jlynn37064

I found the blown fuse.  My valves have two inline fuses per valve inside the panel in the wet bay. None of these were blown. The blown fuse was in the rear closet and labeled from the factory as Ozone.  Whoever replaced these valves must have tapped into this circuit. They could have saved me a lot of time had the labeled the fuse panel.  My new valve seals seem to be working fine. The valves are operating well.   Thanks for the help. 

Sorry let me add to my post. I have Drainmaster valves. I was having trouble getting the gray tank valve to seal. I ordered new seals from drainmaster.  I removed the valves and replaced the seals but somehow I have lost power. I bypassed the wiring harness and was able to operate the valves with a battery. So I know the valve motor is working. The switches should have red lights on showing open valve but the lights aren’t on.  On the valve side there are two sets of wires connections, red and black. They are marked as power to the valves but I tested them and they had no voltage. 

I’ve lost power to my drain master waste valves. I have power to the water pump, cord and hose reels. I don’t know if the waste valves are in the same source.  I checked the valves and they operate with direct battery connection. I see two sets of fuses to the switches and all 4 fuses test good. Any thoughts as to any other fuses or switches?   Sure wish I had manual valves. 

Well, today I was able to get under the rig and look at this. The electric motor that opens and closes the valve was sliding around and not able to close the valve.  I used a section of serpentine belt to help the bracket more securely hold the valve body. After a little adjustment, the valve now seals. 

In our 2006 Beaver Patriot Thunder the fresh water dump valve isn’t sealing.  I can open and close it from the switch but it has a very big leak.  What kind of valve is this and how do I access it?  

2 hours ago, Ivylog said:

You should have 2 control knobs on the left, the Silverleaf and a camera selector to try and see which cameras are working. At least you’re gaining and a place in IN wanted an additional $1000 to install the system.
 

I didn’t have a camera selector switch. On my kitchen cabinet is the original Aladdin switch but it appears to do nothing. 

I found the rear camera cable. It was not plugged in. It is working as it should. The right camera seams to be dead.  But I will accept the rear camera as a major victory. Does the rear camera have audio? 

16 hours ago, jlynn37064 said:

I have not tried that. The guy with silver leaf did not suggest that. I’ll have to look at that in the morning. Thanks.

I tried the control panel   I was able to change views to see engine, trip and other data. This did stop my left camera from coming on screen when I turned on the turn signal. I went back to the main screen and could again see the camera. But still nothing from Rear or Right side cameras.  I’m wondering where they get their power. 

14 minutes ago, Ivylog said:

Does the camera select switch on the left console do anything?

I have not tried that. The guy with silver leaf did not suggest that. I’ll have to look at that in the morning. Thanks.

59 minutes ago, Ivylog said:

In the dash there’s a video switcher… 4 cameras in and one video out. I’d try plugging the right camera into the working left RCA plug.

Thanks. I actually tried that and the right camera didn’t come on when I turned on the left or right blinker. 

I spoke with SilverLeaf today. Great support. One of the SilverLeaf boxes needed to be unplugged and restarted. After doing so, my left camera works with the turn signal. The rear and right cameras aren't working. Now to diagnose them.  Thanks for the help. 

On 4/28/2023 at 8:52 AM, Ivylog said:

Do you have the 330 keypad? If so, you have a $1000 Silverleaf VMS 330 engine monitor system. I like the one I installed in my 08 Navigator here;

https://www.irv2.com/forums/f115/installing-a-silverleaf-vms333-in-08-navigator-398067.html

Here’s the manual:

https://www.silverleafelectronics.com/sites/default/files/2019-10/VMS 330 Owner Manual.pdf

Ivylog, I was finally able to spend some time on this project. I got the new stereo installed. I plugged the video cable into the A/V input of the stereo and I'm able to use the Silverleaf controller to view the Silverleaf screens. I'm trying to determine how to get the cameras to come on. I'm going to call Silverleaf tomorrow. 

8 hours ago, DavidL said:

I am guessing that manages the camera views?

Or video to TVs?

David, Someone send me a link that was very helpful.   

26 minutes ago, Dr4Film said:

A quick call to the techs at SilverLeaf in OR will get you the specific answers to your questions.

They are a great group of guys who are very knowledgeable about all of their products and very willing to help.

I will do that. This whole project began out of the desire to update the stereo.  I had no idea it would become a science project. 

I don’t know what I’ve got and would appreciate information as to what these three boxes do. 2006 Beaver Silver Leaf Components
https://youtu.be/04hDVYNOyH8

5 hours ago, Georgia Mike said:

I made this listening device to find air leaks. Its a 2 foot piece of 1/2 inch pvc and 5/8 vinyl tubing. Hold the vinyl tubing end to your ear and probe with the pvc pipe in the area that is suspect. If there’s a leak you will hear it with this. It’s cheap and it works.

Ingenious. Thanks for sharing

Thanks everyone for you help. I replaced the leaking air hose and as well as the other 7 hoses. I'm ready to get back on the road.  The new hoses cost my $100 each, which hurt my feelings, but it only took about 20 minutes to remove the old ones and install the new ones. A simple task as long as you can get under your rig safely. 

1 hour ago, Greg G said:

I cannot say about recrimping the ends,  My sync cylinder that runs the front drivers slide went to leaking like yours,  I took it to a hydraulic shop and had it rebuilt.  There are specific instructions to (sync) it at install so both of your cylinders will go in and out at the same time and speed.  HWH can supply those instructions.

After watching your video again, it seems you are leaking above the cylinder.  Or the cylinder is actually squirting.  Have someone run the slide in and out while you watch the cylinder.  Dexron 3 is red.  

Above that area is where your antifreeze lines go to the aqua hot and up to the dash heat.  If its not dexron it could be a coolant hose.  Just changed mine this year.

Great information. Thanks. 

2 hours ago, Greg G said:

On my 06 Navigator the reservoir for the slides is under the entry steps.  The second step will fold up and underneath is the reservoir and pump for the slides.  manual calls for dexron 3.  Check fluid level with slides in.

Thank you. I’ll check for this. My steps don’t have a compartment but I may be able to access with generator pulled out. 

59 minutes ago, Greg G said:

That is the equalizer cylinder , or maybe also called sync cylinder for one of your hydraulic slides.  Probably the passenger bedroom slide.  That cylinder is important when running slides in and out.  Without that cylinder, the slides would go out unevenly.

Good to know. Thanks. Where is it getting it’s fluid? I want to make sure it doesn’t run dry?  Someone else suggested I re-crimp the lines and hopefully it will stop leaking. 

1 hour ago, Frank Bergamo said:

It is probably your equalizer cylinder for the slide that is leaking. More specific, the hydraulic line at the crimped fitting. You can check the screwed in fittings at the cylinder for tightness, but the crimped end is most likely the culprit. I used a lug crimping tool to tighten mine and no problem since. Hope this helps.

Thanks Frank  

1 hour ago, Gary 05 AMB DST said:

jlynn, you're talking about more in the center of the motorhome? Where all those "lines" are bundled together?

Gary 05 AMB DST

Yes. Here is picture of the part 

1 hour ago, Simplysmn said:

The round part is your air bag for the suspension. Is it oil or just moisture?  If it's oil it shouldn't be. It might be Moisture and that is typical with a air system but it should not be alot. Have you drained the air tank lately? 

Val, the video may have been confusing. Here is a picture of the part 

I’m not sure what this part is. It’s mounted on the frame in front of the tag axel. It’s leaking oil around the fittings. Any suggestions?  March 16, 2023
https://youtube.com/shorts/IB3tCqWdxB8?feature=share

1 hour ago, Jdw12345 said:

This is just for informational purposes only, in regards to airlines.

 

 

Very informative. Thanks for sharing 

On 3/7/2023 at 10:03 AM, DZZippy said:

Great video and definitely gives everybody a better understanding what your looking at for sure. What you refer to as the caging bolt is indeed correct. The numbers you found on the drive axle chamber are indeed your model numbers. If for whatever you can’t identify it by part number any local heavy duty truck part place can manage for acquisition. 
 

Regarding the situation,  A couple things I definitely want to confirm though. It is my understanding that this only occurs when the service brake / brake pedal / treadle valve (different names names for the same for clarity). So, just for clarification:

1. Obviously no modifications to the air system where recently done and is “as is from the factory”. This is also assuming no recent work as well before you noticed the problem and changed your relay valve. Just making the statement in general as to the possibility of crossing an air line when performing any recent work by anyone.

2. After running the engine driven air compressor until full pressure and air dryer pop off / purge, the system holds pressure if the engine is shut down. Then, after blocking the wheels to make sure the coach doesn’t move, the parking brake is released and the system continues to maintain pressure after air equalization from releasing the brakes. 
 

3. the rush of air you hear is only when pushing the brake pedal and holding it with the second step completed. 
 

4. you don’t have an Air Force one braking system for a toad…..or similar system

PM or contact me or I will try and contact you in the meantime. We can discuss some various items or steps that could help. However, all I ask in return is that you post any findings here so we can all learn from our issues.

I just sent you a message with my phone number

Kurtis, I found it.  You were right in the location of the male air line next to my generator. I was able to use that to attach a line from my garage compressor to have a constant supply of air.  By having my wife push the brake I finally felt air coming from somewhere. The noise of the air resonating in the tank was drowning out the sound of the air leak. I was able to feel the air near the hose.  I sprayed it with soapy water and the bubbles revealed the leak.  It’s the hose going to the driver’s side   Any recommendations for a source of brake hoses? 
 

thanks again for the help

On 3/6/2023 at 8:04 AM, DZZippy said:

Hey all. A lot of good information and everyone is accurate in my opinion. I have spent a couple decades working on fire trucks and emergency vehicles and obviously they have air systems and in many cases, more complex than our coaches. As an emergency vehicle technician, I had to follow DOT on top of a few more stringent items required by NFPA. Regarding air systems, the DOT tests that were referenced, are accurate. However there are a couple tests by DOT that are supposed to be conducted to detect air brake leak down rates as well. Some of these have been referenced already by you folks of leak down rates with engine off and engine running vs parking brake released, etc. In addition to,  air build up within a certain amount of time to pop off pressure based on engine speed. One of the other tests that I am referring more to in my replay, has to do with the engine running, parking brakes released, and service brake applied. The air compressor should still be able to maintain and build pressure to pop off by the governor. Based on the symptom / complaint, I have a feeling that test would fail. As many have eluded to, sounds like a leak on brake application side such as a ruptured diaphragm in a chamber of any sort (parking or not) on the service brake side, relay valve, or even “sense line” coming from the treadle valve (brake pedal) that goes to one of the relay valves. Possible hoses going from really valve to the service side of the chambers as well (I have found those to be insufficient many times). On a side note, if there is a ruptured diaphragm in a chamber, strong possibility that it will not produce bubbles with a soapy solution. The leak is internal of the chamber and can vent to atmosphere without producing bubbles inside the chamber. It does have a distinctive sound though. Just my $.02

Thanks Kurtis, I have 6 brake chambers. How can I detect which one is leaking if soapy water won’t identify it?

I took time to video the underside and the parts that I have been soaping down. Here is a link if you are curious. Underside of 2006 Beaver

 My next step is to use pinch off pliers and pinch off the air lines to each chamber one at a time to see if I can get the air leak to stop. Hopefully this will identify a bad chamber. 

3 hours ago, jacwjames said:

In 2021, as I was getting my rig ready to travel after years of sitting, I did a bleed down test.  I charged the system to full pressure and shut it off and walked away, it took almost a week for the air to bleed down enough for the alarm to sound when I turned on the key.  This is what I was use to so I thought all was good.

Took one long trip June-July without a problem.  I then took a trip in Nov and parked/camped one night and in the AM, when I turned the key the low air alarm went off, I thought hmmmm ?????????????  But continued my trip and every night the air would bleed down so when I was parked for several days I decided to take a quick look, and started spraying soapy water.  Didn't take long to see the problem, all 4 of my Pressure Protection Valves were leaking, one much worse then the others.  The rig could easily keep up while driving and even passed the air brake test so I continued my trip.  Then when I was at a national park and stopped at the visitor center to look at the display and went back to the rig after ~45 minutes the alarm went off, I lost almost all the air pressure. 

That's when I decided to head home and fix the leaks.  Not really that difficult and cost to replace all the PPV's and other fittings was less then $200. 

Out of curiosity I took the PPV's apart, every one of them had severe corrosion.  Not sure why, never had a problem with my air dryer, no water in system.  But when I did some research the installation document for a PPV showed that they were originally stalled upside down.  There is a weep hole that is suppose to be pointing down so when it was originally pointed up any moisture in the valve would stay and probably caused the corrosion.  Attached is a picture of the PPV taken apart, all the white stuff is corrosion on the spring.  My guess is that as the PPV was being worked small flakes of the stuff would flake off and cause the diaphragm to leak. 

 

Jim, thanks. I’ll see if I can locate these on my rig and give them the soapy water treatment. I’d love for that to be my problem and to just replace them 

On 3/2/2023 at 5:25 AM, Jdw12345 said:

So are you saying that when your wife applies the service brakes with the parking brake released you hear the air leak?

 If so, you might have an air leak on the service side of the brake canister, there’s what’s called a pancake in the canister that can fail and leak when the service brakes are applied, sometimes a broken emergency spring can break and cause the leak.

 So, block the wheels so the coach can not roll, air up the coach and have your wife release the parking brake, wait for a minute and then have her set the parking brake, if you hear any type of clunking noise you possibly might have a broken spring on the emergency side of brake canister, if you hear anything other than air rushing through the brake lines there’s a chance of a bad or worn brake chamber.

 If you need to replace a brake canister get a complete canister, don’t purchase what’s called a “piggyback” that’s just the emergency side of the canister, I would stay away from less expensive brand canister’s, we’re talking about your brakes here!  MGM brand is possibly what’s on your coach and a very good brand, they should cost you about 150 bucks for a complete canister, they are available at any heavy duty truck dealers, Peterbilt, Kenworth, Freightliner, possibly NAPA etc. 

If you have a tag axle it’s possible that you could have a leaking pancake on the service brake on the tag axle, the tag axle does not have a emergency side to the canister, only a service side. The pancake is serviceable but can be kinda of a pain to deal with the clamp on it, but it’s certainly possible to do.

        

Now, if you are comfortable with changing the canister out, just google it and watch some videos, if not by all means take it to a trk shop and have them do it, it’s only about a 45 minute job to change out a brake canister. Make sure if you do the work that you get the air hoses back on the canister on the correct port, there’s two air lines going to each canister on the drive axle, one for the parking brake, ie emergency side, and one going to the service side. 
If you do have a bad break canister I would recommend changing out both of them, again, we’re talking about your brakes! You will have to back the brakes off manually to do this job and you’ll have to cut the 
 

 If you go to a parts house to purchase the parts they will most likely ask you what size you need, I’m 99% positive that you’ll need what’s called a 30-30 with a 2 1/2” stroke, it has to do with the size of the chambers and the stroke.

 

 I put a couple of links down below for reference. If you google a 30-30 brake canister you’ll be able to find all kinds for sale, anywhere from 45-50 bucks on up, the choice is yours. After making a living in the trucking business some things are not worth taking the cheapest route, brakes are not one of them, IMO.

 

 After all of that, it’s possibly you may only need to replace a brake line or fitting!

 If you changed out a brake valve I’m assuming you are not to afraid of working on your coach or have some degree of mechanical confidence!

One last item, if you change out your brake canister, by all means, do not get curious and cut the band that holds the canister together!  There’s a spring in there that is extremely dangerous!

https://www.fleetpride.com/parts/air-system/chambers/spring-brake-chamber/mgm-brakes-spring-brake-chamber-3430051?cclcl=en_US

https://www.googleadservices.com/pagead/aclk?sa=L&ai=DChcSEwiBtPakjL39AhWwyZQJHU9fCkEYABAHGgJ5bQ&ae=2&ohost=www.google.com&cid=CAESbOD2FVn_QsdM0g2w6UPu0K0ExzACVMUBpxS3x1Om6o8sR0MApjsEHxIoYz-NAFOQ8K9hwp04HMAufamii11ZKQPH22p0zzqBZbnjcEmZLPHU0STwT55rq2JXFZepm4A2DFVOPJQNIbb5gxfmjA&sig=AOD64_152bD8N0zEz4oMOtg9hzfTOWiqow&ctype=5&q=&ved=2ahUKEwjts-6kjL39AhWRnGoFHR9oAKMQ5bgDKAB6BAgDEBY&adurl=

Thanks Jeff. 

I've sprayed soapy water on the brake cannisters and see no bubbling. I will test the parking brake to see if there are any noises from the chambers.  

My brake cannisters face outward. They compress the calipers. I've seen several videos where they connect to a level that is connected to the brakes. Mine aren't like that on the drive axel. 

Thanks for responding. I definitely have a leak. When applying the brakes with the engine off, my tanks drop 60 - 70 PSI within a minute.  We were backing into a site and the brakes would not hold the rig. We had to apply the parking brake and allow air to build up. I have plenty of air for a hard stop, but constant application of the brake causes PSI to drop.