Time to buy some batteries - Looking for input

[nvrtoofast]

My house bank of Lead acid batteries finally bit the dust. I've been searching for information on replacements and have seen a bit too much information. I think I'm going to limit my decision to cost. I don't really want to pay near $500 per battery.

I have a 2006 Camelot. It has 12v Lead Acid now. I would prefer to move to AGM but like I mentioned cost is a decision point.

I'm looking for your input on best band for value and place to buy. For the coach batteries I have a pair of 12V Napa truck batteries that I picked up on the road. They work for the coach.

Thoughts?

[timaz996]

I went with two 200 ah Lossigy lithium batteries last March and they have worked so well I added two more. They are $650 each on Amazon. Because they are LP04 you can pull them down to say 10% state of charge without hurting the battery. I dry camp more then 90% of the time, this is why I wen this route.

Tim

[CLIFF918]

Bryan,

I just re powered my house battery's with Vmax Tanks V6-225 6Volts 225AH Deep Cycle, High performance AGM Battery.

I have 4 in series/parallel = 450AH @12V 

https://www.vmaxtanks.com/

Have not put them to the test yet but should do fine.

I ordered through Wal Mart to get free shipping that's important due to the weight of battery.

I think they came to $1200 delivered

Cliff

[JDCrow]

X on VMax if you don’t want to go the lithium route (I did, new inverter, DC/DC charger etc)

 

I have the VMax on my boat for the trolling motor. They work great. Very well made 

[birdshill123]

If you are wanting wet cell ordinary 6 volts I would go with Costco. I have them in both of our motorhomes. Great price. They only have a one year warranty but Costco asks no questions and the replacement also comes with a one year warranty.

[Dwight Lindsey]

I took out my 4 lead acid 6v 100 amp hour batteries and replaced them with 3 206 amp hour Lithium Ion Phosphate batteries from SOK:

https://www.us.sokbattery.com/product-page/sok-12v-206ah-lifepo4-battery-bluetooth-built-in-heater

Just one of these will give you about the same useable amp hours as 4 100 amp hour lead acid batteries.  So while they are $1200 each, one of them is still less than the cost of the 4 trojan batteries I had previously.

With three of them, I have about 3 times the available amp hours that I had with the lead acid batteries.

I now run our coffee maker and microwave on the inverter (not at the same time) and still have battery power for several days.

FYI, if considering Lithium Ion Phosphate, do think about what temperatures you may encounter.  Charging LiPO batteries at low temperatures can kill them.  Therefore I bought (see link above) batteries with heaters that come on when the temperature is low.  They also have bluetooth, so you can see exactly the state of charge and charge rate.

Dwight

[JDCrow]

22 minutes ago, Dwight Lindsey said:

I took out my 4 lead acid 6v 100 amp hour batteries and replaced them with 3 206 amp hour Lithium Ion Phosphate batteries from SOK:

https://www.us.sokbattery.com/product-page/sok-12v-206ah-lifepo4-battery-bluetooth-built-in-heater

Just one of these will give you about the same useable amp hours as 4 100 amp hour lead acid batteries.  So while they are $1200 each, one of them is still less than the cost of the 4 trojan batteries I had previously.

With three of them, I have about 3 times the available amp hours that I had with the lead acid batteries.

I now run our coffee maker and microwave on the inverter (not at the same time) and still have battery power for several days.

FYI, if considering Lithium Ion Phosphate, do think about what temperatures you may encounter.  Charging LiPO batteries at low temperatures can kill them.  Therefore I bought (see link above) batteries with heaters that come on when the temperature is low.  They also have bluetooth, so you can see exactly the state of charge and charge rate.

Dwight

I bought the Chins version, with the heaters as well. 
 

Did you have to update your charger/inverter and run a Dc/Dc charger in line with your alternator? 

[Dwight Lindsey]

I did replace my MSW inverter with Pure Sine Wave.  I did that mostly because of a Fisher Paykel refrigerator install, which replaced the dead Norcold.

I have the DC to DC charger, but it's not installed yet.  At the moment, the alternator is only charging the chassis batteries

Dwight

[BRBowers]

Last June I was in the same situation. After looking around and doing a lot of research I decided on part # SLIGC2AGM SEASON ALL GROUP GC2 6V 220AH AGM DEEP CYCLE BATTERIES sold by Battery Plus. The cost was just under $300 per battery. So far they’ve been working perfectly since then. Any battery is a gamble, but the manager told me it’s their top selling battery. He had other brands more expensive but they sell a lot of these down here in Florida for Golf Carts. Just a thought. 
 

Bob

[Steven P]

I went with Trojan t105 AGM a couple years ago.  I wanted AGM bc I still work a lot and wanted as little maintenance and as much peace of mind  as possible.  I have really liked them.  You will need to adjust your inverter settings. Also, I don't boondock a lot. 

[Tom Cherry]

7 hours ago, nvrtoofast said:

My house bank of Lead acid batteries finally bit the dust. I've been searching for information on replacements and have seen a bit too much information. I think I'm going to limit my decision to cost. I don't really want to pay near $500 per battery.

I have a 2006 Camelot. It has 12v Lead Acid now. I would prefer to move to AGM but like I mentioned cost is a decision point.

I'm looking for your input on best band for value and place to buy. For the coach batteries I have a pair of 12V Napa truck batteries that I picked up on the road. They work for the coach.

Thoughts?

Many of us “oldsters” prefer flooded cells or the same thing that came in them,  We nave also gotten many years of service….7 plus out of them.  We use Trojan T-105.  They are robust and not easily killed.  A long time Lazy Days senior tech said that he could usually salvage the Trojans.  But other brands, like Interstates would fail after having their electrolyte levels replenished and charged..

Now, FWIW.  The secret we have found as well as tech support from Trojan.  Exercise (run the down to around 50% SOC) every 4 -6 months.  Exercising them is the secret, assuming you don’t do this in normal use, keeps them healthy.  

Good Luck…

[VinceB]

I recently went with 4 T105's wet cell.  I've been getting 6-7 years out of them due to the watering kit on them.  My  coach is parked at home and it is not a problem to water them and top them off once a month.

We dry camp about 5x in the winter 4-5 days at a stretch and always have enough power. We can't run microwave on the inverter - it is only 1500 watts and that's about what the unit pulls.

Batteries Unlimited in Glendora, CA gets $180 ea. at this time for T 105's.

[Tom Wallis]

8 hours ago, birdshill123 said:

If you are wanting wet cell ordinary 6 volts I would go with Costco. I have them in both of our motorhomes. Great price. They only have a one year warranty but Costco asks no questions and the replacement also comes with a one year warranty.

I agree with Bruce. I think Costco is good as it gets for price. I have four 6v golf cart batteries from Costco, they're 5 years old and going strong.

I personal am not as fan of the AGM unless you just want no maintenance. I believe that's their only advantage and they're more expensive. If you switch to AGM you need to change the charging voltage.

[JDCrow]

13 minutes ago, Tom Wallis said:

I agree with Bruce. I think Costco is good as it gets for price. I have four 6v golf cart batteries from Costco, they're 5 years old and going strong.

I personal am not as fan of the AGM unless you just want no maintenance. I believe that's their only advantage and they're more expensive. If you switch to AGM you need to change the charging voltage.

Yes, it’s all about the maintenance. For me, not retired and waaaaaaaaaay to much on my plate. 

[throgmartin]

Our resident battery expert on this forum, Bill Groves ( may he RIP ) always recommended Duracell AGM's. Bill did tons of research on batteries and knew which ones were built the best. I never bought batteries or an electrical component without consulting him first. I run all Duracell batteries in my coach, both chassis and house, and have never had a problem. l admit to abusing the hell out of them and they keep on going. I have always bought my Duracells at Sam's. One of the benefits of AGM"s is they do not off gas like flooded batteries. In my 8 years of using AGM's I have never had to clean a terminal and my battery tray is in excellent shape.

One battery I can tell you to stay clear of is Interstates. They used to be a great battery but have gone down hill over the last couple years. I have lost track of the number of Interstates we have replaced at the shop, many of them 2 years or less old. Many had internal plate failures causing shorting. This is one reason why I run Duracels. Bill found that they use heavier plates as well as their internal plate mounting system is far superior to other leading brands.

I miss Bill. He was a great friend and I enjoyed our many conversations. He was one of the most helpful members we had. He spent a great deal of time researching and talking on the phone with members helping them through electrical issues. I never bought anything electrical without consulting with him first. His knowledge base with electrical, batteries, solar, etc. was unmatched. He always knew which brand components were the best. He is missed by not only me but many of the members here who knew him and were friends with him.

[miacasa_2000]

Deka battery made by East Penn Manufacturing in Pa. A very good company that you can actually talk to with great value and customers at heart. They can tell you who has them in your area and how many they just bought so you can get the freshest set. Two places that I know of nationally that sell them are Nappa and Lowes

Roy Mercier           2003 Dynasty  

[Hypoxia]

19 hours ago, nvrtoofast said:

My house bank of Lead acid batteries finally bit the dust. I've been searching for information on replacements and have seen a bit too much information. I think I'm going to limit my decision to cost. I don't really want to pay near $500 per battery.

I have a 2006 Camelot. It has 12v Lead Acid now. I would prefer to move to AGM but like I mentioned cost is a decision point.

I'm looking for your input on best band for value and place to buy. For the coach batteries I have a pair of 12V Napa truck batteries that I picked up on the road. They work for the coach.

Thoughts?

My experience with flooded batteries; if I spray battery sealer on all terminals where they penetrate the battery case and use a watering system they last a long time and have no corrosion.  The watering system makes it a simple and easy task to keep the water level up.  Flooded batteries will take abuse and when they fail they are relatively inexpensive.

Current coach has eight 8D Lifeline AGM's of which two have had to be replaced within 3 or 4 years.  I have had Lifeline experiences with other RV's and have not been impressed.  I had a few sitting around the shop which went bad and surprised me with quite a bit of corrosion on the terminals.

FWIW, Batteries Plus has a promotions page  https://www.batteriesplus.com/promotions?tab=coupons

 

[Tom Cherry]

12 hours ago, Tom Cherry said:

Many of us “oldsters” prefer flooded cells or the same thing that came in them,  We nave also gotten many years of service….7 plus out of them.  We use Trojan T-105.  They are robust and not easily killed.  A long time Lazy Days senior tech said that he could usually salvage the Trojans.  But other brands, like Interstates would fail after having their electrolyte levels replenished and charged..

Now, FWIW.  The secret we have found as well as tech support from Trojan.  Exercise (run the down to around 50% SOC) every 4 -6 months.  Exercising them is the secret, assuming you don’t do this in normal use, keeps them healthy.  

Good Luck…

Followup 

the folks that get max life do some basics.

exercise as needed.  Usually doing some other “gotta fix” work so we multitask.  We check Specific Gravity and voltage.  The Trojan owners manual covers this and has the SOC chart.

we use Battery Miser Caps (Medium fits Interstate, Trojan, etc).  This virtually eliminates electrolyte loss.  I might add half OZ of DI water ever 4 - 6 months.  I use a wooden dowel with a scribed “fill here” groove.  Way easier than peering and guessing.

we also check the connections and spray the terminals 

we have virtually no “over fill” or battery tray corrosion.  I was not savvy at first, but cleaned and repainted mine when I learned how to maintain.  Absolutely NO issues with the trays since then.  The caps also prevent sulfuric acid gassing.  

Purchasing a “sealed” deep cycle marine battery would be my choice if I needed new batteries in order to sell my MH.  They are a cheap solution and purport to be labor saving…..yes….after the fail quickly and you cannot maintain the cells, tossing and buying new ones saved you labor….not $$.

,  

17 minutes ago, Hypoxia said:

My experience with flooded batteries; if I spray battery sealer on all terminals where they penetrate the battery case and use a watering system they last a long time and have no corrosion.  The watering system makes it a simple and easy task to keep the water level up.  Flooded batteries will take abuse and when they fail they are relatively inexpensive.

Current coach has eight 8D Lifeline AGM's of which two have had to be replaced within 3 or 4 years.  I have had Lifeline experiences with other RV's and have not been impressed.  I had a few sitting around the shop which went bad and surprised me with quite a bit of corrosion on the terminals.

FWIW, Batteries Plus has a promotions page  https://www.batteriesplus.com/promotions?tab=coupons

 

I have owned 3 Vettes.  Not daily drivers.  Many fellow Vette owners went down the high dollar AGM path….and half had Lifelines.  Their stories are on the various forums. Bottom line, the AGM did not provide 100% always gonna start.  Many still use AGM, but they now hookup a maintainer.  AGM are more persnickety and require more battery knowledge and care skill sets.  Many here have that.  But, if someone doesn’t and doesn’t exercise and keep the proper settings on the inverter or have issues with connections or just “never worry’s….theY got a maintenance free AGM”, THEN we get posts with horror stories and why did my AGM fail after 3 years…

I respect those that favor AGM and understand and are careful.  But the AGM are more fragile to owner abuse than are flooded….

[Robert92867]

Batteries are expensive.  Those 2/0 fine stranded cables with hy-pressed lugs are even more expensive. T&B Copper shield has protected my battery terminals for 20 years.

[Martinvz]

I have Duracell batteries (possibly made by Penn in PA) and these have worked very well. 18 months ago I got Interstates and after 6 weeks returned them to Costco as they would not hold sufficient charge. I am very happy with these Duracell flooded batteries. The coach had Duracells installed when we bought it and I had to replace one due to a cracked case.

I will add that I am impressed with the un-named AGM chassis battery. When we bought our 2006 coach in 2014 the name was so faded that it could not be identified and after 17 years it is still going strong. It has not failed me and It only needed the battery boost once. 

[Tom Cherry]

28 minutes ago, Martinvz said:

I have Duracell batteries (possibly made by Penn in PA) and these have worked very well. 18 months ago I got Interstates and after 6 weeks returned them to Costco as they would not hold sufficient charge. I am very happy with these Duracell flooded batteries. The coach had Duracells installed when we bought it and I had to replace one due to a cracked case.

I will add that I am impressed with the un-named AGM chassis battery. When we bought our 2006 coach in 2014 the name was so faded that it could not be identified and after 17 years it is still going strong. It has not failed me and It only needed the battery boost once. 

Costco, locally, did not stock the “real” battery size needed for our MH.  They had a lower, maybe 175 - 190 AH, deep marine/RV/Golf Cart one.  It did not carry the same “glowing remarks” as the original ST225’s had on the Interstate site.  Sadly, as expected, they also barely weighed 50 - 55 pounds.  The Trojan T-105 or the Interstate's were listed around 63 pounds .    I could have paid almost the same for the better Interstates from their local distributor compared to the lightweight Costco special.

Comparing a starter AGM is totally different. The charging systems on the engine deliver a constant charge and they do not deep cycle.  I have one car with an original GM oem and it is great.  But, with the house, you can make a mistake and quickly kill or damage an AGM.  I know many of,the upper end MH manufacturing companies are using AGM, but they are not using the workhorse “Magnum” like we have.  Maybe the later replacement versions of the Magnums have been refined or improved…but AGM was a very expensive upgrade….just like folks typically ditch a magnum when they go to a lithium.  A magnum just doesn’t seem to work reliably on lithium's…..as we have many topics on “which charger or inverter” for Lithium.

YES..l love technology and improvements…..but sometimes you use what was designed to be the best choice….and flooded works well with the Magnums….

[birdshill123]

Robert. When making your cables do you put the Koper shield into the terminal and then crimp?

[CapnDean]

And now for something totally different;

 

i yanked out 6 dead 6v Trojans that were 7 years old.   I replaced them with 2 12v marine deep cycle batteries.  
 

yes indeed I know that i just severely reduced the ability to dry camp for days on end without running the generator.  
I am guessing that 6 6v Trojans would give me 3x the amp hours of my pair of 12v trolling motor batteries.    
This set up will allow my RF18 residential fridge to run overnight with no issues solely on the inverter.     
 

i seldom do more than a night at a welcome center on a trip.   If i need 2 nights to get there….I’ll plug in somewhere.

[VinceB]

9 hours ago, Robert92867 said:

Batteries are expensive.  Those 2/0 fine stranded cables with hy-pressed lugs are even more expensive. T&B Copper shield has protected my battery terminals for 20 years.

Looks identical to my battery bay. Those caps on the Trojans are horrible imho. They let acid out before I had a chance to re-install the watering kit and now I have a huge clean up to do. OR my new batteries were over filled. 

Either way I need to recoat my bay. Does anyone have a good suggestion what to use for that?

[dl_racing427]

11 hours ago, Tom Cherry said:

Followup 

the folks that get max life do some basics.

exercise as needed.  Usually doing some other “gotta fix” work so we multitask.  We check Specific Gravity and voltage.  The Trojan owners manual covers this and has the SOC chart.

we use Battery Miser Caps (Medium fits Interstate, Trojan, etc).  This virtually eliminates electrolyte loss.  I might add half OZ of DI water ever 4 - 6 months.  I use a wooden dowel with a scribed “fill here” groove.  Way easier than peering and guessing.

we also check the connections and spray the terminals 

we have virtually no “over fill” or battery tray corrosion.  I was not savvy at first, but cleaned and repainted mine when I learned how to maintain.  Absolutely NO issues with the trays since then.  The caps also prevent sulfuric acid gassing.  

Purchasing a “sealed” deep cycle marine battery would be my choice if I needed new batteries in order to sell my MH.  They are a cheap solution and purport to be labor saving…..yes….after the fail quickly and you cannot maintain the cells, tossing and buying new ones saved you labor….not $$.

,  

I have owned 3 Vettes.  Not daily drivers.  Many fellow Vette owners went down the high dollar AGM path….and half had Lifelines.  Their stories are on the various forums. Bottom line, the AGM did not provide 100% always gonna start.  Many still use AGM, but they now hookup a maintainer.  AGM are more persnickety and require more battery knowledge and care skill sets.  Many here have that.  But, if someone doesn’t and doesn’t exercise and keep the proper settings on the inverter or have issues with connections or just “never worry’s….theY got a maintenance free AGM”, THEN we get posts with horror stories and why did my AGM fail after 3 years…

I respect those that favor AGM and understand and are careful.  But the AGM are more fragile to owner abuse than are flooded….

I've had great luck with Odyssey AGM batteries in my 427 Cobra and my LS powered FD RX-7.
Neither car is driven regularly, and I do keep Battery Minders on them.
The first one in the Cobra lasted 11 years.
I'll also be installing one in my standby Diesel Generator when the original battery starts to show its age.
I haven't yet had experience with them in deep cycle service.
I did have 2 Optima spiral cell AGM's go bad in one of my Mustangs many years ago.  Neither one lasted much more than a year. No more Optima for me.

3 minutes ago, VinceB said:

Looks identical to my battery bay. Those caps on the Trojans are horrible imho. They let acid out before I had a chance to re-install the watering kit and now I have a huge clean up to do. OR my new batteries were over filled. 

Either way I need to recoat my bay. Does anyone have a good suggestion what to use for that?

I'd use POR-15 to coat the bay.
It's designed to work over rusty metal.  Just wire brush any loose or scaly rust, clean thoroughly and paint with POR-15.
It sets rock hard, has great adhesion, and stands up well to abrasion and chemicals.