Deep Cycle Battery Magic Renewal Solution. Should it be used?

[VinceB]

 

Snake oil or legit?

https://www.amazon.com/Battery-Renew-Solution-Golf-Batteries/dp/B0CBGCS57D/ref=sr_1_14?crid=NXFTI4XLUYSN&keywords=t-105+battery&qid=1706754774&sprefix=%2Caps%2C138&sr=8-14

 

[Frank Bergamo]

This is the one I use, https://www.amazon.com/Solder-Heavy-Duty-Concentrate-Desulfator-Reactivator/dp/B004DJCS2M/ref=asc_df_B004DJCS2M/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=312430092407&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=12954903828794155486&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=t&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9029187&hvtargid=pla-569344398416&mcid=d9135b1ddce43948a8243b14e50ba3de&gclid=CjwKCAiA_OetBhAtEiwAPTeQZ8aDYRKfzOEr0cts-4C9YwFP4QbnM29lIUMV7E-8GXB0-Wg8nVCJJBoCfvAQAvD_BwE&th=1  If the battery has not froze, this will restore it, have used it many times with excellent results.

[Tom Cherry]

EDIT….

I clicked on the Amazon Link a few minutes ago.  TOTALLY different product than this morning.  Almost the same AD COPY.

A note in this cooy….

• Please Note: Battery Renew Solution will not work for Gel batteries, batteries with completely dry cells, or batteries that are frozen or were previously frozen

BUT….read on…..

End Edit

https://assets.ctfassets.net/nh2mdhlonj7m/2esLGloP5ChP4KocdA2WXJ/59b06fa2c58bb4a1384cd03cdc21c735/Trojan-Battery-Maintenance-Guide-TRJN0110-2019.pdf

Notice that Trojan says ONLY Distilled WATER....no ACIDS or such

https://assets.ctfassets.net/nh2mdhlonj7m/6lQJqxzrc3Yh5dg8HNHknR/85b0d103cb3f5f85f8ba2b7c3c3ab27b/2023005-Users-Guide-FLOODED-AES-AGM-GEL-WEB.pdf

See Page 14 for more information.

The Monacoer's Battery 101 was compiled from many sources...  Some Manufacturer's recommendations. Some from "trusted" users that sold and maintained batteries. NONE SAID TO USE ANYTHING SAVE DISTILLED WATER.

I was the Engineering Manager for the second largest carburetor company in the US for many years.  We were purchased by Weber....and I was involved in evaluations of "miracle carburetors".  Purchased many...actually went to a few of the "Garage" factories and drove their test cars.

We never found a MIRACLE Carburetor that was even close to the "hype".  We also knew that GM and our largest aftermarket competitor and ourselves were NOT part of some conspiracy and we were NOT getting Swiss Bank accounts full of cash from all the global oil companies.

My take...  It is like the recent Topic of "Equalization" as a preventative maintenance solution to maximize battery life. Trojan and LifeLine publishes "Manuals". The consensus....  IF your batteries have not been properly maintained and are subpar....  TRY IT....but be aware that it also might accelerate their decline.  Sort of a "LAST DITCH...what have I got to lose? scenario.

I have actually KILLED a set of Trojan GC batteries.....or the same T105's that we use.  HOW DID I DO THAT? I left the cart on my wife's farm and the cells never were "Watered".  When you let the electrolyte level drop below the top of the plates, then the Lead DiOxide coating "DRIES OUT"...

All lead-acid batteries consist of two flat plates—a positive plate covered with lead dioxide and a negative made of sponge lead—that are immersed in a pool of electrolyte (a combination of sulfuric acid (35%) and water solution (65%).  

https://pulsetech.com/pages/lead-acid-batteries.html#:~:text=All lead-acid batteries consist,and water solution (65%).

The above is a great technical discussion with practical comments....it may be included or edited into the Battery 101 File.

NOTE.... When a battery fails, the "scaling Lead DiOxide" coating chips or peels off. Then it collects in the bottom of the cells. Eventually, there is enough buildup so that the space between the bottom of the plates is filled with this coating. This then SHORTS OUT that Cell. When folks ask "I got a battery with only 4.X VDC reading, how to I fix that? The insensitive answer is.  Take it to a Recycler and sell it and use the funds to purchase new. 

The simple physics or common sense.  If you turn up the battery and dump out whatever is in there, you do NOT get the scaling Lead DiOxide to fall out.  Even if you DID, the coating on the plates is now compromised.  The battery is designed for 100% coating of the plates to produce or make the "Galvanic" cell work. An uncoated plate is only as effective as the total amount of the COATED surface.

THEN, adding a "new solution" might show some negligible results...as in the electrolyte is NOT contaminated. BUT, the issue is that the coating of the plates is "shot" and the battery will never achieve the original SOC. 

NOW, as a "PREVENTATIVE"? Again Trojan says NO.  I can tell you that in some cases, some of the Industrial Lift Truck Battery services will "reverse" clean the plates.  BUT, these are on plates that have much thicker coatings. YES, they do pump out and filter the electrolyte and then "check the concentration" and refill. They understand the chemistry and physics and also can measure the amount of deterioration and have the equipment to do such.

BUT, they do NOT work on GC Batteries.  Interstate will rejuvenate a battery, under warranty.  They do actually do an equalization and that "sort of" of cleans the plates. They do not dump and refill. They then recharge. That will bring back an older, not often used, battery. I got an extra 2 years out of a 5 year cranking battery on a Vette that would not "take a charge". I actually watched the process. They put it on a very slow and controlled 3 phase charger overnight....much like our Chargers work.

BUT, they did not have any potion or magic elixir....

BUT, your mileage may vary.  If you DO use this, then the OEM Warranty is gone....

The only other closing comment is from a long discussion that I had with a tech at a friend's HR Dealership. He worked for Lazy Days for 20 years and was considered as one of their best "Electrical Techs". We discussed batteries and he was a 100% Trojan person. He recounted that when owners did not do PM and bring in a MH with dead batteries, he would look at the dates (usually stamped on a post or on the case). The would check the cells and get a rough idea of just how far down the electrolyte was below the top of the plates.

His recommendation was that if they were Interstates, then it was marginal to refill and charge them back up. If they were Trojan's and were not that far down....he would recommend refilling and recharging.

The customer decided what to do based on the maintenance or just replacing.  He said that 80% of the Interstates got returned for a new set. He said that only 20% of the Trojan's were returned. That spanned almost 20 years. The techs also sat through manufacturer's seminars.

They did NOT have any special "restoration" equipment like the commercial lift truck battery folks had. They did NOT have any special "treatment" that they added. They followed the Manufacturer's guidelines....  

So....  that's my understanding and take on it....

YES, I have done things that were short term fixes on a variety of home as well as Commercial and Industrial pieces of equipment and I supervised two different 100 Man Maintenance departments during my career...

Your CALL....your Batteries.  Hard to beat doing the PM.  I know the consequences...and I admit to my stupidity....but that was one instance and I get 7 - 9 years from a set of Trojans and got 4 years from the OEM interstates....and the MH had set for many months on the dealer's lot, new...before I bought it...

 

[cbr046]

@Tom Cherry, are saying you DON'T recommend this battery restoration company?  Seems legit to me 🤣🤣🤣 

Cheers,

- bob

[Tom Cherry]

1 hour ago, cbr046 said:

@Tom Cherry, are saying you DON'T recommend this battery restoration company?  Seems legit to me 🤣🤣🤣 

Cheers,

- bob

OMG…..I just LOOKED at the 10 Minute Video. Luigi Galvani would be amazed and PROUD!!!!

This is great.  A TEACHING MOMENT with visuals.

The black murky substance is the Lead DiOxide that has dissolved or peeled off the plates.

If you look closely when the worker is reassembling the plates, you can see the “matrix or mesh” of the substrates.

AS USUAL, I totally respect the industriousness and ingenuity of the ethnic group disolsyed here,  I built and closed and worked in several plants in Mexico and Brasil…...  What is missing in formal education is made up for in ingenuity and common sense…..Very industrious and ingenious.  I first thiught that thr wcid was being dumped into s sanitary sewer.  NOPE.  We missed the filtration from the “in floor” tank.  From my EX Safety Director’s overview…..no gloves, glasses or aprons….  BUT the norm.

This is great. It totally provides a great visual of “WHY” there is no magic potion.  My bet.  The SOC is about 50%, at best. BUT….the service life is extended…as in the Lead DiOxide (dark gunk) will NOT rise or get under the plate pack and totally short it out.

THANKS A BUNCH!

My first thought…..but totally wrong, was that they were dumping…..

If you look at it, without watching the video…..then you night appreciate the following….or not.

Skim or ignore the rest……Right up there with the photos of the “LICENSED Hazardous Waste Disposal Crew” that I helped remediate after they were resourceful.  They resembled the two mountain men that kidnapped the “canoers” in “Deliverance”.  They drove their truck down and around and found a pristine site for their afternoon picnic and “shine testing”.  While they discussed the innate flavours and aromatic nuances of their “clear quart jar” liquid…..their truck was draining a dark substance into a nearby creek.  The logo on the side of the truck said something about Transformer Repair or maybe PCB’s….whatever they be.

They were licensed by WV for plumbing, outhouse pumping and “PCB” related tasks…. 

I’ll share with former peers. I can offer a “sequel” to the consequences of their discharges….  I had to “reline” almost 2,750 feet or about 0.5 miles of 6” expanding to 8” cast iron sanitary sewer line.  INSITUFORM. Broke the $250K price….that reduced the cost to only $91 in 1990.

https://www.www.aegion.com/insituform

My “problem children” Dynamic Duo….a Notre Dame Chemist and a “can fix anything” Plant Engineer decided to descale the main steam process boiler.  Their “buffered” acid concoction were a wee bit more potent than they calculated.  They drained the acid, after circulating in the heat exchanger” into the condensate drain.  It ate up the pipe.  The upstream section was from a 100 employee office, made up of mostly “still child bearing” aged females.  One can guess at the sanitary supplies sinking into the clay….sewer line was 6 ft down.  RotoRooter “jet stream drilled” a 20 ft tunnel UNDER the open area and we used a lift truck to extricate his hose and rig….otherwise a $5K surcharge.

YES….I can accurately predict the condition of the sewer in this picture.  COOL….will distribute…..

 

[b_faster]

My “problem children” Dynamic Duo….a Notre Dame Chemist and a “can fix anything” Plant Engineer decided to descale the main steam process boiler.  Their “buffered” acid concoction were a wee bit more potent than they calculated.  They drained the acid, after circulating in the heat exchanger” into the condensate drain.  It ate up the pipe.

 

I have had to put measures in place for this scenario, if 15% HCL doesn't achieve desired results 100% "Will get her done".   Carbon steel really doesn't like being treated that way.  

 

I spent some time in West Africa, I was impressed by the enthusiasm and ingenuity.  Unfortunately, it didn't always offset the lack of knowledge.  

PS @Tom Cherry, you are retired now.  I want one of those 400 MPG heat driven carburetors.  Surely the Big Oil NDA has expired.  😄

Edited February 2 by b_faster

[Tom Cherry]

1 hour ago, b_faster said:

My “problem children” Dynamic Duo….a Notre Dame Chemist and a “can fix anything” Plant Engineer decided to descale the main steam process boiler.  Their “buffered” acid concoction were a wee bit more potent than they calculated.  They drained the acid, after circulating in the heat exchanger” into the condensate drain.  It ate up the pipe.

 

I have had to put measures in place for this scenario, if 15% HCL doesn't achieve desired results 100% "Will get her done".   Carbon steel really doesn't like being treated that way.  

 

I spent some time in West Africa, I was impressed by the enthusiasm and ingenuity.  Unfortunately, it didn't always offset the lack of knowledge.  

PS @Tom Cherry, you are retired now.  I want one of those 400 MPG heat driven carburetors.  Surely the Big Oil NDA has expired.  😄

My Dynamic Duo fixed a lot of things and the ND Chem E was brilliant. But they “conceived” but rarely tested first. They also were “fishing buddies” and would come in early of Saturday and get the maintenance guys started.  One would mix the potion and they other would rig up a system.  Then, they left and popped a cool one when they cleared the parking lot.  They once totally “cleaned” an internal chilled water system,  Found some new chemical or read an article, BUT….failed to read the “neutralize” for an hour and flush for two.  The maintenance guys left it in.  When the 3rd shift started up the 100 injection molding machines on Sunday night, it was a “fountain” rivaling one in Vegas.  Each injection molding die had copper fittings and quick disconnect water lines.  The descaling chemicals were not deaigned for Copper.  The tool room spent 3 days, round the clock, refurbishing all the dies and maintenance spent 2 days replacing fittings….

PS….I was paid or bribed handsomely for NOT spilling the beans.  Then some German company named BOSCH figured out how to do EFI….