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2008 Knight 38PDQ


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GFCI in the bathroom not resetting, hastily installed new receptacle, did not fix problem. No 110V outlets energized forward of bedroom in the rear. Checked breakers in aft closet and all good. Anyone know if there are more breakers anywhere?

 Thanks in advance!

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Check to see if either of the round fusesin the inverter are popped out, we had a similar situation 3-4 years ago. I tried the same steps as you, replaced GFCI, then thought of checking the inverter.

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Oops, forgot to mention that I checked the inverter breaker, only one marked 30A. The inverter is a newer Magnum 2000, are there other breakers on this inverter?

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Do you have 110VAC to the GFCI you are trying to reset.  It won't reset if you don't have voltage to it.  If you do have voltage to it, then it is not you inverter.  For you confirm these the replacement GFCI was on the inverter manufacturer's Approved GFCI Breaker List?  Only specific manufacturer's breakers will work on certain inverters. 

  - Rick N 

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18 minutes ago, waterskier_1 said:

Do you have 110VAC to the GFCI you are trying to reset.  It won't reset if you don't have voltage to it.  If you do have voltage to it, then it is not you inverter.  For you confirm these the replacement GFCI was on the inverter manufacturer's Approved GFCI Breaker List?  Only specific manufacturer's breakers will work on certain inverters. 

  - Rick N 

To expound on Rick's post...which is good.  

First, not ALL GFCI's will work. I used to work for the Company that owned Eagle Electric....which we renamed Cooper Wiring Devices....and then Eaton bought Cooper....Eaton Wiring Devices. They and Leviton were the two top rated, per Magnum GFCI's for use with their inverters. Amazon sells both....maybe the Ace.  HD might, but Lowes has the "House" brand....BEWARE.  

Also, that GFCI SHOULD be a 20 Amp.  WHY mine did not have the T-Slot, I'll never know. You need a 20 THERE....or verify with the old one....

On the Magnum, It is a little tricky....and the upper food chain like (Dynasty or higher), there is an Aux Sub Panel. Your Diplomat should have a THREE pin CB arrangement. The 30 is for the Incoming Power. You have a 30 Amp breaker on the incoming (main 120 panel) and it is internally protected by the 30. There are TWO outgoing circuits...each has a 20 Amp pin breaker. These are "Tricky". You LOOK carefully...  BOTH should be pushed in.

OK...pulled your brochure and owner's manual. You have the same, I believe as mine.  There should be TWO outgoing (Line 1 and Line 2) Pin breakers. One is a dedicated circuit that goes to the Microwave. It does NOT go through the GFCI. Now, the diagram shows the Front TV without the GFCI.  Monaco sometimes GOOFED and wired it INTO the GFCI.

BUT, there is a GFCI Circuit. Did you measure the LINE side voltage on the GCFI when you installed it....or even hooked up, temporarily, with wire nuts a cut off extension cord to see if there was power. There are NO OTHER Breakers or fuses or such in the 120.  Two Romex's OUT and ONE in...

Next UP.  Your original ATS was the IOTA-50R. That was recalled as a FIRE hazard...but since Navistar owned Monaco, the liability did NOT fall to them. That switch SHOULD (recommended as in FIRE HAZARD) replaced. The ESCO LPT50BRD is what ESCO recommends and is the most reliable and also the best value.  Look into it.  IF you still have the IOTA...turn OFF the GENNY (CB on the Genny's control panel up front. Unplug the Line Cord. Then remove the cover and TIGHTEN all the terminal. If there are ANY signs of charring or black or smoke or whatever, discontinue the use and replace it....an ordinary House Hold or Residential Electrician can do this. It is NOT an RV tech job. The ONLY THING....read the input label.  Mark EACH Conductor....there are THREE.  LINE or Shore; Genny and LOAD or TO Main Panel. Make sure each is properly labeled and then follow the label or the wiring diagram on the new inverter.  Do not just pull them, 1, 2 and 3 and put them back in that order.  The LPT50BRD is different and other replacement ATS will vary....

Good Luck.

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Mike,

That model of Magnum Inverter, ME2012, only has one circuit breaker. A Magnum ME-2012-15B or ME-2012-20B will have the other circuit breakers.

Did you check your owner's manual for that information? It is readily available on page 20 (or page 26) of the PDF file.

If you don't have the manual, I have attached a link to one for you.

64-0002 Rev A (ME Series).indd (rvsolarstore.com)

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Thank you for that info…I’ll dig into that file in a few days time as we are on the road in the RV.

And Thanks to all who replied…such a wealth of knowledge in this group of people!

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1 hour ago, Dr4Film said:

Mike,

That model of Magnum Inverter, ME2012, only has one circuit breaker. A Magnum ME-2012-15B or ME-2012-20B will have the other circuit breakers.

Did you check your owner's manual for that information? It is readily available on page 20 (or page 26) of the PDF file.

If you don't have the manual, I have attached a link to one for you.

64-0002 Rev A (ME Series).indd (rvsolarstore.com)

Richard seems to have nailed it.  Monaco did a LOT of weird things, or maybe the “Purchasing Engineers” did.  The two blanks on the case tell the tale.

My Knowledge and insight….BEWARE.  OK…facts from the manual and reading posts and looking at the Knight manual and the inverter.

This is a REPLACEMENT.  It is a 2017.  Don’t know if the 3 Breaker model was used and someone went lower cost.  It AIN’T that old.

Don’t know the skill set or trouble shooting capability.  Will be simple, so don’t take offense.  We have folks that play music on a VOM and others that don’t know what VOM acronym is.  Take a few pictures of the back where the Romex cables are that carry the 120.  I would have thought that your GFCI a was bad, based on age.  hastily installing a non Inverter approved GFCI is a place to be reviewed…  I have seen certified elections revere wire and mess up a simple install…so, VERIFY…also if you did not purchase a Leviton or an EAton, I would do that..then test….NO JOY?  Read on.

Basics.  The inverter with power (Shore or Genny), either ON or OFF will put out incoming power. There are two (typical…and I think this is correct) AC ATS Relays on the main Printed Circuit Board or the control board.  My advice….start to look and identify what you have.  There will be a 30 amp breaker in the main panel.  Turn it OFF.  Remove the strain relief on both the incoming cables.  IF one side has TWO cables OUT and the other is only ONE….BINGO…the single is the Incoming 

IF there are only one incoming on each hole, then, you have to identify the Incoming versus outgoing.  Simple to do with a VOM or use an extension cord cut off and plug in any 120 VAC item.  Hook up the two wires for the cord to black and white and don’t sweat the green.  Turn on power.  This verifies incoming.  Turn off breaker and then put the test line of the other side.  IF you have outgoing power, then, odds are….the inverter is OK.

NOW…after a whole lot of helping folks and eons of time on the phone to Magnum….the ATS relays are one of the first failure points.  BUT, mine is 14 YO and fine.  magnums party line…over 5 years, can go bad. If you have incoming power and no outgoing….under a small load, that is why a cut off extension cord is handy as the VOM only tells voltage….but not under load…then you have some options.

The board is over $500.  In your case, the inverter is newer.  Putting in a board will be $200 or more labor at an authorized Magnum repair shop.  If mine fails, then all the fans and thermostats and other stuff are TOO OLD.  I plan on just replacing and doing it myself as it is less than an hour job.  I COULD do the board…but it is not cost justified.  The newer Magnum Pure Sine wave with the two 20 amp breakers…which I would have thought that you had originally….except it would have been a Modified Sine wave is around $1400 on Amazon or online.

OK..stop and let us know.  I can offer some more info and also help…but do the basics first…..find out if the Magnum is passing 120, under load…or replace the GFCI and see if that fixes it.  Good Luck.

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We were in the final moments of the purchase of this MH when we discovered the inverter was not working. We started to walk away because LaMesa RV did not want to replace the unit and they finally caved and replaced with the unit in the pic. Most likely the least expensive in stock. It has functioned fine since July of 17. I’ll be able to diagnose further once we get home early next week.

Once again, thank you for sharing your knowledge on my issue here. I will report back on my findings!

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1 hour ago, Capt Mike said:

We were in the final moments of the purchase of this MH when we discovered the inverter was not working. We started to walk away because LaMesa RV did not want to replace the unit and they finally caved and replaced with the unit in the pic. Most likely the least expensive in stock. It has functioned fine since July of 17. I’ll be able to diagnose further once we get home early next week.

Once again, thank you for sharing your knowledge on my issue here. I will report back on my findings!

Have you yet confirmed if you have 110VAC into the GFI breaker?  I hate for you to go down a bad inverter path when you only need the correct brand of GFCI  breaker. 

  -Rick N 

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Hi Rick, I have not yet been able to confirm if I have 110V into the GFCI outlet. We had a commitment out of town and will confirm on Tuesday or Wednesday.

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4 hours ago, waterskier_1 said:

Have you yet confirmed if you have 110VAC into the GFI breaker?  I hate for you to go down a bad inverter path when you only need the correct brand of GFCI  breaker. 

  -Rick N 

Ditto.  Sometimes a simple “brain gas expulsion” or an interruption like a phone call will result in a missed wire or reversing things.  It happens to those of us that no better and I am careful to check on things.  Mike, if you don’t own a VOM, I suggest you purchase one.  Their are good ones for trouble shooting without all the whistles and bells that I rarely use in the $35 range. 

Check the brand.  If not Eaton Wiring Devices or Leviton, get one of those.  Mark the wires you plan to take off and their position.  I suspect you have one piece of Romex on the upper “LINE” terminals and maybe 2 on the “LOAD”.  TURN OFF the 30 Amp breaker and also remove the House Bank positive terminal.  I don’t trust an inverter to be OFF.  Turn off the Genny at the control panel by flippin the dual breaker.  Remove GFCI and test…

Then, with incoming shore power or or turning on the Genny….and then turning on the 30 amp breaker, you should have 120 VAC on the “LINE” wire, black to white measured. That means the Inverter is passing through power…which it should..  IF NOT, THEN measure the OTHER WIRES.  If you find one with power and the other are “dead”.  That is your proper “LINE” wire and the rest are “LOAD”

Power off.  Reinstall the CORRECT BRAND GFCI..  power back on.  Reset the GFCI and you should be good to go.

Now, hook up the positive battery cable.  WITH SHORE OR GENNY ON (Don’t forget to turn Genny breaker ON).  HOLD IN the inverter power button for 20 odd seconds. This is a soft reset.  You ought to be good to go.  I sometimes have had to push  the “ON” button on the Magnum remote.

Let us know

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3 hours ago, Hugh1959 said:

I had refrigerator icemaker tripping  mine. Also unplug all outlets including front overhead compartments.  Good luck Hugh

That is common.  Your home Res Refer is on a dedicated circuit and NEC allows that, actually a Code requirement.  Same for Microwave.  The two circuit inverters have a single line to microwave.  But typically Monaco went cheap on the second.  Ran it straight to the GFCI, then downstream all loads were protected.  An icemaker will leak.  Not a fire hazard or a safety issue.  False tripping of a GFCI.  NEWER GFCI are sensitive…thanks to UL and Feds.  Older or original ones in MH, or houses for that matter, get crotchety and trip on a really low leak.

SOME Monaco had a split feed from GFCI.  TYPICALLY there was one to the galley, requiring GFCI and needed.  Other was to icemaker and front HEC.  I tested and isolated mine.  Put the front Romex On the “LINE” incoming side.  Left the Galley alone on the “LOAD” side.  Fixed it.  Really critical when you convert to Res Refer….otherwise your new beauty will shut off.  Best to also put in a NEW GFCI.

Good Point.

4 hours ago, Capt Mike said:

Hi Rick, I have not yet been able to confirm if I have 110V into the GFCI outlet. We had a commitment out of town and will confirm on Tuesday or Wednesday.

Hey….quick question?  Is your MICROWAVE working?  If so…you are PROBABLY OK…but have an incompatibility issue with your hastily installed GFCI or a mixup in the proper installation….

LET US KNOW…. you may have posted that but I missed it.

Thanks

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Last night the wife went to use microwave and it worked! Wow, some cerebral flatulence going on there! I have some hope now the inverter is ok! Still have to wait until we get home to check it all out.

Things are looking better!

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1 hour ago, Capt Mike said:

Last night the wife went to use microwave and it worked! Wow, some cerebral flatulence going on there! I have some hope now the inverter is ok! Still have to wait until we get home to check it all out.

Things are looking better!

Your Inverter, unless you have a “flukey” one is probably OK.  There are actually TWO ATS relays on the main board.  YES, one can go bad….but, my hunch is you need to fix the NEW GFCI.  The OEM was a 20Amp.  If you were like me, you grabbed a 15.  OPPS, back to the store.  Unless you are certain it was a 20A Eaton Wiring Devices or a Leviton, buy one and fix it.  Ace and HD (I think) or any good electrical supply house will have one or the other.  Do NOT get a Tamper  Proof.  
 

Follow the instructions that I gave.  OK…before you button it UP…run a test as you install.  This will save you future grief.  I’m willing to wager a modest sum that you have TWO “LOAD” …which if you test them, disconnected, will have NO VOLTAGE.  You will have tested and have the right “LINE” side or the income power.

Connect only ONE of the “LOAD” lines…leave the other OFF. Plug in something, after you reset or make the new GFCI functional in one of the outlets around the sink.  IF that one works, you have isolated the ones that need GFCI protection.  Do the same in the private bath…if you have GOOD, power, odds are you TV will not work.  If you do NOT have power to the outlets at or near the sinks, pull that wire off the “LOAD” and put the other one back on and then test.  Then which ever line does NOT have the sink or nearby outlets….put it on the top or “LINE” side…

THEN, with power off, hook the OTHER a wire on the TOP or the “LINE” side.  Odds are, this will also make your icemaker circuit work better.  Monaco put all the interior on the GFCI.  Your icemaker will leak, eventually.  NOT a safety issue, but drives the GFCI crazy. Your HOME refrigerator is NOT, by CODE, on a GFCI.

Do this and your life will be easier.  Assuming you might not have a Res Refer, and it you upgrade. Your life will be HAPPIER.

Good deal….fix it… 

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1 hour ago, Capt Mike said:

Can’t wait to get home and test it all! Wife wants to camp an additional day…I want to get home and fix it!

Assume you know your priorities and the conjugal penalties that could be imposed…..

LOL…. AND I think I am hyper from my massive dose of PredniSONE…

Have fun….or maybe not in the future.  Unplug the microwave and run an extension cord down and improvise…we all have…

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Rookie electrican mistake…ASSUMED receptacles were same/universal, old GFCI has Line on bottom, load on top, wired backwards. Ended up pulling wires out far enough to see what I was doing, identified line wires finally! 
Many thanks to all who replied!!

What an awesome group!

sooo…I assumed and it made an ASS out of me!

F4BA834F-F7C1-4FFE-AA3B-89341FE11C72.thumb.jpeg.e177b6e2d6aa4f1f78ead5e48cc8392d.jpeg

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56 minutes ago, Capt Mike said:

Rookie electrican mistake…ASSUMED receptacles were same/universal, old GFCI has Line on bottom, load on top, wired backwards. Ended up pulling wires out far enough to see what I was doing, identified line wires finally! 
Many thanks to all who replied!!

What an awesome group!

sooo…I assumed and it made an ASS out of me!

F4BA834F-F7C1-4FFE-AA3B-89341FE11C72.thumb.jpeg.e177b6e2d6aa4f1f78ead5e48cc8392d.jpeg

Your are forgiven…..paid a crew of licensed electricians over a weekend to help install an emergency generator and upgrade the ancient service and add some real outlets.  They put in several GFCI, as additional protection and also included the grounding circuits.  Some miswired.  I fixed.

if you have two LOAD lines, follow my recommendation and isolate and identify.  Only the outlets near the sinks or water need GFCI.

Good Luck.  Let us know.

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