CMillet86 Posted August 30, 2023 Share Posted August 30, 2023 Start with this a 2003 Monaco Dynasty Legacy, 2 Roof airs, aquahot furnace. Had the rear roof air(original to coach) started making lots of noises and eventually died. My front roof air was replaced in 2018. Coach has 2 5 button thermostats. Now we rarely use it when it's cold enough to need the furnace but I want to keep everything operational. Front thermostat only shows 1 zone but if I flip it to furnace I have heat. If I hit the zone button it just blinks the number 1. Ordered and Installed a new Penguin II high capacity for the rear, knowing I would need the newer 10 button thermostat, those are on backorder, so I went ahead and purchased a micro air. A/C is wired as best I can tell how it was before and admittedly I'm unsure if this ever worked. But the micro air only shows 1 zone also and no furnace option. I no longer have the old a/c unit to check anything, but is my mixmatch of new and old thermostats causing my issue there? And Shouldn't I have 2 zones on at least one thermostat? Sidenote new Penguin A/C has the fan rubbing something that I need to fix because they are now on backorder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyronTruex Posted August 30, 2023 Share Posted August 30, 2023 Someone most likely isolated the two systems at some point in time. After that, replacing one AC at a time can get you into some issues because of the onboard control board in the new units. They are NOT backwards compatible. When it was nearly impossible to get any AC unit I had to change one out at a time and install a backwards compatible board in the new unit. I'm still using the 5 button thermostat. The AC units are daisy chained with a communications cable. Dip switches are set inside to tell the thermostat what zone they are and what functions they have such as heat pump. The daisy chain cable (phone cable), is likely still tucked inside the intake area of the AC units. This could get quite tricky and there are others with more experience than I to help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMillet86 Posted August 30, 2023 Author Share Posted August 30, 2023 24 minutes ago, myrontruex said: Someone most likely isolated the two systems at some point in time. After that, replacing one AC at a time can get you into some issues because of the onboard control board in the new units. They are NOT backwards compatible. When it was nearly impossible to get any AC unit I had to change one out at a time and install a backwards compatible board in the new unit. I'm still using the 5 button thermostat. The AC units are daisy chained with a communications cable. Dip switches are set inside to tell the thermostat what zone they are and what functions they have such as heat pump. The daisy chain cable (phone cable), is likely still tucked inside the intake area of the AC units. This could get quite tricky and there are others with more experience than I to help. So the rear unit, I have two of the phone cables coming out, which were both hooked up. In the front I have 2 spots for them but only 1 cable that was hooked up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivan K Posted August 30, 2023 Share Posted August 30, 2023 So each of the 2 units has its own thermostat if I understand your description. In that case the units should not be daisy chained. Each thermostat would show just a single zone for the AC and heat pump. I dont know about your AH zoning but assume you only have 2 zones for AH, for simplicity. If you had 3 AH zones, there would be an other controller board somewhere. You select between cool and heat by touching the snowflake sign and vice versa, right? If you have the correct microair version for your new unit and heat pump symbol does not show up, I would recheck the heat pump dipswitch on the roof. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Cherry Posted August 30, 2023 Share Posted August 30, 2023 47 minutes ago, CMillet86 said: Start with this a 2003 Monaco Dynasty Legacy, 2 Roof airs, aquahot furnace. Had the rear roof air(original to coach) started making lots of noises and eventually died. My front roof air was replaced in 2018. Coach has 2 5 button thermostats. Now we rarely use it when it's cold enough to need the furnace but I want to keep everything operational. Front thermostat only shows 1 zone but if I flip it to furnace I have heat. If I hit the zone button it just blinks the number 1. Ordered and Installed a new Penguin II high capacity for the rear, knowing I would need the newer 10 button thermostat, those are on backorder, so I went ahead and purchased a micro air. A/C is wired as best I can tell how it was before and admittedly I'm unsure if this ever worked. But the micro air only shows 1 zone also and no furnace option. I no longer have the old a/c unit to check anything, but is my mixmatch of new and old thermostats causing my issue there? And Shouldn't I have 2 zones on at least one thermostat? Sidenote new Penguin A/C has the fan rubbing something that I need to fix because they are now on backorder. TOO MANY POSTS and HELP....as well as TOO MUCH SPECULATION....Please follow along. Without calling you or knowing some information....it is difficult... OK....I need to divide this as follows to see if I understand it.. TWO SEPARATE ZONES....as in TWO Separate Thermostats... both are the old Dometic/DuoTherm 5 button. In response to your latest post.... and Myron's comments. If you DO NOT have but ONE data cable up front....then that is how your system came. The Thermostat for the front is on the other end of the data cable inside the Front unit. Since there is NO CABLE going to the rear....then you can NOT hook up the rear. That is why you only have ONE cable. NOW, if someone or tech cut off the cable and shoved it out of the way....then originally you SHOULD have had but ONE thermostat. NOW, you only have ONE cable....and one Thermostat. It works...and you will keep the system that way. BUT DO READ the rest... As to the REAR. GOD ONLY KNOWS. If there are TWO cables back there...then one has to scratch one's head. OK...you actually have the 40 Legacy. That would be good to put in your signature. The Brochure shows that to be a TAG axle...but it ONLY the Tag's (42) had THREE AC's. BTW, the originals were 13.5's... SO...why a third cable. Monaco did strange things. There should be NO remote sensor since the Thermostat is in the bedroom. Should be ONLY one cable plugged in and the other one goes "who knows"....now back to the original post... REPLACED THE FRONT in 2008. You need to GET the Model Number off the Penguin AC that is in the front. Then you will have to contact Dometic and look it up. IF the unit is the NEW Penguin II and you are using the OLD 5 Button (which you are), then that unit has a conversion kit in it. Please understand this. The OLD 5 Button thermostats were call CC. When Dometic revised and upgraded the line, they used a new (Multiplexed) configuration. That is what they call CC2. A NEW unit can be made to work WITH a CC, but the control module has to be replaced. If that is done, the Tech should have removed the OEM CC2 one and the customer hangs on to it. When (not IF) the old 5 button system dies....as in the thermostat goes bad....then the simplest and cheapest is to reinstall the CC2 control module and put in a new thermostat. The Dometic CC2 or the MicroAir (for the NEW CC2, NOT the older 5 button) will then work and the system is restored to the original CC2 design. OK...this is what you also need to understand. The control module in each HVAC has DIP switches. For OUR systems, only one or two is used. On the Front Unit, your module only has ONE SWITCH (#7??? memory) ON. It is the FURNACE. The "ZONE" switches are NOT selected as the Default is Zone 1. There are switches to select Zones 2, 3 or 4. You use them if you have additonal units on the thermostat. You DO NOT. NOW.... YES, the Front is working as it should. When the front was installed, the last step was to RESET or REPROGRAM the system. There is only ONE ac unit. You are using a furnace/aquahot. So, the Furnace switch should be on. Holding in the ZONE and MODE buttons with the bottom switch OFF and then turning it on resets or tests or configures it. SO, you ONLY have one ZONE...the Front. There is NO NEED to push the zone button....as there are NO OTHER zones. You would do this IF your bedroom was on the same thermostat. That is why if flashes. SO>>> If the front thermostat fails, and it will, you need to KNOW...Do I have a NEW Penguiin II? If so, then I (that is my opinion) would order (or find) the Original CC2 Control Module and reinstall it. I would NOT replace the Thermostat with the CC style....I would stick to the CC2...MicroAir or Dometic will work. OK>>>ON TO THE REAR... Covered the cables. The REAR Control Module SHOULD have been left EXACTLY the same as the front. You ONLY have ONE ZONE. And the Furnace DIP switch should have been ON. If the MicroAir only shows ONE ZONE (1) and your Aquhot works... ALL IS WELL. When you have TWO zones....as in Front and Rear and they are on ONE thermostat....and there is the required data cable from the front (two...one from the Thermostat and one TO the rear) then the Data Cable is hooked up in the rear...the Control Module in the rear has ZONE 2 DIP ON. When the Reset is done (either old or new CC), the Thermostat is smart enough to know what is going on. In this case, with a second unit operating off the front Thermostat, there will be a Remote Temperature sensor. BUT, it is NOT hooked up to the two dangling cables from the roof or the Control Module. As long as you have ZONE 1 up front and ZONE 1 in the back, and TWO Thermostats, then pushing the Zone button is NOT ALLOWED. It can be done...but each will just FLASH. Now, if you had only ONE thermostat....then each time you pushed the ZONE...it would toggle and FLASH and go back and forth between ZONE 2 (Rear) and ZONE 1 (Front). Since two TStat.. it is just flashing and asking.. "Hey, I only have ONE zone.... This does nothing.". So basically, you do NOT need to use the ZONE button. Hope this clears it up. Read the manual, it explains it. Sounds like you are good to GO...but do your homework. If you have the 5 Button and a 2018 front... you do NEED to know what you have. If you have a CC (older original style) up front...then you will have to replace it with the MicroAir 5 button. An OLDER CC will NOT work nor can it be upgraded for the CC2. BUT, if someone installed the conversion kit (Dumbed DOWN the new Penguin 11), then I would upgrade or replace it and get it back to how it was designed...and then then put in the CC2. MicroAir or Dometic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMillet86 Posted August 30, 2023 Author Share Posted August 30, 2023 37 minutes ago, Tom Cherry said: TOO MANY POSTS and HELP....as well as TOO MUCH SPECULATION....Please follow along. Without calling you or knowing some information....it is difficult... OK....I need to divide this as follows to see if I understand it.. TWO SEPARATE ZONES....as in TWO Separate Thermostats... both are the old Dometic/DuoTherm 5 button. In response to your latest post.... and Myron's comments. If you DO NOT have but ONE data cable up front....then that is how your system came. The Thermostat for the front is on the other end of the data cable inside the Front unit. Since there is NO CABLE going to the rear....then you can NOT hook up the rear. That is why you only have ONE cable. NOW, if someone or tech cut off the cable and shoved it out of the way....then originally you SHOULD have had but ONE thermostat. NOW, you only have ONE cable....and one Thermostat. It works...and you will keep the system that way. BUT DO READ the rest... As to the REAR. GOD ONLY KNOWS. If there are TWO cables back there...then one has to scratch one's head. OK...you actually have the 40 Legacy. That would be good to put in your signature. The Brochure shows that to be a TAG axle...but it ONLY the Tag's (42) had THREE AC's. BTW, the originals were 13.5's... SO...why a third cable. Monaco did strange things. There should be NO remote sensor since the Thermostat is in the bedroom. Should be ONLY one cable plugged in and the other one goes "who knows"....now back to the original post... REPLACED THE FRONT in 2008. You need to GET the Model Number off the Penguin AC that is in the front. Then you will have to contact Dometic and look it up. IF the unit is the NEW Penguin II and you are using the OLD 5 Button (which you are), then that unit has a conversion kit in it. Please understand this. The OLD 5 Button thermostats were call CC. When Dometic revised and upgraded the line, they used a new (Multiplexed) configuration. That is what they call CC2. A NEW unit can be made to work WITH a CC, but the control module has to be replaced. If that is done, the Tech should have removed the OEM CC2 one and the customer hangs on to it. When (not IF) the old 5 button system dies....as in the thermostat goes bad....then the simplest and cheapest is to reinstall the CC2 control module and put in a new thermostat. The Dometic CC2 or the MicroAir (for the NEW CC2, NOT the older 5 button) will then work and the system is restored to the original CC2 design. OK...this is what you also need to understand. The control module in each HVAC has DIP switches. For OUR systems, only one or two is used. On the Front Unit, your module only has ONE SWITCH (#7??? memory) ON. It is the FURNACE. The "ZONE" switches are NOT selected as the Default is Zone 1. There are switches to select Zones 2, 3 or 4. You use them if you have additonal units on the thermostat. You DO NOT. NOW.... YES, the Front is working as it should. When the front was installed, the last step was to RESET or REPROGRAM the system. There is only ONE ac unit. You are using a furnace/aquahot. So, the Furnace switch should be on. Holding in the ZONE and MODE buttons with the bottom switch OFF and then turning it on resets or tests or configures it. SO, you ONLY have one ZONE...the Front. There is NO NEED to push the zone button....as there are NO OTHER zones. You would do this IF your bedroom was on the same thermostat. That is why if flashes. SO>>> If the front thermostat fails, and it will, you need to KNOW...Do I have a NEW Penguiin II? If so, then I (that is my opinion) would order (or find) the Original CC2 Control Module and reinstall it. I would NOT replace the Thermostat with the CC style....I would stick to the CC2...MicroAir or Dometic will work. OK>>>ON TO THE REAR... Covered the cables. The REAR Control Module SHOULD have been left EXACTLY the same as the front. You ONLY have ONE ZONE. And the Furnace DIP switch should have been ON. If the MicroAir only shows ONE ZONE (1) and your Aquhot works... ALL IS WELL. When you have TWO zones....as in Front and Rear and they are on ONE thermostat....and there is the required data cable from the front (two...one from the Thermostat and one TO the rear) then the Data Cable is hooked up in the rear...the Control Module in the rear has ZONE 2 DIP ON. When the Reset is done (either old or new CC), the Thermostat is smart enough to know what is going on. In this case, with a second unit operating off the front Thermostat, there will be a Remote Temperature sensor. BUT, it is NOT hooked up to the two dangling cables from the roof or the Control Module. As long as you have ZONE 1 up front and ZONE 1 in the back, and TWO Thermostats, then pushing the Zone button is NOT ALLOWED. It can be done...but each will just FLASH. Now, if you had only ONE thermostat....then each time you pushed the ZONE...it would toggle and FLASH and go back and forth between ZONE 2 (Rear) and ZONE 1 (Front). Since two TStat.. it is just flashing and asking.. "Hey, I only have ONE zone.... This does nothing.". So basically, you do NOT need to use the ZONE button. Hope this clears it up. Read the manual, it explains it. Sounds like you are good to GO...but do your homework. If you have the 5 Button and a 2018 front... you do NEED to know what you have. If you have a CC (older original style) up front...then you will have to replace it with the MicroAir 5 button. An OLDER CC will NOT work nor can it be upgraded for the CC2. BUT, if someone installed the conversion kit (Dumbed DOWN the new Penguin 11), then I would upgrade or replace it and get it back to how it was designed...and then then put in the CC2. MicroAir or Dometic. The front A/C was replaced in 2018, the new unit I ordered is the same part number that was on that receipt. High Capacity Penguin II no heat pump. I misunderstood the zone situation, but I understand it now. Ignore the front completely then. The issue in the rear is I have no furnace or heat option on the micro air. I'm guessing it's a dipswtich issue in the A/C unit based on what you said, so I will crawl up and check that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solution CMillet86 Posted August 30, 2023 Author Solution Share Posted August 30, 2023 Crawled up to the roof to fix the squirrel cage rubbing, checked the dipswitchs, furnace one was off, flipped it on, crawled down to verify noise was gone and check operation. All good now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Cherry Posted August 30, 2023 Share Posted August 30, 2023 45 minutes ago, CMillet86 said: Crawled up to the roof to fix the squirrel cage rubbing, checked the dipswitchs, furnace one was off, flipped it on, crawled down to verify noise was gone and check operation. All good now. See there... NOW you know. It is GREAT when a fix is easy and also the member understands WHY they did something. Truly a success story.... OK...for your future knowledge. The front will be a judgment call. The new Penguin II will work for a LONG time. The conversion board should outlast the AC...as they usually don't start failing until maybe 15 - 20 years. We are seeing some failures now of the older CC Control boards. Your "RISK" is the Thermostat. NW RV used to sell refurbished ones for $150 or so. OR, you can get the MicroAir but it has to be the 5 Button and it will NOT interchange with the one in the rear since it is CC2. My advice to you...do NOT use the bottom slide switch. Use the MODE button when you shut off the unit. The switches are a weak part and repeated on and off kill them. SO...be aware and rock on... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMillet86 Posted August 30, 2023 Author Share Posted August 30, 2023 19 minutes ago, Tom Cherry said: See there... NOW you know. It is GREAT when a fix is easy and also the member understands WHY they did something. Truly a success story.... OK...for your future knowledge. The front will be a judgment call. The new Penguin II will work for a LONG time. The conversion board should outlast the AC...as they usually don't start failing until maybe 15 - 20 years. We are seeing some failures now of the older CC Control boards. Your "RISK" is the Thermostat. NW RV used to sell refurbished ones for $150 or so. OR, you can get the MicroAir but it has to be the 5 Button and it will NOT interchange with the one in the rear since it is CC2. My advice to you...do NOT use the bottom slide switch. Use the MODE button when you shut off the unit. The switches are a weak part and repeated on and off kill them. SO...be aware and rock on... Yeah I will keep the old thermostat out of the rear for in case the front fails. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Cherry Posted August 30, 2023 Share Posted August 30, 2023 1 hour ago, CMillet86 said: Yeah I will keep the old thermostat out of the rear for in case the front fails. Excellent idea… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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