Tom Cherry

11 minutes ago, 98Windsor32ft said:

Thanks, Tom, Great info.. I have 50 yr behind me of electronic test/integration experience.  I suspect you are correct, just need to trace wires back.

The headlights are on if the battery disconnect is on.  Interesting thing, the hi/lo beam switch only works if the headlight switch is on.  I will trace the wires and let you know the outcome.

 

Comment….and you have more bench time that I do…but I have spent a LOT of time looking at the prints and making or trying to make sense of the circuits.

The output of that switch goes to the headlight relay.  Now THAT turns on the relay or energizes the coil, the. The power from the main headlight fuse goes to the HI/LOW siwtch.

There is a SECOND wire that also comes to the “leftside”.  I don’t know where it starts….but my GUT says….it would be the “output” or power from a DRL relay. So, start the engine….a DRL relay closes. There is dual power to the Headlight relay coil.  One is the headlight switch….but TIED to it….a another feed or signal from the DRL circuit. 
 

FIRST….easy way….

Pull the positive coil terminal off the Headlight relay. OK… snip one wire.  My BET….  Engine off….chassis battery ON….headlight switch ON…. YOU GOT Power coming in…from both sides.  NOW turn OFF the Headlight switch. One side SHOULD (MUST) DROP OUT.  Now you know which is the headlight switch. Still got power….unplug the connector to the Headlight switch.  If that kills it…there is a defect in the switch….but IF one side has ZERO VDC… then you know WHICH is the headlight switch.  Then connect that wire back to the relay.  NOW it should work as designed….assuming the Headlight Relay ain’t the issue.  What is powerimg the OTHER wire….???  No idea.  Insulate and forget about it…

NOW…look at the headlight switch. It is a SPDT switch…no center off. One side will always be LOW….until you switch to HIGH….

I know you’ll solve it a bit of noodling and a print….

31 minutes ago, Chargerman said:

Thanks once again Tom. I would have installed a Watts Link years ago but Mike Hugh’s told me there wasn’t one available for my Exec.

Sorry for NOT picking UP that you have an Exec.  Van Williams custom made one for Pratt's 05 Exec.  He said it DID make some difference...not overall, it was not NEAR as dramatic as adding one to my Camelot.

Your TruCenter will do fine.  There is less "wander" in a Tag and less wander in the Dynasty and up due to the body construction.

SO...drive on.  Just don't expect that you can adjust out a mega cross wind.  BUT, from a driver fatigue standpoint...which is now more of a concern that "sports car handling", the TruCenter will improve it...

END OF SAGA....LOL...

On 5/12/2024 at 11:25 AM, 98Windsor32ft said:

Where might I find the front run box on my 1998 Windsor, 32ft ?

I have been looking for it for two weeks to fix my headlights always on problem.

John Flinn

Always ON….as in even with the Headlight switch OFF.  Or always on when driving….as in Daytime Running Lights….always on all Canadian Bound MH??

There is a Headlight Relay, I SUSPECT.  That was how it was usually wired.  Look at your prints or go exploring where all the relays are.  If the BOSCH relay is welded or the coil is messed up, it will provide a circuit.  FIND that relay. Replace it.  The COIL is what is activated….by the headlight switch.  Now that is one the 2000’s and forward…so, you need to trace the circuit….

OK....started this on my iPad.  Just checked my PC.  Have the prints for an OLDER (supposedly 1996) MH.  Here it is.  I had to do a little Photoshopping to get better contrast, but the labels are OK.

This is what you PROBABLY have.  NOW....that is a 4 PIN relay.  Not sure if they are STILL around.  BUT, you can replace with the standard BOSCH 5 Pin.

the Red/Yellow wire on the left side of the relay (can't read the pin) would go to Terminal 85 of a 5 pin Bosch.  The 86 Terminal goes to ground (that is the white 83 on the old relay.

The 30 Wire and the 87 Wire are the same.  Use the same circuit.  NOW, you would have a Standard Relay.

BUT...I would STILL DO THIS....

First, check for the DRL relay...and PULL it.  NO JOY...  Then Pull the Headlight Relay.  THAT shuts it down.  

As I suspected, the Headlight switch just drives the Headlight Relay...so if that relay is bad...BINGO.  Now if the Headlight Switch is defective, it is a common one and replace it.

Hope this helps

Main Chassis Layout 1996 Dynasty and such.pdf

13 hours ago, Chargerman said:

Ok . Thanks guys! I’m fine with just wiring direct but help me understand how it works. If you supply power to it momentarily I understand that it will actuate the solenoid thereby engaging the Trucanter but then what happens? How does it stay engaged? How is it released?

FIRST….make sure the Solenoid is working as in testing with an ohm meter on the coil. The Solenoid is NOT supposed to be held ON for more than what the instructions say….so, if you direct wire it….be cognizant of that. 

Next, the “trick”, per an installer trained, who was a Lazy Days Sr. Tech, at LD by the Field Rep, and was also one of the designers of the True Center… 

install it.  Use the Loctite…..but drive it.  Don’t torque down the clamp.  Just get it TIGHT!

Test it.  If it doesn’t “feel” or react or will center on a straight road with minimum crown, then, you have to tweak it. 

Then drive it with an assistant.  If you need to adjust, then loosen the clamp (scratch a mark where it was) and then have the helper turn (engine off) the wheel wheel slightly to get it “really centered”.  Then Tighten….drive and test.  Usually takes only one adjustment. 

Remember, it is basically a “shock absorber”, not some exotic suspension mechanism that you can adjust by 0.05 degrees increments.

You want if “roughly” but approximately centered….when finished.  It doesn’t have a 20 degree range…

That’s it.  Remember, the timed OUT OEM relay was to protect the coil and not burn it out. If you put a Clamp On ammeter on one lead and have someone, after you hot wire it, tap it briefly….and you get no reading….odds are…the Solenoid is bad.

BUT….bear in mind, you can adjust or tweak it as above and for 90% of the roads and crosswinds….it’ll work and you don’t really need the electronic adjustment.

A WATTS will astound you as to what it does…..and there is a 10 TIMES impact or feel when you put that on.  I knew the difference when I added the TruCenter….unbelievable when I added the Watts.

PURE and SIMPLE.  No cross winds, center and tap the switch.  Cross winds, experiment….oversteer a little…tap the switch.  NO JOY…oversteer a bit MORE….no JOY….there are some roads that, with crosswinds, can’t be “fixed”.

NEXT RULE.  If you are this much into “improvements”, then out on a Watts Link.  David Pratt proved that even a Dynasty, with a TruCenter and then ADDING a Watts, multiplied or improved the effect of the TruCenter.

Same deal on my Camelot. Had the TruCenter on…also Source sway bars and Source shocks… Same stretches of ND interstate…about the same cross winds.  Pre Watts’ the oversteer was needed.  If you pull a NASCAR trick and add a piece of red or white tape to the top center of the steering wheel, you get a “point” of reference…and you would be surprised how many defrees you oversteer in a cross wind. Pre Watts…maybe 10 - 15 degrees…or MORE.  After Watts…half or none…

That the gist….

8 hours ago, John C said:

I am changing 10 Bilstein 24-187312 Shocks now, does anyone knows what is the torque? On Bilstein website it has the following for the top nut:
https://academy.bilsteinus.com/knowledge/what-are-the-torque-specifications-on-the-top-nut-of-my-shocks
Size of Nut Torque
M8 10 ft/lbs
M12 34 ft/lbs
M14 54 ft/lbs
M16 83 ft/lbs
I measured the diameter of shock holes, it is M16, but even 83 ft/lbs still  seems to be really low to me. also they didn't talk the bottom nut.
How did you do it?
Thank you

From a practical standpoint, here’s the drill.

Top stud nut.  There is not, based on putting on my Bilsteins, any device made that would allow you to “properly torque” and measure the top stud nut. LOL.

The shop that was or is the main installer for Source Engineering, who sells the proprietary Custom Valved Billsteins told me his trick.  

First you need a 18mm (memory) ratcheting box wrench.  The FLIP OVER TO REVERSE, not the lever operated reversible kind.  Get a short stubby one.  Keep a standard 18mm around. Install the shock and work on the Top Stud Nut first.  Don’t even insert the lower bolt. Next…pull down the dust cover.  You need a small “locking plier”…or Vice Grips.  Needle nose or regular jaws….depends on the MH.

AFTER you run down the nut with your fingers, put the Vice Grips on the shaft….right under the mount.  That 3 - 4 inches never goes into the shock. With the shaft locked or rigid….finish tightened or torquing down the nut.  You will never overtorque it due to the constraints of the location.  Finally, wiggle the standard wrench up there and give all you got.  GOOD TO GO.  Put the cover back in place.

THEN, use the air bags to help align the lower bolt.  Usually not that big a deal.  A block of wood and pry bar will compress the shock if needed.

Torque the lower bolt per the spec.  Use an air ratchet or an impact gun, set to minimum, to snug it up…torque wrench from there. STOP on the first “click” or when the pointer hits your value.  Double and triple checking or torquing causes overtightening issues. 

I have 65 K on mine.  Never once had a loose lower bolt.  Had to tighten the front nuts once….you’ll know….it will “tell you” through the floor when the top nut is loose.  There was only one shock each time on each side….never both…. Rears are solid….never loosened.

Hey,

I thought you were smarter.  WHAT TOOK YOU SO LONG…..GREAT NEWS.  I know you will be happy and will live kong and prosper. 

BTW….  this comes from a guy that will celebrate the 18th birthday of his GD and her graduation in June.  I retired in August, 2006 and was the sole Day Care person for her and her now 21 YO brother.  Wouldn’t change a thing.  Good luck with your “back to the rots of your soul” or the next phase if your life. 

Keep us posted on how your health is improving…

Tom

Ditto to the above.  Frank and I often talk weekly and he alerted me to this post.  I knew about the call last week and the update today.

As to the OTHER MPX and the Dynasty and up Intellitec board repairs.  M&M does repair them for techs in the field.  The pricing, as has GROCERIES (to name one) has gone up a bit.  Inflation or otherwise...do NOT know.

BUT Paul Whittle is actually the person now, on the group that is doing most of Intellitec repairs.  @pwhittle

Frank is doing the K'Berg.  Frank and Paul can BOTH repair any of the Custom Monaco Intellitec boards....so seek out Paul.

Have NO idea what M&M is now charging for a Board Repair.  We have a great resource...so get quotes or call Paul and such...then choose whichever one suits your needs and timing. All I will say...Paul and Frank have yet to be stumped and I consider them a bit more of an expert than the various other options....

Glad to hear and understand that this is sorted out now....

YES...we are fortunate to have such resources here and it is the interaction of members and help and such that have helped develop them...

19 minutes ago, Ivylog said:

Not what I expected and it shows RS has it in stock for $172 BUT it’s only an idiot proofing device…if you  hold the centering button down too long (10+ seconds) it won’t supply 12V that long… automatically stops supplying power. I’d just bypass it and hook the 12V from the button straight to the +wire going to the true center… use a 15A fuse as the connector. For $172, I can remember to only hold the button down briefly.

https://www.rvupgradestore.com/v/vspfiles/assets/pdf/TC35270-Manual.pdf

OK...LOOKS like I need to test mine.   AND YES...you REWIRE the OLD UNIT...It will work...your brain is the RELAY...but if you want to make it work exactly like it was designed...here is the fix or the way to keep the SAME logic and AMPERAGE...

Here is a LINK to how this contactor works.  

https://www.grainger.com/product/5WML9?gucid=N:N:PS:Paid:GGL:CSM-2295:4P7A1P:20501231&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjw9IayBhBJEiwAVuc3fqog5OnlF59to35402abi2A2SQmaUEXnrJ4wqEogLFASB1KwNKxapRoCEqwQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

I DID see a link to how it is wired up.  

http://waterheatertimer.org/How-to-wire-Dayton-Off-Delay-Timer.html

THIS IS NOT A PLUG AND PLAY Timer... BUT IT WILL WORK.  SO READ ON...

https://www.rvupgradestore.com/v/vspfiles/assets/pdf/TC35270-Manual.pdf

I just went through a similar exercise....the contacts on the Dayton are ONLY rated at 1 Amp.  The Original $172.95 Amperite was rated at 10 A 

 https://us.rs-online.com/product/amperite-co-olympic-controls-corp/12da-ahdfa/70200212/

NOW  if you use the Dayton...BINGO...it is gonna burn up the contacts. The LOAD is only ONE (1) Amp...NOW don't despair....this is the fix...

Look at Page 4 of the instructions.  They RATED fuse is 15 Amps... so 10 sounds about right for the solenoid and the Amperite was rated at 10...

NOW>>> Here is how to fix that for say $10.  Purchase a Bosch 87/87A Relay (by the BOSCH BRAND).  Find (while on Amazon) a base that has #14 wires...technically and since it is a SHORT Run...#16 will work..

The NEW circuit, See my ROUGH PRINT....is like this.

The RED Wires to you existing switch are NOT POWERED...This is the simplest....and I played around with it...  They are JUST Plain wires...so they go as follows.

They are CONNECTED to Terminals 6 & 7 of the Dayton.

Incoming Power from the 15 Amp fuse (which was going to the switch) is now connected to Terminal 2 of the Dayton...ALSO run a wire from there to Terminal 30 of the BOSCH relay.

Terminal 3 on the Dayton and the BLACK WIRE on the TruCenter and Terminal 86 on the Bosch are ALL CONNECTED to GROUND.  REPEAT...Dayton 3; Bosch 86; and Black Solenoid go to GROUND.

OK...Terminal 1 from Dayton goes to Terminal 85 on the BOSCH.  NOTE 85 and 86 are NOT polarized for the coil works either way.  MOST of the time Monaco used 85 as positive. BUT, they also had this annoying habit of switching GROUNDS or Negatives...and that will also operate the relay

Here is my crude circuit.

If you install it....let us know...  

Blue Ox Trucenter Relay Fix.pdf

15 hours ago, 96 EVO said:

No, it hasn't!

Scotty's explanation dealt with not painting over the lap sealant. That makes perfect sense!

My question was, and still is.... why rolling on the diagonal?

Hopefully Chris will read this thread and reply.

The advice I received from Talin was clean, scuff, paint first (roll paint on diagonally, not front- back or side-side), then reseal seams.  The logic was if you paint over the lap sealant and/or Eternabond then ever have to remove the sealant for any reason, you may peel up the edges of the paint. Both the Rustoleum Topside and the Dicor Fiberglass Roof Coating form a relatively thick, pliable coating on the roof, and removing sealant to reseal, replace, etc., would peel up the edges of the paint. 

Looks like we read the same text and each of us interpreted if differently.  Made sense to me.  But, others, as you have, might differ...

16 hours ago, Craggar said:

 

OK...we are on the SAME PAGE.  It would be nice, when you replace the switches to post a picture of the OLD in place and the NEW.  We did spend a LOT of time with a really funky NO NAME Switch....and there was NO INFORMATION on it and we finally kept looking and found a picture and was able to "locate the manufacturer"

NOW, with your experience...you may KNOW this... OTHERS DO NOT.

There were TWO styles of Switches.  One is the SIMPLE.  It has nothing but TWO STUDS.  OK...my GS can handle that concept.

BUT, there were also, especially on the upper ends...and the Windsor was considered as an UPPER END... a FOUR terminal Switch.  There were TWO SMALL lugs...and they were USED to power some "stuff".  Many folks have bought the TWO STUD and put them in and then wrote....SOMETHING DON'T WORK.  Then, the photos revealed that they (or a Previous Owner) neglected to install the CORRECT ONE.  They just left the two "Low Current" terminal wires off.  AND THAT WAS NOT GOOD.

Most of the 2005 (GUESS) Dynasty and above had the FOUR wire switches...and, YES, many Owners purchased the TWO wire Blue Seas (the PN was different...but, hey...it FIT) and then wanted to know WHAT WAS WRONG.... NOW...  for the Windsor Owners..  That is an EXAMPLE...and Monaco changed their minds constantly.

THE MORAL.  Verify if you have a FOUR Terminal (Two Studs and Two small contacts) style switch.  if you do, try to find the correct 4 terminal switch.  IF NOT....either add a replacement ON/Off Toggle or straight wire the two small wires.  OTHERWISE...issues.

BUT, if you only have the TWO STUDS....rock on.

BUT... in some issues....which I was afraid here...the switch mounts were an abortion....as in there was ONLY one switch that would work without extensive recabling due to lengths and lack of slack.  In one case....there was absolutely NO ROOM.  The owner would have had to fabricate or had made a riser to mount on the OLD welded/bolt on bracket and then drilled it to take the NEW (usually Blue Seas) switch....and THEN he could use the cables.

That is the warning....which we see all to often and the reason for the depth of the discussion....

Let us see your handiwork...

11 hours ago, 96 EVO said:

My '08 Scepter came equipped with a pair of 950CCA group 31's!

BEN.... You are a GENIUS.  OK...a bit over the top.  BUT, you have just solved the great MYSTERY of Batteries.  MONACO, GOD FORBID, CHEATED on my Camelot.  I DID come with the 750's. I and others thought it was just how Monaco did it to "reduce costs".

YES....they actually did that...as in substituted the 750's....maybe they were OUT of 950's.  BUT, sure enough...my manual and the print say.  THAT BIG BOY NEEDS 950's...

Seriously, now I know....in the early builds of my Camelot or maybe I just got a FREAK....or a GOOF....they put in 750's..

Here, for everyone's information is the "RELEASED FOR MY 2009" Electrical Specs.  THIS covers many models including the Camelots.  The Dynasty and above were all 950 CCA.

NOW....for comments about 750's will work fine.  NOTICE the requirement for the Starter.  ALL are 1500 CCA.  So, Monaco's logic and mine and also my experience...you do NOT put in the Minimum rating...you oversize...not DOUBLE...so I was SUPPOSED to have 950's.  

Thanks again for information that can be verified rather than guessed at.  I assumed, as many do...that mine was built to the drawings...  OMG...NO.

I can also tell you that Monaco, even in the early 2009 builds were running out of things.  They put in the WRONG Tank Monitoring harness on a friend's 2009 Camelot and sent him the print of what he should have had and the Specs on the MISSING diodes and told him to INSTALL them and fix his harness.  This was AFTER Navistar bought them...so there was NO WARRANTY on the MONACO OWNED and BUILT Coaches....but they would tell you what was wrong...  LOL>

THANKS...

Battery Electrical Specs.pdf

4 hours ago, Craggar said:

I'm sure I saw a post or two on this but couldn't find anything while doing a search. I want to replace both my battery cutoff switches but can't find the specs for amps. Anyone know what they should be?

Matt may have the correct switch.  OR NOT.  Monaco, that long ago, used some really exotic and funky switches.  Folks have gone down this path before.  What you want, I assume, is a switch that will fit exactly in the mounting holes and also meet the AMPS.  

You really NEED to post a picture.  I can think of about 10 different designs that I have seen.  SOME were especially made with brackets and such and you have NO room to move or build a plate or fabricate a mount without adding a high current stud and then putting in a custom jumper cable.

The MOST popular ones and the trusted are BLUE Seas.  They look like the Marinco....if you googled the PN, that takes you to Amazon and "MAYBE IT WILL WORK".  Amazon has an AMAZING data base.  You can put in a part number and their search identifies it as a "Battery Cutoff"...  BUT sometimes they don't carry it or is no longer in manufacturing....then BINGO, they do a generic search for Battery Cut Off switches and you get a plethora of "HEY....they are what we have..."

SO..  the MAIN THING.  

Pictures of WHAT your HAVE.  
Do you have a PN on the SWITCH

Is there a BRAND NAME on the Switch.  MANY of the older switches, like yours were no very well labeled...and even when folks pulled them OUT...they couldn't find them.  We have helped folks and found the old brands.  That is fuzzy, but I spent a lot of time in the OEM catalog, once we figured out WHO MADE it...and the switch was NO LONGER made...but there was a NEW model.  Now these were the SPECIALTY mounts.  Mounted like a tank and had a long handle.

SO...without the above info, those of us that help find STUFF are stymied...  

HOPEFULLY some one will chime IN.  I edited the TITLE to alert folks that BROWSE as to the YEAR....

Hope this explanation makes sense...

Post the specs and will then be able to chase.  I tried the usual  1998 Switch.  then 97 and 99... then WINDSOR CUTOFF....lots of info...but no cigar.

BOTTOM LINE....WHY do you want to replace.  There is a VERY SIMPLE and easy method to test the switches.  Then you will know if they are going bad and you need to or if they are fine.  

State the reason and if they are failing or you think so...then the procedure will be posted.

Thanks

Try googling….

Class A Motor Home Bug Deflector

BUS bug deflecror

NADA a HIT for a Class A, shoe box MH.  Yes….semi’s with a long hood or nose.  If you keep trying words…..and “RV”….pages….except, they are from a “RV Parts Vendor”.  There is a custom one, molded and in stock, for every SUV or PUT you can imagine….save Musk’s “CyberTruck”.

MY curiosity….and answer….NOPE

BUT i have seen “things” in campgrounds that baffled logic and amazed me….but never a BUG DEFLECTOR….Bug Screens….YES…Deflector NO…

BUT do the googling yourself. I did the search here.  NOPE….

42 minutes ago, Benjamin said:

And in two types, threaded terminals, and post terminals.  700,750, 950CCA are all interchangeable.  Most RVs will start fine with one in typical temps.  Two or three batteries makes them last longer, maybe helps the starter last longer, but the 950CCA is not critical if you can't find it.  The 750 are often a heavier duty battery as the case and weight are the same size as the 950, so the 950 is built with more and thinner plates to get more amps, resulting in a less durable battery.  If you don't need to start below zero, without plugging in, then 750 are a better choice in my opinion. 

I agree with most of your explanation…..up until the selection.  This is from a personal experience and talking to others who are experienced.

Monaco saved a few bucks….maybe in 2008….when the bean counters and purchasing folks were allowed to make “engineering/technical” decisions…based on $$.

The 07 Dynasty and up, came with 950 CCA.  Even the stock 4XX HP ISL had them.  The bigger mills usually required MORE CCA.  This assumes that an owner had NOT swapped out the standard starter and installed a “Gear Reduction” style.  Commonly done here and discussed….

OK…so the higher ends got the 950….all is well.

Them Camelots and down, and Monaco was inconsistent….so this IS a generalization decided….the SAME ISL 425 in a 2008 Dynasty got a 950.  The 2009 SAME 425 ISL , Camelot, got the cheaper 750 CCA.  Result….we wore out our batteries quicker….we go, say 2 less years….reason….when it aged, the “reserve” was loser.  STARTING issues or worse….died more frequently.  The Dynasty folks got longer…

Simple math.  Interstate GR 31 LHD 750 is $180. GR 31 MHD 950 is $190.

Pair of 750 is $360.  Lasts 3 years….$120 per year.  The 950 is $380….Lasts 5 years…$76 per year.

THAT is why I and way more that I remember upgraded when the OEM 750 died….

BTW….the OEM Deep Cycle GC2 HOUSE batteries we Interstates in most 07 and up coaches….I know for a fact in Dynasty and Camelot’s were 225 AMP Hours.  ST-225….

I have not, out of curiosity, found that equivalent on the Interstate site….but there is a “Private BOX” Interstate that says RV/Marine/Golf Cart battery sold or was stocked at COSTCO.  It only had 190 Amp Hours….

BUT if you googled and went to the Interstate site….all the same never found the 190 AH….but it was on the shelf at Costco….maybe NOT now….

MOTIVE T-105   That is the “model” number of the Trojan T-105….sold today.  It is STILL a PURE 225 AH battery.  

BUT.  I googled Costco….the STOCK RV/GC/Mariine battery (GC2) is 210 AH.  It also weights 4 - 5 pounds….depending on the spec sheet you find, than the Trojan.  Maybe Interstate makes a 225?  But when folks talk about auto parts store batteries and “box” batteries….one needs to be careful and read the AH and weight….

JUST slightly off topic, but an observation that we post from time to time….

1 hour ago, 96 EVO said:

What's the theory behind rolling it on diagonally?

It was in Scotty's comments and it was explained there.  

From doing or being involved or on the roof for way too many roofing jobs...  Here is the way the PROS (million dollar jobs) do it.

If it is a SINGLE LAYER Coating...  Say spraying masonry with a sealant as it is "weeping" or if there is TWO COATS to be applied...

On a VERTICAL surface, you start EAST to WEST from the TOP.  Then for the SECOND coat, you go SOUTH to NORTH.  BTW, that is what one is supposed to do if waterproofing (Scotchguarding) something like a fabric hanging switch or cushions for a lounge or whatever.  That gives you 100% COVERAGE.  Remember to LIGHTLY coat... Really doesn't matter if you apply the the field of the roof....but you always put the second coat on perpendicular to the first.

Drive way sealing is the same.  The tech support people, for the 3 or so that I talked to says do the N-S and then E-W or vice versa....in other words....one coat goes one direction.  The second goes perpendicular to the first.  They advise to mark or sorta "have a known square footage area".  THEN you apply both coats.  You measure or have predetermined exactly HOW much liquid you have in your sprayer.  The object with the TWO COAT method is to achieve their "X GALLONS per Y Square Foot" formula.  They say...MOST don't do it.  WE, the lab, does it that way and runs our testes and weathering and such...

YES... only we engineers do things per the instructions....or from watching folks that know what they are doing....do it...

NOW, if it was a SINGLE PLY (as in the discussion), it was a matter of what works best.  The DIAGONAL trick that Chris uses is great....as then any seam and your roller seams are not an issue.  TECHNICALLY, if you read the instructions on latex paint....you put a GLOB in the center and then roll in multiple directions to get coverage and leave no "roller seams".

Hope that clears it up.

15 hours ago, Ivan K said:

Why exactly does it need to be filled with cylinders retracted if they are always full from both sides of the piston and the fluid volume in them and in lines is the same? Not talking about spring return cylinders. Just something I always hear and don't understand. 

It was explained.... technically and correctly.  From an end user point of view...  LIPPERT says to always check level when the SLIDES are retracted.  If you EVER do "forget that", I can, as other may...but most are smarter than me, can attest to.  Check extended....Level is down....more if BOTH.  Check retracted... Level is at, as it should be, the TOP of the reservoir. NEVER check or add when one or more slides are extended....OTHERWISE???😡

I'll yield to those who know more...  Like Mike H and Frank McElroy...

3 hours ago, Chargerman said:

Thanks as always Tom for the detailed explanation. One item that I don’t think is accurate, at least for the HWH X Brace slides is that the reservoir should not be full with all slides retracted because the hydraulic rams on the raised floor slides are fully extended in this condition. Therefore when extending one of these slides with a full tank oil will overflow the tank. HWH told me to fill with raised floor slide extended. 

You have the SAME year and the Dynasty and Execs were supposed to have "all the same".  I did a key word search of the 2006 Dynasty manual and there was NO mention or the brand in the manual.  NOW, the illustration LOOKED like an HWH...so that's as much as I can verify.  Lipperts ARE supposed to be checked that way.

If that is what Lippert told you or is in the Manual for your system...then that is probably correct.  @Frank McElroy is my GOTO source.  His manual does NOT, I think, discuss HWH...and has LIPPERT in the key word search...or maybe I goofed.

The ADVICE is always...  Know the Model and Brand of your system.  Download the appropriate manual or consult with the vendor.

SO, my method pertains to Lippert...on that I am SURE.  OTHER searches are futile as MOST say...  Lower the jacks...and then retract and FILL.  We do NOT have those units...

Frank may chime in and correct me....as usual....

SCOTTY HUTTON POSTED THE SOLUTION.  Please read the prior posts for content.  ASSUMING your ATWOOD is like his and like this one.  It is the CHECK VALVE.  That needs to be replaced.

THIS also assumes that the problem is NEVER on the COLD at any faucet.

Have at it....

1 hour ago, Mike H said:

That's the synchronizing cylinder for your slides two hydraulic cylinders.  There are two connections on the side of the cylinder.  it's a 'blind' cylinder and has a rod sticking out of both ends. It makes sure the pressure in both of your slide cylinders is the same, so the slide extends and retracts straight.  From your photo it doesn't appear to be leaking.  If it ain't broke, don't fix it !  😉 

WHILST on the subject....many, as Mike did not, know that SUCH exists.  This morning I commented on an issue or maybe yesterday.  It is IMPORTANT that you do NOT stop immediately when you extend or stop a slide.  You LET THE SWITCH STAY IN...for maybe a few seconds...or until you hear the DEFINITIVE pitch or Noise Change from the MOTOR.  Folks will sometimes STOP for fear of Tearing OUT the WALL and the SLIDE falling.  That cylinder keeps them moving and balanced.  NOW, from a personal experience...if you have a VOLTAGE drop on the motor and a high resistance connection...that will be RATCHETY...but ordinarily the slide will sort of "Crab" or move a smidge on one end...then the other catches up.  NORMAL.

The Balance Cylinder as Mike points out....controls that.  BUT, short cycling or shutting off prematurely can and HAS caused issues.  SO, just keep that in mind.  NOW....the next question IS...DO I HAVE AIR TRAPPED or is mine messed up.  You can easily put to to rest.  With a GOOD charge or on SHORE...  Run the slide out...and hold for a few seconds and hear the change.  Then retract...same deal....learn how long to hold after the motor pitch changes.  THEN repeat that drill for 3 or 4 complete cycles.  You will have BLED OFF any any air and also properly "CHARGED" the system.  

BTW....check the level....SLIDES IN.  The reservoir should be right up to the top surface of the tank.  THAT's IT...  very little free space.  NEVER add Fluid to the extended slide....unless it is so low it DIES...  YES...that is in the manual...or has been in many.,...but with Monaco....you never know.

This is Hydraulic SLIDE 101....

27 minutes ago, Trevor and Laura said:

Hi again, I will attach a picture of the front electrical, there was one wire added since pic was taken to provide a new 12v source for the HWH hydraulic motor solenoid, thankyou Terry R for your help there. it went to a spare spade on the lower row of fuses.

Advice will be appreciated

Trevor

 

SIMPLE.  ODDS ARE.  The TWO loser Studs in the right sides run DIRECTLY from each bank.  TURN off each Bank.  SHOULD have NO Voltage (to GROUND) on either.  THEN turn on the HOUSE.  FIND the one with VOLTAGE.  SHOULD be ONLY one.  Put a BIG H under or near it.  TURN OFF the HOUSE....then ON the Chassis....and TEST.  HOUSE should be DEAD.  The OTHER ONE should have Voltage.  Put a BIG C on or near it.

This is where you attach your POSITIVES from the remote meters.  IMPORTANT... I'd use a LARGE ring Terminal and it would be a RED (insulation) one.  Measure the Diameter of the stud.  THEY MAKE THEM.  Use #12 WIRE and run that to the Remotes.  Use a Ratcheting CRIMPER and use only CRIMPLED connections....the WAY Monaco did it.

The GROUND can be ONE WIRE...  You Do NOT NEED TWO WIRES.  I SUSPECT that the Aluminum (silver) terminal strip in the UPPER right is a GROUND BAR STRIP.  Use it as you GROUND as you verify which is CHASSIS and HOUSE.  IF SO...that is NOW your GROUND point.  3 WIRES to the front...that is all you need....

I would RUN #12...in case I EVER needed PURE HOT Voltage.  Then you can tap into them and put a inline fused lead off them.  COSTS LITTLE and you can run 3 easily.  Use Zip Ties for neatness.

THAT's what I see and SUSPECT.  2 MINUTES with a VOM will verify.  Please do that and advise.

3 minutes ago, jacwjames said:

I checked the local Coop and Tractor supply, nothing that big.

Batteries Plus carry that size but I ended up buying at AutoZone this last time.  Drove the coach to Autozone and they helped me swap it out. 

WHATEVER WORKS for one....and as long as they buy a "decent battery"....then choose that brand and how it works to get a quality install...  I had TIME and carry a STRAP.  I had my DW run down to the Interstate shop...about 5 minutes away and I had them, when I called, already "ring up" the batteries, at my "special" price...and she gave them a CC.  She drove back.  I already had pulled the batteries....swapped them out.  Verified that my Intelltiec BIRD system was fine...a Fluke...later replaced the Big Boy.

We finished our PRE BRING IT HOME chores and stopped by Interstate and they gave me $20 cash for the cores...and I said...HEY.  They probably are good....as I had told them....but had a long trip and it was TIME...  Later I asked the tech, as I get my other batteries there.  YES.. We used our load tester and our "Restore" charger RIG....and sold the "used" ones....and they tested OK. WHICH WAS FINE...

As you stated...whatever works for you and you get good value and service out of.  Another member that shares my "fetishes" for maintaining and getting max life....gets about 5 years out of a cranking set and uses the RULE of thumb...and only buys, like I do....the Interstates...but we are "TROJAN FOLKS"....Need a T shirt...

I am a TROJAN man.

That would be a hoot....

28 minutes ago, wamcneil said:

There are a number of good and widely accepted ways to attach the panels….
But the original poster has made it very clear that he’s dead set on going waaaaaaasyyyy overboard and using big fasteners down into the steel roof structure. 
I can sympathize… I too am afflicted with a sometimes overwhelming urge to over-engineer things that need to be fixed and fix stuff that’s not broken…😳

IF we, the staff, were so inclined.....and then required a PERSONALITY POLL with a few questions to determine IF you are so inclined.....BIGGER, TOUGHER, MORE IDIOT PROOF, ETC....is Better...  Then MY GUESS from reading just about every post from March, 2009, I'd be in that....  We would be in GOOD company....maybe 50% (that's MY GUESS...use your own....but above 50%)

THEN we would have to determine just exactly the extent (Mental Illness that causes up to OVERKILL) of such.  My DW says I would rank in the top 1%, UNTIL I laugh at a post or two....and read her the comments or relate some "OFFLINE" examples that many members share with me or a few other "ANAL" engineers come up with.  THEN she lowers my percentile to only 95%.

I could pontificate, in a non judgemental matter...for at least 5 paragraphs of how I FIXED IT FOR LIFE.  My Track Record is good....  RARELY do I have to go back.  MOST OF THE TIME...I DID OVERKILL and OVER Engineer...way beyond the NORMAL "Design Engineering Fudge or Safety Factor".  As an aside,,,I was involved in Manufacturing Engineering and Product Engineering (Design) as both a HANDS ON designer as well as supervising a large contingent.  I NEVER LEARN.. and often times myself and upper management or marketing would "overrule" a 300% safety factor....too costly or unsightly...

BUT, I CRINGE when I do HAVE to pull apart something that I FIXED and should NEVER BREAK.  Example....a Solar Panel goes BAD.  The replacement is no longer available and THAT, per a LOT of reading and talking to some tech, is the NORM for Solar...and the companies come and go or make upgrades.  BUT...in reality...I can't get an exact replacement.  THEN I rue the day when I had installed it for or affixed it down or attached it for a CAT 5 HURRICANE AND a F5 TORNADO, simultaneously hitting the MH  and I have to totally destroy the surface or whatever just to get my Pop Rivets and Double Stick Tape and Epoxy and Lag Bolts LOOSE...  

As you pointed out.  Each of us has our own "safety factor".  SO, whatever the OP wants to achieve....I salute him.  BUT, I know that my single screw, caulked in, solar panel...60 or so watt, is just as rigid as it was from day ONE.  It was installed by CW, GOD FORBID...but they had a LOT FULL of Monaco's and at least 10 Camelots.  They ordered the KIT that Monaco gave to the Assemblers and ran the wires exactly as the FACTORY units were routed.

I also only use 3 M Double Stick tape (Clear VHB) when I fully understand that if I need to "unattach", there will be CONSEQUENCES.

SO... Whatever, as the say, floats your boat....as long as you have, from several approaches, analyzed or calculated or whatever...and accept....IF I OVERKILL, It is gonna be Hades to pay...then you do what you feel meets that particular "Mental Affliction" that possesses....to some degree, the bulk of MH owners...who KNOW that driving a MH is equivalent to having ones house on a fault and there is a perpetual 4.5 quake...

SO....to prevent this turning into a "bashing"... I have left your post...and hope to defuse any ill feelings it might have brought about....

LAUGH WITH ME...and LAUGH at our personalities....but don't sincerely CRITICIZE us.... MOST can take a little ribbing...but not all members...

THANKS...

38 minutes ago, Viper04 said:

I have a penguin 2 15K unit installed new in 2018, in my 2000 Ralph Lauren edition Dynasty. It has worked flawlessly until I needed the AC today. (May 11). It is configured as a single zone unit ( stand alone from the front AC unit). 
The thermostat only displays a blue background. I have to fiddle with the program button 

to get the AC to come on. 

 

any other experienced operator  headspace is appreciated!

 

thx

 

Tim Vickers 

Viper04
 

 

 

 

FIRST and FOREMOST TROUBLE SHOOTING.... DO THE SIMPLE and DON'T panic.  Find the Dual INLINE connectors (in your case only ONE since it ZONE 1) in the plenum.  UNPLUG IT.  Clean the contacts with a Q-tip or spray with ELECTRONIC cleaner (NOT ELECTRICAL Cleaner).  ODDS ARE...the installer got CHEAP.  USED the old connector.  NOT GOOD.  Clean the contacts on the RJ male ends.  BTW...It does NOT MATTER which dangling wire from the Controller was used...either will work....they are NOT polarized...

NOW...then plug and unplug maybe 5 times....seat firmly.  This will burnish or clean the male and female mating metal surfaces.

GOOGLE how to do a CCC2 RESET.  Follow the instructions.  I know and can quote the older 5 BUTTON CCC....but never worked on the CCC2.  NOW, they are exactly the same....they work the same.....just have a different "Contol MPX" signal...)....so take this as 100% correct.

ODDS ARE....It will work.  My track record includes at least 50 maybe 75 members where I posted this advice...  There was a BREAK (corrosion or dirt) in the circuit.  When that HAPPENS....the THERMOSTAT was "messed" up and you have to FIX the poor connection and THEN reboot or reset the circuit.  Then the Thermostat could read the circuit between the Controller and the Thermostat...  Folks that HAD two ZONES (1 & 2) is the same.  The Thermostat HAS to read and "REGISTER" all the downstream controllers.

NOW...  There MAY be other issues.  What you do...  You remove the WALL thermostat.  Carry it up to the Plenum and PLUG it in directly.  RESET or REBOOT IT....and the LETTERS or whatever displayed per the manual....must come up.  THEN, if the Unit doesn't work.... Have to TEST the THERMOSTAT....easiest and next LOGIC step.

DO THIS.  Take the Thermostat to the REAR.  unplug the line from the REAR thermostat or remove it and plug in your front ONE.  Do the RESET.  The Thermostat don't know rear from or  front or from a Bass Drum.  It is NOT programmed....so you could switch them...and REBOOT or RESET and they work fine.

THAT TELLS YOU....Thermostat is GOOD or BAD.  If the Thermostat works in the REAR....you have a CONTROLLER ISSUE up Front.  THEN....you pull off the top covers of the AC's.  You take a PICTURE of the AC Board (that is what Dometic calls them) ITS IN THE MANUAL.  There are DIP Switches on each ONE.  Take a picture of each one.  Pull the REAR ONE...change, if different..., the DIPS so IT matches the FRONT.  I'll BET, after helping so many, that the FRONT ONE ONLY has the FURNACE DIP on.  SO, you MUST have the REAR ONE SET exactly like the front.  IT that fixes it....FINE.  YOU have a BAD controller.

This is 99% of the problem....90% in the connections....clean...and FINE.  Then the Controller might be 8%...and the thermostat....the rest..  ASSUMING that the Data Cable from the Thermostat to the Front Plenum is INTACT.  Sometimes the Contacts JUST FAIL.  You replace them.  YOU HAVE TO write down the color codes or read the INSTALL manual.  this ain't no PHONE LINE.  OK....reterminating fails....then ...  YOU ARE IN THE VERY FEW...that Monaco decided you were JINXED.  Monaco was NOT perfect.  When the Installers used the staple gun to secure the Data Cable along the way....every ONCE and AWHILE....they drove a staple THROUGH the cable.  FINE....lasts for YEARS....then at some time....years and years later....the cable finally vibrates a bit....ONE of them tiny wires was nicked and only hanging on or working by a few tiny strands....BINGO...there ain't NO FIX....other than to RUN (through the Duct work and being great at getting a wire snake to make the entire run).  FOLKS HAVE DONE IT.  Folks have RUN a data cable from the ROOF, in wire mold, from the front unit to where the "wall is" where the Thermostat is located.  They were able to drill a hole and shake a new wire UP to the roof....

That COVERS IT....in way too much detail.  BUT, at least NOW you know to troubleshoot and HOW it works and what to do.

BTW....YES, I have had to clean mine a few times.  YES...I DO carry spare connectors (Amazon sells them)...and the NEXT TIME it "happens", I will put in TWO new Connectors...

GOOD LUCK...Post what fixes it...

29 minutes ago, timaz996 said:

Just like pilots do...shut everything down before shutting the engine down and always let your EGT get below 400 F before you shut down. (that's being good to your equipment)

OF COURSE...  Myself and many others always let the RPM drop and such.  Like when you pull into a rest stop and used the "Exhaust Brake", the engine is virtually at idle for a minute or so or more as you get to the parking spot....then let it idle for a minute or two.....  When  I enter my neighborhood it takes about 5 minutes to reach my house...so the engine has been at or near idle.  THOUGHT everyone knew that....LOL...

Good POINT...Thanks

BTW, I don't have an EGT meter...but, if you look at the "TEMP" display (4 conditions digitally displayed), the engine is still close to operating 195 temperature...  Cummins recommends not shutting down immediately after a long road run...let the engine IDLE for a few minutes....then shut off.  Thus...in my case...my neighorhood drive works...and YES, one should ALWAYS let an engine idle for a few minutes at a rest stop.  HARD to do when there are truckers behind you....but if you let it idle whilst you wait your turn...it is OK...