basement compartment door not fully closing

[Jim McGarvie]

Our right rear basement compartment door is not closing all the way. the trailing edge is tight and flush, but the leading edge is a good 3/8" from fully closed. Looking from below I can see there is a significant gap between the door and the seal.

Looking along the hinge (top) edge it appears the door is well outboard of the adjacent door at the leading edge, but right where it belongs at the trailing edge. I tried removing the forward strut and the door latch, but neither of those helped.

Has anyone else encountered this and found a solution? I am considering attempting to remove the door and check out the upper channel where it hinges.

Best,

Jim

[Bob Nodine]

10 hours ago, Jim McGarvie said:

Our right rear basement compartment door is not closing all the way. the trailing edge is tight and flush, but the leading edge is a good 3/8" from fully closed. Looking from below I can see there is a significant gap between the door and the seal.

Looking along the hinge (top) edge it appears the door is well outboard of the adjacent door at the leading edge, but right where it belongs at the trailing edge. I tried removing the forward strut and the door latch, but neither of those helped.

Has anyone else encountered this and found a solution? I am considering attempting to remove the door and check out the upper channel where it hinges.

Best,

Jim

Check and see if you can adjust the piano hinge on the door. There will be many screws holding it and they will not be easy to get loose.

 

[Jim McGarvie]

2 hours ago, Bob Nodine said:

Check and see if you can adjust the piano hinge on the door. There will be many screws holding it and they will not be easy to get loose.

 

Thanks, Bob, but ours doesn't have piano hinges. It looks like by drilling out a rivet I might be able to slide the door out the end of the channel and see if I can see what is going on.

[Jim McGarvie]

On 3/1/2020 at 7:41 AM, Jim McGarvie said:

Thanks, Bob, but ours doesn't have piano hinges. It looks like by drilling out a rivet I might be able to slide the door out the end of the channel and see if I can see what is going on.

Well, I drilled out the rivet but couldn't slide the door all the way out of the channel/rail because it is blocked by a vertical trim strip. So I am still stymied. Anyone have any more ideas?

 

[jacwjames]

What vertical piece of trim is your door hitting. 

I had to remove 4 of my doors to repair 3, including the very rear one.   There was one rivet at the very end that I had to drill out but once that was done I just slide the door out.   I did have to replace the coach & door portion of the hinge on 3 doors where my wife had hit a post.   The hinge was flattened where it would not work.  Luckily the doors were salvageable. 

Unless the door is warped, and/or the hinges are loose hard to tell what might be causing your problem.  Can you post some pictures. 

[Jim McGarvie]

19 hours ago, jacwjames said:

What vertical piece of trim is your door hitting. 

I had to remove 4 of my doors to repair 3, including the very rear one.   There was one rivet at the very end that I had to drill out but once that was done I just slide the door out.   I did have to replace the coach & door portion of the hinge on 3 doors where my wife had hit a post.   The hinge was flattened where it would not work.  Luckily the doors were salvageable. 

Unless the door is warped, and/or the hinges are loose hard to tell what might be causing your problem.  Can you post some pictures. 

"Trim" is probably the wrong word. It covers the joint between the side and the rear cap. Please see attached photos. In the photos the door is latched closed and the trailing edge of the door is flush as it should be. I can force the lower forward corner of the door in tight, but the upper corner stays out where it is.

Thanks for any suggestions!

 

[jacwjames]

OK, now I see.  You will probably have to remove the doors going forward.

Also, from the looks of the picture it appears as if the trim piece with the plastic cover insert has pulled loose from the side of the coach.   I believe the hinge is mounted under the piece and allows the door to protrude out.  My guess is you'll have to remove the plastic strip and then take out the old screws and install new.  If the holes are rusted out you may have to use a larger screw and/or drill new holes.   If you are careful pulling the plastic piece our you'll be able to put it right back and never know you removed it.   Hopefully others will chime in.

I had to replace both hinge pieces on 2 doors and the piece mounted to the door on the 3rd door.  My wife damaged 3 doors pulling out of a filling station, completely smashed the hinge under the front slide and did a little damage to the slide trim also. 

[Jim McGarvie]

26 minutes ago, jacwjames said:

OK, now I see.  You will probably have to remove the doors going forward.

Also, from the looks of the picture it appears as if the trim piece with the plastic cover insert has pulled loose from the side of the coach.   I believe the hinge is mounted under the piece and allows the door to protrude out.  My guess is you'll have to remove the plastic strip and then take out the old screws and install new.  If the holes are rusted out you may have to use a larger screw and/or drill new holes.   If you are careful pulling the plastic piece our you'll be able to put it right back and never know you removed it.   Hopefully others will chime in.

I had to replace both hinge pieces on 2 doors and the piece mounted to the door on the 3rd door.  My wife damaged 3 doors pulling out of a filling station, completely smashed the hinge under the front slide and did a little damage to the slide trim also. 

Thanks Jim. I'm afraid you are probably right. A little more work than I was hoping for, but should be doable.

[Guest Ray Davis]

 The door is most likely warped ,  probably by someone pushing on one side while something was in the way on the other side .

 It may just need warping back the other way 

 When I was at a body shop they had a car door  that was warped like that 

 They put a short piece of 2x4 in the bottom of the door opening and pushed on the top until the door fit .

If my door was like that I would try that before removing it 

Place the 2x4 or whatever you use so that it is not against the painted outer skin , the frame part of thee door is what you need

to straighten.

[Jim McGarvie]

1 hour ago, Ray Davis said:

 The door is most likely warped ,  probably by someone pushing on one side while something was in the way on the other side .

 It may just need warping back the other way 

 When I was at a body shop they had a car door  that was warped like that 

 They put a short piece of 2x4 in the bottom of the door opening and pushed on the top until the door fit .

If my door was like that I would try that before removing it 

Place the 2x4 or whatever you use so that it is not against the painted outer skin , the frame part of thee door is what you need

to straighten.

Thanks Ray, tried that. I think the problem this time is up at the top of the door, in the hinge area.

[jacwjames]

I went out and looked at my trim, the plastic piece completely covers the channel, can't remember how I removed.  My Class C had the other type where the plastic was inserted into the channel..

Also, looking at the picture it does appear the upper hinge portion has pulled away from the coach so you will definitely have to see what's going on.   I would make sure to use Stainless Steel screws to reattach.  Don't why Monaco (and other builders) use cheap screws in a critical application. 

[Jim McGarvie]

14 minutes ago, jacwjames said:

I went out and looked at my trim, the plastic piece completely covers the channel, can't remember how I removed.  My Class C had the other type where the plastic was inserted into the channel..

Also, looking at the picture it does appear the upper hinge portion has pulled away from the coach so you will definitely have to see what's going on.   I would make sure to use Stainless Steel screws to reattach.  Don't why Monaco (and other builders) use cheap screws in a critical application. 

Well, if you remember how you removed it please let me know. I haven't figured that part out yet but I'm afraid you're right that I will have to remove it.

[jacwjames]

Here is a link to an IRV2 post that discusses, seems like they had a problem similar to yours.   There were a bunch other posts so

https://www.irv2.com/forums/f115/molding-removal-454530.html

Here is another post from rvforum.net that has better detail.

http://www.rvforum.net/SMF_forum/index.php/topic,77896.msg706601.html#msg706601

Maybe someone else will chime in. 

 

[Jim McGarvie]

37 minutes ago, jacwjames said:

Here is a link to an IRV2 post that discusses, seems like they had a problem similar to yours.   There were a bunch other posts so

https://www.irv2.com/forums/f115/molding-removal-454530.html

Here is another post from rvforum.net that has better detail.

http://www.rvforum.net/SMF_forum/index.php/topic,77896.msg706601.html#msg706601

Maybe someone else will chime in. 

 

Thanks Jim, I'll check those out.

[Guest Ray Davis]

 

 Hi Jim , the other Jim has posted 2 very good threads .

 After looking at your pictures and it being pointed out I see what appears to be the hinge / trim pulling away .

 This is not an uncommon repair but it is usually at the upper belt where the roof and wall meets ..

 I believe the repair will be pretty much the same  and Rex Darley RIP wrote a paper on his procedure , it is in the files 

 It may not even be necessary to remove the doors to do the repair .

 If you carefully cut the caulk along top and bottom the trim can be carefully removed without ruining the paint .

Here is Rex's paper----

 

Rick this is not a difficult repair to make. You should be OK driving back home with the area loose unless you are in rain. If in rain I would just stop and let it pass.

There is a rubber like cover over a metal strip where the roof joins the side wall. The metal strip is screwed on and the screws rust out and pop loose.

To repair, use a sharp carton knife and slice through the caulk on top and bottom of the rubber like cover. You most likely have full body paint so be very careful in this process. The caulk was placed and then painted. If your are careful you will not damage the paint.

The rubber cover angles down on the top and up on the bottom about 20 - 30 degrees and you should be able to cut it so the rubber will come off. Do this on a warm day and cut the caulk at least 12 inches past where the strip is pulled loose on each end.

Gently roll the rubber with your fingers and it should pop off. Use great care not to pull it as that can crack the paint. Work slowly and remove it where the caulk is cut.

Now drill new holes in between where the screws are and use 3/16 rivets as long as you can find. I got some that were 1/2 inch at Ace Hardware. Set the rivets in the new hole through the metal backer, roof and side wall. Press the rivet hard against the wall before you try to set them.

When finished put the rubber strip back on the metal backer and caulk using CLEAR Geocell 2300 or Proflex RV caulk. Use blue painters tape and mask off the area to be caulked about an 1/8 inch on either side. Place the caulk, then spray it with a solution of water and dish soap. Use your finger to smooth it. Now remove the tape and spray and wipe it again and you are finished.

Make sure you do not leave any tape on the painted area longer than needed when you caulk as it can cause the clear coat to come off if left to long.

Rex Darley 01 Diplomat 40 PBD
 

[Jim McGarvie]

22 hours ago, Ray Davis said:

 

 Hi Jim , the other Jim has posted 2 very good threads .

 After looking at your pictures and it being pointed out I see what appears to be the hinge / trim pulling away .

 This is not an uncommon repair but it is usually at the upper belt where the roof and wall meets ..

 I believe the repair will be pretty much the same  and Rex Darley RIP wrote a paper on his procedure , it is in the files 

 It may not even be necessary to remove the doors to do the repair .

 If you carefully cut the caulk along top and bottom the trim can be carefully removed without ruining the paint .

Here is Rex's paper----

Thanks for that info, Ray.

[Jim McGarvie]

On 3/4/2020 at 9:27 AM, Ray Davis said:

 

 Hi Jim , the other Jim has posted 2 very good threads .

 After looking at your pictures and it being pointed out I see what appears to be the hinge / trim pulling away .

 This is not an uncommon repair but it is usually at the upper belt where the roof and wall meets ..

 I believe the repair will be pretty much the same  and Rex Darley RIP wrote a paper on his procedure , it is in the files 

 It may not even be necessary to remove the doors to do the repair .

 If you carefully cut the caulk along top and bottom the trim can be carefully removed without ruining the paint .

Here is Rex's paper----

 

Rick this is not a difficult repair to make. You should be OK driving back home with the area loose unless you are in rain. If in rain I would just stop and let it pass.

There is a rubber like cover over a metal strip where the roof joins the side wall. The metal strip is screwed on and the screws rust out and pop loose.

To repair, use a sharp carton knife and slice through the caulk on top and bottom of the rubber like cover. You most likely have full body paint so be very careful in this process. The caulk was placed and then painted. If your are careful you will not damage the paint.

The rubber cover angles down on the top and up on the bottom about 20 - 30 degrees and you should be able to cut it so the rubber will come off. Do this on a warm day and cut the caulk at least 12 inches past where the strip is pulled loose on each end.

Gently roll the rubber with your fingers and it should pop off. Use great care not to pull it as that can crack the paint. Work slowly and remove it where the caulk is cut.

Now drill new holes in between where the screws are and use 3/16 rivets as long as you can find. I got some that were 1/2 inch at Ace Hardware. Set the rivets in the new hole through the metal backer, roof and side wall. Press the rivet hard against the wall before you try to set them.

When finished put the rubber strip back on the metal backer and caulk using CLEAR Geocell 2300 or Proflex RV caulk. Use blue painters tape and mask off the area to be caulked about an 1/8 inch on either side. Place the caulk, then spray it with a solution of water and dish soap. Use your finger to smooth it. Now remove the tape and spray and wipe it again and you are finished.

Make sure you do not leave any tape on the painted area longer than needed when you caulk as it can cause the clear coat to come off if left to long.

Rex Darley 01 Diplomat 40 PBD
 

Thanks to all that offered advice. It was very helpful. Turned out to be easier than I expected. I removed the rubber (vinyl? plastic?) insert in the channel, removed the screws ( some of which broke in the process), and removed one section of the metal channel along with the rear-most door that wasn't closing tightly. I never did find anything obviously causing the problem, but I cleaned out the hinge channels, closed one of them up a bit where it looked like it had spread, drilled all new holes in the channel and reattached it and the door with new screws. The door now closes flush with the adjacent door.l

[Steven P]

Jim, I believe what you are calling trim is your beltline which holds is where the walls are seamed together.  Those broken screws should be replaced with stainless steel rivets. A "popped" beltline will allow water in and you do not want that.  Once I redid mine, I used clear proflex rv caulk to seal. 

[Jim McGarvie]

1 hour ago, Steven P said:

Jim, I believe what you are calling trim is your beltline which holds is where the walls are seamed together.  Those broken screws should be replaced with stainless steel rivets. A "popped" beltline will allow water in and you do not want that.  Once I redid mine, I used clear proflex rv caulk to seal.

Thanks, Steven. Yes, that is the same as mine. Thanks for letting me know the proper term. As I wrote I already replaced all the old screws with new screws, not rivets, but I did seal it with Pro Flex.

[Steven P]

If you didn't use stainless steel screws, you may want to plan to change those out in the future as the new ones will likely rust too.   I followed Chris Throgmartin 's instructions  to hopefully only do this one time. 

[Jim McGarvie]

3 minutes ago, Steven P said:

If you didn't use stainless steel screws, you may want to plan to change those out in the future as the new ones will likely rust too.   I followed Chris Throgmartin 's instructions  to hopefully only do this one time. 

Yeah, I know. I couldn't find the screws I wanted in stainless. But the original screws--also not stainless--lasted 18 years, so if these last that long they will have outlived the coach!

 

[Bob Nodine]

5 hours ago, Jim McGarvie said:

Yeah, I know. I couldn't find the screws I wanted in stainless. But the original screws--also not stainless--lasted 18 years, so if these last that long they will have outlived the coach!

 

ACE Hardware has a good selection of stainless screws. Chris T. says to use 3/16 by 7/8" grip small flange blind rivets made of 304 stainless.

https://www.albanycountyfasteners.com/POP-Rivets-3-16-304-Stainless-Steel-p/11950000.htm

 

[Mike H]

44 minutes ago, Bob Nodine said:

ACE Hardware has a good selection of stainless screws. Chris T. says to use 3/16 by 7/8" grip small flange blind rivets made of 304 stainless.

https://www.albanycountyfasteners.com/POP-Rivets-3-16-304-Stainless-Steel-p/11950000.htm

 

That's one thing Chris told us at the gathering to use SS rivets because the screws will eventually loosen due to how our coaches twist and vibrate etc.