Step cover operation while parked

[96 EVO]

Well, I've found Monaco owners manuals in about the '08 year are like a sci-fi novel!

'You may have this, you may not'. 'It may be filled with this fluid, it may be something else'. 'This filter may be mounted here, or, somewhere else in the coach'.

I'm thinking the manual writers had happy hour every day, and just copy and pasted what they wrote in 2001.

Edited November 19, 2022 by 96 EVO

[Gary M]

4 minutes ago, Steve P said:

Thanks gents.   This is crazy.  I'll check for the FRB relays tomorrow.  I'm not really clear where the coil would be or what it looks like, but I will follow wires.   I have no clue whether this is air or electric (the 2008 Knight OM says air).  Like Tom says, there is no obvious way to remove the step cover.  Pressing and holding EXT clunks, but nothing moves.   I have a tiled floor above it.  My generator is not on a slide, so there's no getting behind it.  Unless there is an access cover buried underneath, I'm not going to get to the mechanism until I can get it to extend.  This is nuts.  I may buy a rubber mallet tomorrow and see if vibration helps (after the relays and coil checks).  I may even pull up the jacks a week early, crank 'er up and air up the system to see if that resolves the issue.  This  is really bugging me...

The power for the electric version goes in at the back of the box enclosure on passenger side. My gent doesn’t slide either. I also have tile over the boxed in area. I was able to remove front carpeted plate that u see as u walk into coach. Then there are but a couple of screws holding the whole unit in.

PS: What page in your manual says it’s air operated?

[Steve P]

P. 181 describing dash switches...

 The 1st paragraph says "Step Cover: Extends and retracts the step cover. "

Then there is a paragraph indented that says "Warning:  Step well cover is under air pressure. When operating the step well cover be sure there are not pets shoes or other obstructions in the stepwell area. Do not operate the step well cover while standing in the step wall area."

There is also a paragraph immediately following that says "The sliding step well cover is extended and retracted at 2 switch locations. The other switch is located at the driver console. Power comes from the house batteries and requires the battery cut off switch to be on.

[Tom Cherry]

25 minutes ago, Steve P said:

P. 181 describing dash switches...

 The 1st paragraph says "Step Cover: Extends and retracts the step cover. "

Then there is a paragraph indented that says "Warning:  Step well cover is under air pressure. When operating the step well cover be sure there are not pets shoes or other obstructions in the stepwell area. Do not operate the step well cover while standing in the step wall area."

There is also a paragraph immediately following that says "The sliding step well cover is extended and retracted at 2 switch locations. The other switch is located at the driver console. Power comes from the house batteries and requires the battery cut off switch to be on.

Welcome to the world of Monaco.  I went back and can NOT find the 2008 Camelot prints. I also went back and pulled the older "Combo" Camelot and Windsor Prints. NO JOY. I did pull down several IRV2 posts and specifically LOOKED for the type. There are several out there.  

OK....your manual is a "Document written by dumb folks that need to get out on the line more.....they don't know what is being used or going on".  That was a quote by two separate Monaco Tech support folks.  One PRE Bankruptcy and another after Navistar bought them and brought back in as many old Monaco employees as they could. I was on a first name basis with "Jim", one of the senior techs.....and he was not exactly a fan of the "Tech writers".

SO....let's go with what we know.  If the Mechanism is locked or inoperatble, and you hold down the switch....you get a CLUNK or the sound of a motor trying to engage the "X Frame" mechanism and it will not budge. There are a few reasons why....

The motor is getting weak and does not have enough torque to move it.  

The contacts on the relays are burned or pitted or the coil on the relay is bad

There is play or loose screws or lack of lubrication on the lead screw and the motor will not overcome it.

All I can tell you with CERTAINITY....  The older Camelot prints have a STEP MOTOR WIRE on the switches NOT a Solenoid (as in Air Operated).  NOW, does your prints have that?  Do you have prints in the rear of your manual?  I don't know the answer to that....  In 2009 or maybe 2008, Monaco switched to Electronic Prints and quit including the prints in the back of the owner's manual.  If you have prints in the back of yours, then look through them and find the STEP COVER drawing or a Print that has the Step Cover Switch on it.  Look at the labels.  IF the labels say MOTOR, then obviously the owner's manual is wrong.  

The OTHER thing....think back.  When the step worked, did you hear a MOTOR running and when it reached the fully extended position, did the step "Lift UP" and was flush then?  Same for retraction, if you retracted it, then it would drop down and then start to move or retract. That is how the MOTOR operated system works.

I can tell you to try this....  PUSH INWARD....as in trying to push the steps INTO the retracted position.  That is done from the lip or the carpeted lip or piece that sticks down.  That is the piece that is maybe 4" high.  I have actually taken my hand and use the heel of it and banged on it.  Never used a rubber mallet.  You can do that while someone holds in the switch to the RETRACT SIDE.  It might CLUNK and if you hit it a few times and keep cycling the motor, you will get it out of its bind. 

THEN, the next thing is to extend it. The issue with that is if it gets stuck OUT....and that is why I took mine to a tech.  BUT, I did find out that once it got running, it would cycle OK.  So, if you run it out for a foot or so....then stop.....run it back in.  Then when you want to extend it, you have to hold the switch down for what seems like an eternity....but it moves.  That is the way it works as it gets older....folks here say the same thing as does my Tech.

Bottom line, it is a PITA to pull out the mechanism and most techs will work from the bottom and tighten up the drawer slide (just like all over the MH) and lube the lead screws and the nut.

Past that, I can't offer any assistance.  BUT, if you get it moving or EXTENDED, I would STOP it about 3 or 4 inches OUT....and then take it in for service. That way the Tech will have a better shot at working with it and getting it moving.  Pulling it out is usually the last resort....but some folks did that so they could do a thorough inspection and tightening and such.

As far as the relays go.  MINE are not on the boards.  They are in the upper Left corner.  There is a pigtail with a black socket at the end.  The Socket has the label - Hand written and it will say something like STEP or COVER or Extend or maybe TL or whatever.  Mine are sort of bundled up and hard to get to, but once you see them, you start to lightly push the relay from side to side to get it out.  Sometimes you need a thin screwdriver blade or a knife blade to separate the relay from the socket....then you wiggle it from side to side or back and forth and keep pulling down.

The CLUNK as you call it, to me, is the dead giveaway....you have a MOTOR....and if you put in new relays or swap them from side to side, if there was an issue, it might fix it. Unfortunately, I believe that your steps are in a bind....and only driving might vibrate the mechanism a little...

That's as much as I can add....and the key is....DID YOU HEAR A MOTOR RUNNING BEFORE....if so, then the manual "is incorrect"...

[Steve P]

Tom & Gary & others  - thanks for your thorough and patient explanations.  My manual does not have any prints.  I got it online and had FedEx/Kinkos print and bind it.  Very handy.   I'm quite sure we used to hear a motor running, and believe the cover came out and up, like you describe.   I will be troubleshooting it today and will post the results. 

[Steve P]

Unbelievable!!... I pressed the switch in both retract and extend, then nudged each switch position a few times, then bumped the cover with my fist, then pressed and held the switch in each direction for a slow count to 20 and suddenly the cover started extending.  I went back and forth about 6 inches a few times and have left it extended about an inch to collect my wits, some tools, and some white lithium grease to tighten clean and lubricate the reluctant mechanism.  You guys are awesome!!   I would never have thought to do all the things you described.  Thanks soooo much!!!   I wil report again when done. 

After this, I've got to get a battery maintainer ordered for the MH to CR-V connection.  I'll be searching threads on that next.  😉

[96 EVO]

Did your key need to be on or off?

[Guest Ray Davis]

11 hours ago, Gary M said:

I was able to remove front carpeted plate that u see as u walk into coach. Then there are but a couple of screws holding the whole unit in.

Gary, that's the front panel I mentioned earlier.  How was you able to remove it?  

Tom, we have 2 members going by Stephen P.   Might be a little confusing sometimes especially if they end up on the same thread.

[Steve P]

41 minutes ago, Ray Davis said:

Tom, we have 2 members going by Stephen P.   Might be a little confusing sometimes especially if they end up on the same thread.

I'm going by Steve P

57 minutes ago, 96 EVO said:

Did your key need to be on or off?

The key was/is off

[Guest Ray Davis]

4 hours ago, Steve P said:

I'm going by Steve P

So sorry Steve, my bad.

[Tom Cherry]

7 hours ago, Steve P said:

Unbelievable!!... I pressed the switch in both retract and extend, then nudged each switch position a few times, then bumped the cover with my fist, then pressed and held the switch in each direction for a slow count to 20 and suddenly the cover started extending.  I went back and forth about 6 inches a few times and have left it extended about an inch to collect my wits, some tools, and some white lithium grease to tighten clean and lubricate the reluctant mechanism.  You guys are awesome!!   I would never have thought to do all the things you described.  Thanks soooo much!!!   I wil report again when done. 

After this, I've got to get a battery maintainer ordered for the MH to CR-V connection.  I'll be searching threads on that next.  😉

Wonderful.  Get a.good LED trouble light and assume you best Boa Constrictor Yoga pose.  Then extend it and crawl up under it.  Look for EVERY screw you can find,  if you can reach (LONG ARMS) the motor lead, then make sure it is TIGHT.  Lubricate the moving parts.  I don’t know about lithium or something like a spray Teflon lubricant like we use on guns.  If you use grease, then sparingly.  Clean off all the old and get rid of any debris,

It will be interning to see if it moves and responds quicker.  I would also have TWO Bosch Relays on hand.  If there is a contact issue, then you will have a lower voltage and less torque,  Also, I can’t remember whether yours is Key ON (in run) or no key.  If it is ignition, then run the engine.  That will give you about 1.5 VDC more, so it should run better.  Now that I think on it, when my wife uses it. We are driving,  BUT, I have it wired to the House.  BUT when we are driving and the Big Boy BIRD system is engaged, I’m getting 13.9 VDC as the House and Chassis are “connected”.

Maybe I outfoxed myself.  BUT, I can’t tell much difference when plugged in as the Magnum is high also.

GREAT you got it working!

[Gary M]

10 hours ago, Ray Davis said:

Gary, that's the front panel I mentioned earlier.  How was you able to remove it?  

Tom, we have 2 members going by Stephen P.   Might be a little confusing sometimes especially if they end up on the same thread.

Sorry for late response, on the road traveling. The front panel has I believe 4 screws on back side. They are short and I was able to remove it by force. Of course had to repair hole in ply to put back. The other option I have considered is to make a access panel where the motor is to rotate by hand when motor won’t rotate.

[Steve P]

I extended the step all the way out a couple of days ago, got my my lights out and got a good look at the underside.  I didn't tighten any screws or lubricate anything yet.  I want to avoid using any lubricant that might drip on the carpeted steps.  The other issue is contorting my body and the extended reach needed.  Still pondering...

[Gary M]

12 hours ago, Steve P said:

I extended the step all the way out a couple of days ago, got my my lights out and got a good look at the underside.  I didn't tighten any screws or lubricate anything yet.  I want to avoid using any lubricant that might drip on the carpeted steps.  The other issue is contorting my body and the extended reach needed.  Still pondering...

So if you were able to extend it, now u can remove I believe 4 small screws to remove the front plywood. Once that is folded back, there are more screws holding top plywood. Yes u have to be patient and a contortionist. I bought a 90 degree attachment for my mini drill to get them out. Now retract unit and remove 2-4 sheet metal screws holding complete unit in place. Oh! Unplug power!!! Mine came in from left side. As I pulled unit straight out, it maxed out to door frame before I could tilt up to remove unit. U can email me and I can help over the phone if need be.

[Steve P]

13 minutes ago, Gary M said:

So if you were able to extend it, now u can remove I believe 4 small screws to remove the front plywood. Once that is folded back, there are more screws holding top plywood. Yes u have to be patient and a contortionist. I bought a 90 degree attachment for my mini drill to get them out. Now retract unit and remove 2-4 sheet metal screws holding complete unit in place. Oh! Unplug power!!! Mine came in from left side. As I pulled unit straight out, it maxed out to door frame before I could tilt up to remove unit. U can email me and I can help over the phone if need be.

Gary - that's way more effort than I want to do.   I think I'll do the minimums with no removal -- lube the worm gear with Thetford slideout spray, tighten screws, check the contacts on the connector and clean, and call it a day.  Thanks for your help.  I will tuck away your tips for what may become phase 2.  Other readers of the thread will also find your info and details very useful.

Thanks again, 

Steve