RoadTripper2084

Thanks for the update. Hoping the repairs land on the "easier-on-the-wallet" side of the fence.

22 hours ago, Ray Davis said:

I'm sure there are dissatisfied Coach Net customers that have good cause but I believe to a great extent it is the individuals outlook about life in general. 

Exactly this. I learned a long time ago that the secret to happiness was managed expectations. 🙂

I picked up a 3 year Good Sam subscription this year to go along with our coach. Neighbour recommended it. For me I knew Coach Net had a better reputation, but we are still just vacation and weekend road warriors so total miles isn't much and Good Sam provided everything I was looking for at half the cost (maybe less) of Coach Net. Unlimited miles towing when necessary, coverage for all my kids and their vehicles as well.

I fully recognize that should I ever need to use it that yeah, most likely my day is shot. Hopefully not my whole trip. It's a lifeline. The fact of the matter is that the quality of the experience is going to depend on the quality of the person they send out to help me. I also *know* I could get a faster response most times by cold calling a local service shop with an open wallet. But then I'd have to find a reputable local shop, and have a deep wallet. 

If I were spending months on the road every year, I'd go with Coach Net from what I've read about them.

57 minutes ago, Steven P said:

From my manual:  I know high speed idle is not the same as no load, but this is what my manual says.  I'm pretty sure I remember someone who has done this way longer than I have saying he doesn't high idle until his Temps are up.  Another sentence says to use the high idle. 

Yeah, so "no load" means not driving (by my interpretation, anyway). So fast idle is fine so long as you have oil pressure registering before you engage it.

I've also read in my manual that you can use the PAC brake to accelerate engine warmup by engaging it during idle. I've never tried that yet since I'm usually running around doing other things and not sitting there to push the floor switch for the PAC brake.

4 hours ago, Steven P said:

Steve, if memory serves me right, I believe my Cummins manual says to not raise the RPMs  from idle until the engine temps have risen close to normal for operating. 

That doesn't sound right. AFAIK You are supposed to keep it a low idle until oil pressure is showing on the pressure gauge, then high idle. 

If it's cold out (<50f) I'll give it 30 secs anyway before high idle to hopefully give the oil a chance to warm up and circulate. Running the engine at a high idle is actually better for it than low as this will increase the temps and lubricity of the oil quicker.

To be clear, I meant it is on the top left side of the engine if you in the bedroom facing the back of the coach.

Here is another diagram of the solenoid that I found:

1 minute ago, Ivan K said:

Interesting, did not know there was a system like that. Mine only stays on if there was a trouble present.

Yeah, that's the normal way it's done these days. I suspect they changed it since the behaviour on mine would probably be concerning for people who didn't read the manual (why is my ABS light still on?).  

Okay, I am not a mechanic and I don't know what I'm doing, so consider yourself warned.

Does the starter turn over, but the engine won't fire up?

If so, a very common problem on these mechanical engines is the fuel lockout solenoid will fail or stick. Based on your description of the the engine just stopping all of a sudden it could explain it.

Here is a page from my manual that talks about it:

Under your bed, on the left top side of the engine you will find it. If you turn your key to the ON position (but not cranking), and then use your hand to push the solenoid all the way up/in, this will open the fuel valve and allow fuel into the engine. While you (or someone else) holds the level all the way in, have someone else try to start it with the key. If this was your problem it should fire right up.  Likewise, when you turn your key "off", this solenoid shuts down and the valve closes, turning fuel off to the engine. This is literally how the engine starts and stops (well, with the additional of turning over via the starter to start).

Note that if the solenoid has failed you may need to manually pull the lever down to stop the engine, even when the key is "off".

If it were me, I would follow the procedure above to ensure that the fuel valve was fully open to see if that gets it started. 

12 hours ago, Ivan K said:

I don't think it should be happening on every start. Maybe you don't wait for the lamp test to complete its ÷2s cycle before going from ON to START. The first thing an air brake endorsement examiner is looking for is the light to come ON and OFF before continuing the test.

Nope. On my rig it's the expected behaviour. 🙂

11 hours ago, just_john1 said:

I was asked for the GoFundMe link, I hadn't planned on posting it here, but here it is.

https://www.gofundme.com/f/getting-out-of-everett?utm_source=customer&utm_medium=copy_link&utm_campaign=p_cf+share-flow-1

Thanks. John

Thought I would provide an update. Cummins has cameras, but of course they don't aim in the right direction. I contacted a Mobile Mechanic and he came out to look at the rig. He confirmed the turbo is out. Doesn't know why it won't fire. Does anyone know where the diagnostic port on a 97 Dynasty is located? The OBD2 plug on this rig is useless it only has 4 contacts in it. The mech. said it should be round with 6 contacts. Am calling Cummins to see if they know. We are making progress kinda slow, but progress.

Now for something up beat. Met a Forum member, who  lives here. Really nice guy and knows the area and offers his assistance. Doesn't feel so lonely now. Thanks Gary for being here.

The 97 Dynasty is a mechanical engine, so no electronic diagnostics for the engine. The Allison tranny is electronic, but that's not your problem.

On 10/21/2021 at 4:48 PM, just_john1 said:

They figure the turbo shaft  broke and blew the engine

Sorry, I'm just trying to figure out where you sit. The Turbo has failed, that much is certain? And Cummins said that the engine is blown? How did they determine that? Did they open it up?

FYI On my '97 Dynasty the ABS light stays on until you move forward faster than 5 mph, I think.

48 minutes ago, Tom Wallis said:

So much has been said about batteries on this forum that I've been reluctant to add my voice. I've been involved in battery care and maintenance most of my life both by occupation and hobby. I've worked with battery banks, stationary batteries and fleet batteries and I'm a long time RVer. Here is what I've found to be true:

Unless your RV is very old it probably came with a 3 stage charger/converter. The best thing you can do for your batteries is keep your RV plugged in when it's not in use. The 3 stage charger will charge the batteries rapidly at first then throttle back to a medium charge and finally go to float or a maintenance charge. This ideal and pretty hard to beat with any supplemental charger. You should be able to leave your RV plugged in for extended periods without worrying about water loss, freezing or sulfation.   Do check your battery water before storage. Letting it get below the top of the plates is detrimental.

Some motorhomes charge the chassis battery when plugged in and some don't. My didn't so I converted it so it does. That's another subject.

The worst thing you can do to your lead acid batteries is to discharge them below 50%. The further you go past 50% discharge the shorter their life will be and discharging them 100% is an absolute no no. Also, the longer they sit discharged the worse it is. Try to charge them as soon as possible anytime they get run down.

If a battery has been abused those pulse chargers might coax a tiny bit of life out it but not much.

Some will disagree with me but I wouldn't spend the extra money on AGM batteries unless you need them for an enclosed space (no fumes) or you really need maintenance free. Otherwise I don't think they perform any better than flooded batteries. I buy the 6 volt golf cart batteries from Costco. Golf cart batteries are rugged and they're built for deep discharging and I think they give you the biggest bang for your buck. Mine are 4 years old and going strong.

In my travel trailer, which I just sold this fall, I had a pair of 6-volt golf cart batteries, they were basically Trojan knock offs by a local commercial battery supplier (240AH). 

I was careful to never let the water get below the top of the plates, rarely drained them below 50% capacity, and not for long if I did, as recommended above, and put them on a shelf in my garage in the winter on a very small maintainer.

These batteries were 12 years old when I sold the unit. They were starting to show their age, with frequent buildup on the posts, etc. However, we were able to complete a successful 4 night dry camp in Jasper this summer without draining them below 50%. Best battery experience of my life.

Looking to use LiFePo4 for the house batteries in my new rig, but failing that 6-volt flooded would be my next choice for sure.

18 hours ago, Ivylog said:

The price of Lithium cells (build your own batteries) has come way way down in the last couple months…BUT the current backlog of container ships may require waiting on them for months.

I recently ordered 8 280AH cells … enough cells to make 2 batteries for a total of 560AH. Including a basic BMS and probably 10 hours of my time the cost will be $1/AH, about the price of lead acid golf cart batteries. The Lithiums should last 5X and you can use 90+% of their AHs instead if 50%. Battle Born wants $7+/AH.

It’s really not that hard to build…plenty of videos on how. 6 months ago I thought I’d done well building 600AH of batteries for $2/AH…$1200 instead of Bend over Born’s $4800 price.

Yes, you cannot charge Lithiums when frozen…can still discharge them. Charging takes a slightly higher voltage but a AGM setting will do the job.

I'm researching right now and would like to upgrade to LifePo4 for the house batteries, assemble my own as you have done.

What I'm struggling with is figuring out the "minimal" required other components in my rig that I'd have to replace to do so (doesn't make much sense to go lithium if I have to spend 2x for new converters, smart battery monitors, etc. as well).

Thus far I *think* the path of least cost may be to use a DC-DC charger between the lead acid chassis batteries and the LiFePo4 house batteries, and simply charge the house batteries whenever the chassis batteries are being charged (detect higher chassis battery voltage). I'm not sure if I also need to disconnect the house batteries from the existing coach charging circuits or if that can be left in place, since the voltage levels are all low enough that they can't overcharge the lithiums in any case?

How have you got your lithium house batteries setup in the coach? 

3 minutes ago, BobSchmeck said:

What are you going to tow?

Not sure yet, will be purchasing a vehicle to accommodate my tow requirements. My main objective is to have as simple/easy hookup and teardown as possible so using it won't be a chore. Well that, and as low a cost as possible so will be looking for decent used components where possible. We're only weekends and vacations  right now so trying to keep the budget low as we won't be getting a lot of use for now.

At this point the a 2010ish CR-V is at the top of the list, since it can be towed 4 down with the automatic trans., and has AWD (nice to have where we live).

Any updates?  I'm also looking at putting together a TOAD solution so this discussion has been informative.

For what it's worth, the tach on my 97 Dynasty (mechanical C8.3) has an issue where it will jump up very high and immediately settle back to the correct RPMs. This occurs frequently when the engine is cold, and far less frequently when it is warm. From what I've read it appears likely to be an issue with the alternator, though a dodgy ground might also be a factor?

I replaced the belt and tensioner and noticed when I hand-turned the alternator that it made a ticking sound every rotation, but there was no play in the pulley and I couldn't "feel" anything corresponding to the ticking either, but now I noticed the tensioner is jumping a bit when it's running. I think I'll pull the alternator off and get a rebuild kit while it's in winter storage.

My speedo has been reading a little high, usually 2-5kms hour over. Last trip though it also started to jump way up and then back down, though staying high for minutes at a time. Not sure what could be causing this either, though dodgy ground connection seems likely. 

I will be refreshing my ground bus connections at the rear of the coach, and if there is one in front of the front firewall in the spring to see if that clears up the speedo issue.

On 10/15/2021 at 4:37 AM, Dr4Film said:

Replace the POS Battery Cut-Off continuous duty solenoid with a Latching Solenoid. That requires you to install a momentary switch in place of the on/off switch and you have to run an additional wire from the switch to the new solenoid.

Otherwise you either keep replacing what you have OR bypass the solenoid permanently and just use the House Battery Disconnect Switch.

13 minutes ago, wamcneil said:

X2. Another benefit is power consumption. My continuous solenoid drew 750ma. That’s 18AH/d

I just had to replace my solenoid a few weeks ago. I had the same thought "how much friggin' power does this thing use just staying energized all the time?". 

Could someone post a link to a suitable latching solenoid for reference?

Thanks for the reply.

So basically, I'm looking at a new inverter if I want to charge from shore power or the alternator, a DC-DC converter if I want to charge from the alternator, and a new solar controller if I want to charge from solar?

And there isn't one magical box that does all that already? 🙂

Thanks for the advice.

Unit is winterized now but in the spring I think I will add a good dose of Iron Out (the stuff for plumbing/water softeners: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00103XAQC/ref=emc_b_5_t?th=1) to the fresh tank and run it through all the pipes and fixtures when I am sanitizing it and see what that does. 

Honestly, the water I put in it seemed fine, it was only when I opened the filter canister that I noticed the rust. 

My new-new-to-me 1997 Dynasty has signs that it has been used long-term with a very rusty fresh water source.

The toilet bowl has rust streaks from the water outlet ports, and when I was winterizing it and removed the water filter canisters in the water bay, they had rusty water at the bottom of them. They are also completely covered in rust that doesn't wash off, though they are plastic (see attached).  I can only assume that all the pipes, etc. are coated in this rust layer. 

I have seen no other signs of rust in the water when using water from our house in the tank. Water smells normal/fine, etc.

Is this something I should be concerned about? Can I just ignore it if it's not producing rusty water at the taps, etc.? Should I use the filter canisters with filters or replace them?

2 hours ago, waterskier_1 said:

I checked and the solar, as originally installed by Monaco was supposed to charge both sets of batteries (Chassis and House).  Here is a wiring diagram of the Solar wiring.

  -Rick N.

 

Thanks. I have now found this diagram in my Owner's Manual. 

Looks like the solar is cut off when the battery disconnect switches are opened. I was worried the controller might be  drain on the battery even in storage. 

In a perfect world, I'd like a drop-in replacement for my wet-cell LA House batteries that was LiFEP04 and that could be charged from the existing gear in the coach.

Am I correct that the House batteries can be charged by the alternator, inverter (when on shore power or generator is running), or solar controller?

Would a DC-DC converter placed in-line between the battery and rest of the coach provide the charge protection/profiles from any existing charging source?  Or I am looking at replacing a bunch of other components as well?

Sorry if this is too broad a question, I'm just starting to figure this stuff out. 🙂

1 hour ago, waterskier_1 said:

I had a '97 Dynasty.  Unless major rewiring of the original factory wiring, this is how it supposed to work.  The top shelf (single) battery is for the Chassis.  The two batteries wired in parallel are for the house.

When you plug in the coach, the inverter-charger will begin charging the house batteries.  It will go through the 3-stages, Bulk, Absorption, and then Float, as necessary.  The LE-415 maintainer in the Rear Run Bay will take power from the House batteries, once they reach a certain level, and begin to charge the chassis battery.  I found the LE-415 Maintainer to be very problematic - many fail and mine failed with the light on as should be, just no output to the chassis battery.  A replacement, when one can be found is over $400.  There are many other better and cheaper devices now on the market to do the same job.

When the engine is running, the alternator output goes to the Solid State Isolator (the center terminal).  Then on one of the other terminals connects to the chassis battery, and the remaining terminal to the house battery.  When the engine is running, the alternator output is sent to both battery banks, as needed.  Both should read the same, once the batteries are charged (assuming good batteries).  That voltage should be around 14.2 Volts.  Therefore, the engine alternator always charges both set of batteries.

The auxiliary "maintainer" was likely added because the LE-415 maintainer failed.  It's likely plugged into the block heater outlet, and it's purpose is to charge/maintain the chassis battery when on shore or generator power.  This works fine unless you do a lot of dry camping and use solar to charge your house batteries.  In that case, you are not using the generator as much, if at all, and that auxiliary maintainer never gets powered up to charge the chassis battery.  In theory, if you aren't using any of the chassis devices, you shouldn't need to charge/maintain the chassis battery.  Real life experience says otherwise. 

If you plan on using a significant amount of solar while dry camping, I'd recommend either the "Echo-Charger" or "Amp-L-Charge" type device.  These are basically modern replacements of & for the LE-415 Maintainer.  They will allow for charging the chassis battery from the house batteries once the solar charges the house batteries to a certain level (around 13.5 volts) and disconnect them when the voltage drops below a certain voltage (around 12.5 volts) so as to not allow the chassis battery and circuits to discharge you house battery.

I'm attaching the 2-page wiring diagram for the chassis and house batteries.  Please let me know if you have questions.

  -Rick N.

wiring015.pdf 116.1 kB · 0 downloads wiring016.pdf 135.1 kB · 0 downloads

Wow - thanks for responding!  I am amazed at the complexity they built into these systems.

Based on my earlier readings it does *seem* like the stock LE-415 maintainer is working, maybe it's not 100% reliable though (labels corrected):

On 10/13/2021 at 12:12 PM, RoadTripper2084 said:

when I plug the coach in, I see the maintainer mounted on the electrical panel in the engine compartment light green, and then the voltage for BOTH sets of batteries bumps up:

Chassis House: from 12.74vdc to 14.24v

House Chassis: from 12.76v to 13.86v.

Q: Do you know if the 120v outlet in the engine bay is only powered via shore/generator and NOT by the inverter? or always powered by any of the 3?

Q: My factory solar panel doesn't seem to provide any charge. The most I've seen on the panel outside the bedroom is 0.1A, but the red "charging" led never lights. Maybe my batteries have been too charged for it start charging them (been mostly on shore power so far)?

Does the solar panel charge/maintain the House batteries, or the Chassis (or both)?

Q: When storing for longer periods (weeks/months), should the rear battery disconnect switches be a reliable way to prevent ghost drains on the batteries, or do I need to disconnect the grounds from the batteries / install a secondary battery disconnect?

Q: Do you have any experience with using LiFeP04 batteries for House batteries in this setup?  Trying to understand the simplest/cheapest setup that will tolerate being charged by the alternator, shore, generator, and solar.

Thanks again!

6 hours ago, Ivan K said:

What happens when you turn on headlights and dash heater blower? Chassis voltage should drop without running engine and house remain unchanged. The maintainer will try to help it but it got pretty low current limit. If there is no change in the delta, then yeah, something is connecting them.

So I ran a few tests as you suggested:

Chassis  /  House

Unplugged (no shore power):  13.61v  /  13.71v

Running lights and dash fan on (only): 13.11v  / 12.55v

House lights on (only): 12.76v  /  12.85v

Nothing on: 13.03v  /  12.81

Inverter on: 12.39v  /  13.2v

Pretty confusing numbers, but it certainly seems like the 2 parallel batteries in the bottom tray are actually the House batteries, and the single battery on top is the Chassis (so opposite of my labelling above)?  

5 hours ago, vito.a said:

I think your Trace inverter-charger is recharging your house batteries and the original maintainer is only charging the chassis batteries.   It's been a while but I'm not sure the 1997 model had a bidirectional system to join both batteries.  

Monaco originally used two of the large 8D sized house batteries.  I did not have good longevity from the 8D batteries and replacing them was expensive.  I used four 6-volt golf cart deep cycle batteries with each two wired in series and paralleled to the other two.  It's a bit of a challenge but I managed to fit them in the original battery tray.  This system produced better performance and lasted much longer. 

A modern option would be to build your own 13.2v LiFePO4 battery packs.  

Yeah, this rig currently has 3 identical G4D (4D) batteries.

I ran a pair of 6v deep cycle batteries in my last trailer for 12 years, took good care of them and they still powered us through a 4 night boondock last summer. 🙂

Looking into LiFeP04 batteries but need to get my head around all the implications (re: extra equipment required to make it co-exist with the chassis batteries, alternator, etc.). That's my winter project, to figure out what I'm going to do to supplement/replace the house batteries. We like to boondock and this rig has a residential refrigerator, so going to need a bit of battery capacity to avoid running the generator too much.

Hi folks, new member here. My new-to-me 1997 Dynasty 36' came with 3 identical batteries, 2 connected in parallel on the bottom tray which I assume are the chassis batteries, and one on the top tray which I think is the House battery. I believe the previous owner mostly drove between 50A service parks so didn't need much House capacity.

I'm planning to upgrade the house batteries for next season but step 1 is to figure out how things are supposed to work, and are currently working. What's confusing me is that when I plug the coach in, I see the maintainer mounted on the electrical panel in the engine compartment light green, and then the voltage for BOTH sets of batteries bumps up:

Chassis: from 12.74vdc to 14.24v

House: from 12.76v to 13.86v.

My understanding was that the built-in maintainer would only charge the House batteries when the coach was on shore power?

In addition, if I then plugin the 3rd-party maintainer mounted in the engine compartment (added by a previous owner), both sets of batteries once again see a voltage change:

Chassis: from 14.24vdc to 14.27v

House: from 13.86v to 13.97v.

Finally, after charging on shore power for approx. 4.5 hours, I unplugged the coach and left it for 15 mins. Then took a further set of readings:

Chassis: 13.61v

House: also 13.61v

In addition, anytime I've used the switch on the dash to temporarily connect the House batteries to the Chassis, I've see no change at all in the dash volt-meter.

All of this leads me to think that all 3 of my batteries are somehow connected to be both House and Chassis batteries?

Is this somehow normal? Thoughts?