-Directional charging.  We have had so much posted here and each MH was really unique.  We have found, actual photographs, of a mid year change in how the charging systems worked.  Intellitec first came out with the BIRD Module....and used it....and then when the BIRD II came out....that was the defacto standard. BUT, the BIRD II was not wired per the Intellitec prints and the Genny ON lead was used in some Windsors and others....then abandoned....Mine has NO GENNY wire going to the BIRD II module.  My Camelot was the final "version using the Intellitec Big Boy (200A) and the BIRD II module.

The Cole Hersee looks like a similar product, but is 200A. OK....the 200A is the same as the Big Boy. The Amazon ratings have low marks for Tech Support on Cole Hersee.  I can tell you first hand....that during Covid and "after" Covid, I got a real person from Blue Seas on the phone without a hour wait....and they were GOOD.  as I  wanted confirmation on how I was installing the Blue Seas multi-battery switch worked and such....and then later on, a simple one.  That is unusual today.

I would also say that having a 500 Amp switch is great....  IN MY CASE>>>>NOT MAYBE ALL....  My BIg Boy is only 200 Amps, but Monaco used 4/0 cable, short runs....maybe less than 2 feet, between the Chassis and House Battery Buss.  So, having 2.5 TIMES the capacity could well be the difference in being able to get a quick boost from the house to the chassis. BUT, also, if you followed the protocol of holding in the Battery Boost to put a surface charge on the Chassis, you get a whole lot more current flow. I also know, from mine and several others at the ABQ balloon festival that sometimes the Big Boy will not let you start the Genny, even if you have enough House power to activate the solenoid from the boost switch.  SO, from a circuit or "Robust Design" (one of the late Mr. Groves' favorite phrases), I would go with the Blue Seas.

The main use, from reading the Amazon ratings is for an auxillary battery on a Diesel pick up.... From Amazon's questions and rating....no hits for MotorHome or Motor Home...except one for a truck. There was an issue a few years ago and a bunch of failures.  Current ratings seem OK.  But "Size DOES, to me, matter"....

Again....my call....my MH....my $$'s....  but it might be a good replacement....just smaller.  Don't know about the electronics and such....as to "how it senses" based on reading the tech sheet from the Cole Hersee sheet.  

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One more thing, I fully intend to go the Blue Sea ML-ACR route but in the meantime, I have a new isolator that has been sitting on my shelf for a few years and the question is if I undo the jumpers on the old isolator and install the new one, would it function as it should with the new alternator that I now have?

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2 hours ago, engine103 said:

One more thing, I fully intend to go the Blue Sea ML-ACR route but in the meantime, I have a new isolator that has been sitting on my shelf for a few years and the question is if I undo the jumpers on the old isolator and install the new one, would it function as it should with the new alternator that I now have?

Yes, most likely but you probably have to use one of the jumpers. The alternator should sense the engine battery voltage and with the isolator in place it will not see that voltage. So install the new isolator and leave the jumper in place that connects to the engine batteries.

 

Test the voltages on each bank with the engine running. I think your voltage on the engine battery will be around 14 volts or a little higher and you should see about a .7 volt drop on the coach batteries do to the diodes in the isolator.

Your boost function should work after this change and seeing that you have an Amp-L-Start device you should be getting engine battery charging while on shoreline or generator.

If your systems are functioning at that point I see no reason to add any other components or changes. 

 

Edited by myrontruex
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Purely my opinion, and it will be short.

1) IF you have a DUVAC alternator fail, and are determined to stick with your original system, have your alternator rebuilt.  DO NOT, EVER, UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES allow a substitute alternator to be installed.  Not one tech in 100 understands DUVAC. 

2) IF you have a DUVAC setup, sooner or later either the alternator will fail, or the Solid State Isolator (big blue thing with fins) will fail, or the Lambert Charger will fail...just a matter of time.  Unless you understand enough to make the repairs yourself, you will be faced with a HUGE repair bill and your system will probably still NOT WORK.  Be proactive and replace the alternator with a garden-variety Delco and install the ML-ACR.  The manufacturer (Blue Sea) says on its website and on the literature that comes with the ML-ACR "We stand behind this device for as long as you own it."  PERIOD.  If your DUVAC alternator is still functioning, STILL install the ML-ACR.  The device is cheap enough for you to carry a spare, although I have yet to hear of a failure--hence Blue Sea's "no quibble" guarantee.  I switched to ML-ACR, but still have my original DUVAC alternator, simply because it has not failed.  When it does, it will be replaced with an easily-sourced Delco for half the price of the DUVAC unit.  The ML-ACR renders the Lambert Charger unnecessary. 

3) INSTALL THE REMOTE SWITCH FOR THE ML-ACR!

4) IF you have a BIRD or IRD system controlled by electronics and it fails, don't attempt to fix it...bypass it.  Install the ML-ACR.   It is such a simple, robust device which allows manual control at the device itself, should you foolishly choose not to install the remote switch.

Good luck with solving your problems!  Myron is a 12VDC wizard.  Listen to him.

This is not the device I ordered, but very similar.  I have found it to be invaluable, especially for smaller (10AWG to 22AWG) stranded wires which are going to be crimped into a buss bar or barrier terminal strip.  They prevent the strands from becoming separated.

 

440 Pieces Wire Ferrules Kits Ferrules Wire Ends Terminals Crimp Terminal Connector Sleeves AWG (2/0 1/0 2 4 10 12 14 16): AmazonSmile: Industrial & Scientific

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X2 on VanWill recommends along with others on this forum.   Cumulative years of experience (and wisdom) has got to count toward something😀

Back in ~2012 my alternator failed.  Luckily I was at home.  I got the name of a shop that rebuilt alternators and took it to them, they turned it around in 24 hours, cost $185.

I had several phone calls with Van about the MLR-AC swap, so when my Lambert maintainer started to act up I didn't hesitate to install the BlueSea.  It has also worked flawlessly.  Although the switch isn't necessary I'd highly recommend installing it.  I like driving down the road and being able to see the lights lite indicating that it is latched. 

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19 hours ago, vanwill52 said:

 

4) IF you have a BIRD or IRD system controlled by electronics and it fails, don't attempt to fix it...bypass it.  Install the ML-ACR.   It is such a simple, robust device which allows manual control at the device itself, should you foolishly choose not to install the remote switch.

 

Could you please give me some detailed info on how you "bypass" the BIRD.  What did you do with the wiring connected to the BIRD?  That's the one thing keeping me from installing the ML-ACR.  Thanks

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6 minutes ago, veraken said:

Could you please give me some detailed info on how you "bypass" the BIRD.  What did you do with the wiring connected to the BIRD?  That's the one thing keeping me from installing the ML-ACR.  Thanks

Here is a post from last year the P Whittle did on his install, not sure if it answers all your questions but its a start

My system was a little different as I had a BIRD, Lambert 415 maintainer, and an isolation relay.

I completely removed all three of these, installed the Bluesea ML-ACR where the isolation relay was.  Attached chassis cable to one side and the house to the other.  At that point the Bluesea was operational but I wanted to add the switch on the dash so I had to run a wire front to back and utilize the two small wires that had been on the isolation relay to wire in the remote switch.  Took me longer to run the wire then to wire in the switch.  The switch replaced the auxillary boost/start switch and lets you control the Bluesea remotely including the boost function.

 

 

Blue Sea ML-ARC.jpg

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