Which wiring diagram?

[saflyer]

I have a 2005 HR Ambassador. I understand it is the twin of the Monaco Knight. When searching for wiring diagrams in the files section there are 2002 Knight-Ambassador and 2006 Knight. Any guidance on which I should use?

[Tom Cherry]

I’d use the 2006.  There was a continuous evolution of wiring upgrades…primarily in how to charge the “chassis” while in storage.  The 05/06 years were the most “dubious” for the upper end (Dynasty and above)… as in that was a MAJOR change….but not for you…. Once that settled down the lower food chain models started to benefit.  For example, the 2008 was a total upgrade from the 05 - 07 Camelot/Scepter.

You’re pretty safe with the 2006…it will be close….just don’t make the “gospel”.  You may (probably) have a prewired trailer brake system…but Monaco got it messed early in 2005.  As long as you aren’t working on that, then you’re close.  Our rule of thumb, from a Moderator’s use….one up and one below and then “start to home in”.

[Gary M]

55 minutes ago, saflyer said:

I have a 2005 HR Ambassador. I understand it is the twin of the Monaco Knight. When searching for wiring diagrams in the files section there are 2002 Knight-Ambassador and 2006 Knight. Any guidance on which I should use?

I have a 2004 Knight Schematic with 50 pgs. Not sure how it compares to the 2006 of 50pgs.

[saflyer]

55 minutes ago, Tom Cherry said:

I’d use the 2006.  There was a continuous evolution of wiring upgrades…primarily in how to charge the “chassis” while in storage.  The 05/06 years were the most “dubious” for the upper end (Dynasty and above)… as in that was a MAJOR change….but not for you…. Once that settled down the lower food chain models started to benefit.  For example, the 2008 was a total upgrade from the 05 - 07 Camelot/Scepter.

You’re pretty safe with the 2006…it will be close….just don’t make the “gospel”.  You may (probably) have a prewired trailer brake system…but Monaco got it messed early in 2005.  As long as you aren’t working on that, then you’re close.  Our rule of thumb, from a Moderator’s use….one up and one below and then “start to home in”.

My present problem is the headlight are inop. One service center advised taking it to Freightliner. Does that make sense?

[cbr046]

21 minutes ago, saflyer said:

My present problem is the headlight are inop. One service center advised taking it to Freightliner. Does that make sense?

So basically they don't have a clue and want to pass the buck.  I doubt Freightliner will touch it.  IMO they'll point the finger at the coach manufacturer and not want to get into it either.  Now, if you can find a tech that will dig into wiring diagrams and actually chase wires . . . . Bonus if they have Gumby flexibility, too. 

And when you finally do find your gremlin let us know.  My headlights have been cutting out and I've yet to find the magic.  The last two 1 hour trips they worked perfectly.  Of course, they were daytime trips.  🤐

- bob

[saflyer]

22 minutes ago, cbr046 said:

So basically they don't have a clue and want to pass the buck.  I doubt Freightliner will touch it.  IMO they'll point the finger at the coach manufacturer and not want to get into it either.  Now, if you can find a tech that will dig into wiring diagrams and actually chase wires . . . . Bonus if they have Gumby flexibility, too. 

And when you finally do find your gremlin let us know.  My headlights have been cutting out and I've yet to find the magic.  The last two 1 hour trips they worked perfectly.  Of course, they were daytime trips.  🤐

- bob

I had running lights but no headlights, dim or bright. The tech got them working by inserting a relay in what he said was an empty slot in the front run bay. Don’t know why there was an empty slot. I never removed anything from it. Now no brights but the dims work all of the time regardless of switch position. To operate now I exit the coach and insert or remove that relay. We never drive at night but if something happened and I needed to I can now.

[Tom Cherry]

16 hours ago, saflyer said:

I had running lights but no headlights, dim or bright. The tech got them working by inserting a relay in what he said was an empty slot in the front run bay. Don’t know why there was an empty slot. I never removed anything from it. Now no brights but the dims work all of the time regardless of switch position. To operate now I exit the coach and insert or remove that relay. We never drive at night but if something happened and I needed to I can now.

There is NO good circuit on your MH, but this is how the majority of them work.  There is a SIGNAL coming from the Headlight switch. It goes to the HI/LO switch inside the steering column. That switch then controls the HIGH or the LOW. What the tech did was replace the Clearance Light Relay.  What that did and why it works....GOD ONLY KNOWS? 

You need to find a tech that can trace a circuit. There is a long running thread on "FIXING HEADLIGHTS".  The issue is...  There is a major Voltage drop inside the switch.  Folks put in TWO relays (that is what is in the picture) and have ONE for the BRIGHT and ONE for the DIM. They power them directly off the battery.

 

In your case, my bet is that the Headlight Switch is defective. If it is NOT sending a 12 VDC signal to the HI/LOW switch then that is the real culprit.  I am attaching TWO Topics or Links.  One is about how to add the relays.  The RELAYS depend on there being a GOOD Headlight Signal from the Headlight Switch. 

The second is on FINDING the commonly available Headlight switch. You can change out the Headlight switch yourself and it is easy.  That MIGHT just fix the Headlights....but you MUST FIRST pull the relay that the tech put in. The prints for your rig show a "Clearance" light relay...but I don't understand why it would make the headlights stay on, even after you turn off the switch.

IF changing the switch and then removing the relay "FIXES" it, you know it was a bad switch...which is a VERY COMMON PROBLEM..  

THEN, if the Headlights work (and I think....but will NOT BET...that they do), then you can either drive on or if they are TOO DIM (low voltage) add the two relays so they are direct powered.

That's my take on it...  Look at the print below.  This is for a RIG with the VIP wheel, but if you look at the circuit there is a FEED from the Headlight Switch directly to the HIGH/LOW switch and then each circuit goes to the pair of headlights.

That's it...  GOOD LUCK...

 

 

Headlights and Fog lights.pdf

[saflyer]

17 minutes ago, Tom Cherry said:

There is NO good circuit on your MH, but this is how the majority of them work.  There is a SIGNAL coming from the Headlight switch. It goes to the HI/LO switch inside the steering column. That switch then controls the HIGH or the LOW. What the tech did was replace the Clearance Light Relay.  What that did and why it works....GOD ONLY KNOWS? 

You need to find a tech that can trace a circuit. There is a long running thread on "FIXING HEADLIGHTS".  The issue is...  There is a major Voltage drop inside the switch.  Folks put in TWO relays (that is what is in the picture) and have ONE for the BRIGHT and ONE for the DIM. They power them directly off the battery.

 

In your case, my bet is that the Headlight Switch is defective. If it is NOT sending a 12 VDC signal to the HI/LOW switch then that is the real culprit.  I am attaching TWO Topics or Links.  One is about how to add the relays.  The RELAYS depend on there being a GOOD Headlight Signal from the Headlight Switch. 

The second is on FINDING the commonly available Headlight switch. You can change out the Headlight switch yourself and it is easy.  That MIGHT just fix the Headlights....but you MUST FIRST pull the relay that the tech put in. The prints for your rig show a "Clearance" light relay...but I don't understand why it would make the headlights stay on, even after you turn off the switch.

IF changing the switch and then removing the relay "FIXES" it, you know it was a bad switch...which is a VERY COMMON PROBLEM..  

THEN, if the Headlights work (and I think....but will NOT BET...that they do), then you can either drive on or if they are TOO DIM (low voltage) add the two relays so they are direct powered.

That's my take on it...  Look at the print below.  This is for a RIG with the VIP wheel, but if you look at the circuit there is a FEED from the Headlight Switch directly to the HIGH/LOW switch and then each circuit goes to the pair of headlights.

That's it...  GOOD LUCK...

 

 

Headlights and Fog lights.pdf 105.34 kB · 0 downloads

Great information Tom, especially the part about the light switch sending 12v to the dimmer switch. I’ll put it to work.

Thanks,          
Ed

[Robertpk]

Good afternoon to all. I also have a 2005 ambassador and the empty relay connector is for a daylight running lights. I have wiring diagram for 2005 ambassador.

2005 Ambassador wire diagrams.pdf

[saflyer]

4 hours ago, Robertpk said:

Good afternoon to all. I also have a 2005 ambassador and the empty relay connector is for a daylight running lights. I have wiring diagram for 2005 ambassador.

2005 Ambassador wire diagrams.pdf 16.23 MB · 4 downloads

Wow! That's great. I'm much more comfortable with the actual diagram for my coach.

Thanks

[Benjamin]

I didn't look through your wiring diagram, but the general rule when wacky stuff happens with electronics is "check your grounds".  Bad grounds can cause power to flow places it shouldn't, and do things you wouldn't think of.  A power probe is great for checking for voltage where there should be ground, a multi meter works just as well, but not as convenient.  Check under load, so with the lights on. 

[cbr046]

On 3/4/2024 at 3:49 PM, cbr046 said:

And when you finally do find your gremlin let us know.  My headlights have been cutting out and I've yet to find the magic.  The last two 1 hour trips they worked perfectly.  Of course, they were daytime trips.  🤐

@saflyer I found the gremlin, and the mysterious connector "under the dash".  Turns out it was inside the steering housing.  I was actually chasing something else when discovered.

One jumper is for headlights, the other is for running & marker lights. 

 

Next time I get a whiff of burning plastic I know where to look!

- bob

 

Edited March 15, 2024 by cbr046

[saflyer]

14 hours ago, cbr046 said:

@saflyer I found the gremlin, and the mysterious connector "under the dash".  Turns out it was inside the steering housing.  I was actually chasing something else when discovered.

One jumper is for headlights, the other is for running & marker lights. 

 

Next time I get a whiff of burning plastic I know where to look!

- bob

 

Thanks. I’ll look inside the steering housing.

[saflyer]

OK, opened the steering house. There was one connector of wires that led up the steering column to the steering wheel. It was difficult to pull out and inspect. 


Then this odd one. I’ve never seen anything like it. 

The end of whatever the above is.

 

And the label on the back side.

 

Then these three connectors with nothing to connect them to.

I’ll go in and check the wiring diagram but am not very good at reading them.

Does anyone have any guidance?

’05 HR Ambassador 

Edited March 16, 2024 by saflyer
Spelling

[Benjamin]

I suspect that's a circuit board with an alarm buzzer that's located there to be close to the driver. One tell tale is the shrink wrap has a hole above that round part.  Don't worry about dead end connectors, they built these motorhomes on a common wiring harness that has lots of extra loops of wire and dead ends for other options. 

 

Edited March 16, 2024 by Benjamin

[cbr046]

You can read the print on the wires for extra clues, but I don't see the same connector that I have (3x3 Molex style).  It may be shoved somewhere else under the dash.  So much fun laying on your back twisting your body around the driver's seat jammed between the steering column and the pedals. 

- bob

Edited March 16, 2024 by cbr046

[saflyer]

1 hour ago, Benjamin said:

I suspect that's a circuit board with an alarm buzzer that's located there to be close to the driver. One tell tale is the shrink wrap has a hole above that round part.  Don't worry about dead end connectors, they built these motorhomes on a common wiring harness that has lots of extra loops of wire and dead ends for other options. 

 

Wouldn’t be surprised if it’s a buzzer.