General Coolant Discussion; SCA with ES Compleat Coolant

[Kevin Schitoskey]

I'm about to go through my cooling system (new hoses, filter, thermostat, water pump, coolant) and I plan to use Fleetguard ES Compleat EG coolant. My plan is to use the SCA-loaded coolant filter as well. Is this correct? Or is the SCA already included in this coolant formulation?

Coach is a 99 Dynasty with 8.3 ISC
 

Thank you.

 

[tmw188]

I would go to the Fleetguards website or YouTube and watch their videos on coolant. I’m not sure about the EG but if I was going to use a extended service coolant I wouldn’t want the schedule of using SCA’s. I bet if you watch the videos or call them you will probably pick the one in the photo. I recently went with this coolant with a radiator swap. 

[Bill R]

Following this thread.  Last year I flushed, and replaced coolant and hoses. 

@Kevin Schitoskey I went with the ES Compleat EG.  The Fleetguard Tech Sheet says that there is no SCA precharge requirement.  Being a fairly new owner of the coach, I had NO idea you needed to add SCA's on a maintenance interval, or have a SCA filter loader.  Personally, If I had know this, I would have gone with the OAT.

Anyway, jumping in on this thread, for those using the ES Compleat EG, what is your experience on what the maintenance interval is for checking and adding SCA if you are not using the filter loading system.

[Jdw12345]

Just make sure that whatever coolant you use it’s compatible with ALL the components in your cooling system, so that includes, up front heat exchangers, transmission cooler’s, Aqua Hot systems, etc etc……. And above all make sure you get ALL of the old coolant out of the system, some coolants are not compatible with other coolant’s and can turn into a jelly like mess in a cooling system. 
 

 You don’t have to necessarily add SCA’s but the coolant should be checked with test strips.

Edited November 23, 2023 by Jdw12345

[jacwjames]

Also jumping onto this thread, might learn something.

Back in 2014 I was starting to doubt my ability to use the test strips for the SCA's on my coolant, maybe I'm color blind but could never distinguish a noticeable change and looked at getting a coolant change, at the time I didn't have a good place to do it so I contacted the Cummins shop manager,  he worked for me as Maintenance Superintendent in the mines and I had no reason to doubt they'd treat me right.  He said it would cost ~$600 but instead he suggested I send a sample in for analysis, which I did.  It came back perfect so no coolant change was required, best ~$35 I spent.

The my radiator was damaged by road debris and replaced in 2015.  When I questioned what coolant to use the Cummins shop manager recommended the ES Compleat EG, said it was all I would need.  I said OK and that's what was used.

If you look at the description it sure looks like it would be the right coolant but it does list a testing component but doesn't look like that big of an issue, https://shop.cummins.com/CSSNAStore/s/product/a2w4N000003sG6JQAU/fleetguard-es-compleat-eg-premix-5050-1-gal-cc2825

This is form there description  "Ensure proper additive levels and coolant pH through coolant testing and the addition of SCAs or new coolant if necessary. Testing your coolant every 150,000-miles or 4,000-hours is recommended to identify system contamination and to screen for engine problems."

So what I'd suggest and sending in a sample, always good to know what the condition is.  I hadn't used my rig much from 2016-2020 but recently over the last ~3 years I've put ~20K on the rig so I think I'll send in a sample.  Just bought 3 test kits, not a big deal.  

[tmw188]

The ES Compleat OAT claims it is and is mentioned in their videos 

[jacwjames]

4 minutes ago, tmw188 said:

The ES Compleat OAT claims it is and is mentioned in their videos 

"To maintain the protection provided by ES Compleat OAT, the proper level of inhibitor must be present. This can usually be achieved by topping off the cooling system with premixed ES Compleat OAT coolant. The user is responsible for ensuring proper additive levels and coolant pH through the use of test strips and the addition of new coolant if necessary. The recommended test interval is 300,000 miles, 6,000 hours, or 1 year. The test interval is a precautionary recommendation intended to prevent progressive, severe engine damage"

From the Cummins flyer, still requires testing every 300K miles and inhibitors as required. 

They say test strips but they have a shelf life and are very subjective, again>>> I'd recommend sending in a sample. 

[tmw188]

Yeah everyone throws that added requirement in. (Or 1yr) I think they say you can freshen the system up up by draining a few gal and adding fresh coolant to it. I sat thru one of their webinars awhile back. I talked to the presenter about maybe presenting at one of the Gatherings. Not sure if he and Scotty ever connected. 

[jacwjames]

I think that testing via the coolant analysis is the best way to go.  Takes the guessing out of it and it will tell you a lot more then test strips. 

[tmw188]

Yep.,Test strips always seem non conclusive.

[96 EVO]

3 hours ago, Bill R said:

 

Anyway, jumping in on this thread, for those using the ES Compleat EG, what is your experience on what the maintenance interval is for checking and adding SCA if you are not using the filter loading system.

Unless you put a crazy amount of miles per year, you should be fine for at least 2yrs, probably longer, before needing to add liquid SCA.

[jacwjames]

Test strips test for the additive levels and PH but nothing else, a coolant analysis tests for a lot of stuff.  Attached is the results from when I tested my coolant back in 2015, I did not know the manufacturer or type, it was green and as far as I know it had never been changed, this meant it was +13 years old but tested fine.  I had been testing and changing the coolant filter about every 3 years. 

At the top of the page it gave me a Green 1 severity, good report.

Coolant analysis 2.pdf

[tmw188]

Yeah I struggle for a yr with a numerous analysis before I was forced into changing coolant the expensive way😩

[Guest Ray Davis]

12 hours ago, jacwjames said:

Testing your coolant every 150,000-miles or 4,000-hours is recommended to identify system contamination and to screen for engine problems."

Semi trucks yeah, makes sence, they go a million mi.  In a MOHO 150k mi is a life time,  change it at 100k mi if it makes you feel better and you  should be good.  IMHO 

Switch to one that doesn't require SCA,  Wal-mart has it. 

 

Edited November 24, 2023 by Ray Davis

[96 EVO]

6 hours ago, tmw188 said:

Yeah I struggle for a yr with a numerous analysis before I was forced into changing coolant the expensive way😩

Did you have holes in your cylinder liners?

[tmw188]

1 hour ago, 96 EVO said:

Did you have holes in your cylinder liners?

Short answer is no, fortunately. But it did involve a radiator replacement and more. 
Radiator replacement had nothing to do with coolant. New coolant was just needed because of the radiator work. 

Edited November 24, 2023 by tmw188
Added content.

[Jdw12345]

 Quotes from Fleetguard,  

With proper maintenance, Fleetguard ES Compleat™ coolant can last for the major overhaul life of your engine. However, when poor quality make-up water is added to the system or when minimum coolant maintenance is not observed, pH levels can rise or fall to dangerous levels and contaminants (Sulfate and Chloride) can rise to unacceptable levels. When this occurs, coolants must be drained and replaced immediately. Use Fleetguard's revolutionary Quik-Chek™ Coolant Quality Test Strips to determine the quality of their coolants. In a matter of minutes the pH, Sulfate and Chloride levels in a coolant can be determined. If results fall within acceptable limits, the coolant can be used until the next service interval with confidence. The Quik-Chek™Coolant Quality Test Strips are available in bottles of 10 test strips.

[birdshill123]

I changed my coolant to Final Charge

 I spoke with one of the engineers. He stated that the coolant would outlast the engine. They used to sell a booster but now you can just drain a few qts.and replenish

 Never add SCA.

 

Just now, birdshill123 said:

I changed my coolant to Final Charge

 I spoke with one of the engineers. He stated that the coolant would outlast the engine. They used to sell a booster but now you can just drain a few qts.and replenish

 Never add SCA. You need a reractometer to test freezing point. Inexpensive on Amazon

 This coolant is available at Walmart,most truck stops and auto parts stores. You must use distilled water.  Even for your final flush.

 

 

[jacwjames]

9 hours ago, Jdw12345 said:

 Quotes from Fleetguard,  

With proper maintenance, Fleetguard ES Compleat™ coolant can last for the major overhaul life of your engine. However, when poor quality make-up water is added to the system or when minimum coolant maintenance is not observed, pH levels can rise or fall to dangerous levels and contaminants (Sulfate and Chloride) can rise to unacceptable levels. When this occurs, coolants must be drained and replaced immediately. Use Fleetguard's revolutionary Quik-Chek™ Coolant Quality Test Strips to determine the quality of their coolants. In a matter of minutes the pH, Sulfate and Chloride levels in a coolant can be determined. If results fall within acceptable limits, the coolant can be used until the next service interval with confidence. The Quik-Chek™Coolant Quality Test Strips are available in bottles of 10 test strips.

Test strips have a shelf life and have to be stored correctly.  And with that their video says that they are not a substitute for lab analysis.   A bottle of 10 cost ~$35, I can get an lab test done for that.   

[RoadTripper2084]

My experience from a previous thread:

 

 

[Kevin Schitoskey]

Thanks to everyone for your comments - 19 replies in 2 days speaks to how awesome this site is.  Lots of reading and research has confirmed that I'm on the right track. I will be doing the ES Compleaat and the 2074 loaded filter and then check SCA levels after I run it a while. 

Travel safe,

Kevin

[birdshill123]

Kevin. You should not add SCA to an OAT coolant. Not required. Unless you are a chemist I would not fool around with anything other than distilled water and that coolant.

[Jdw12345]

On 11/24/2023 at 9:19 AM, jacwjames said:

Test strips have a shelf life and have to be stored correctly.  And with that their video says that they are not a substitute for lab analysis.   A bottle of 10 cost ~$35, I can get a lab test done for that.   

FWIW, It is not necessarily to purchase that many test strips at a time, 

Fleetguard Coolant Analysis Test Kit CC2602A

[96 EVO]

On 11/24/2023 at 10:52 PM, Jdw12345 said:

Fwiw, It is not necessarily to purchase that many test strips at a time,

Yeah, I buy them in the 4 pack, and the last one I use is usually a few months past their 'use by' date.

[Kevin Schitoskey]

8 hours ago, birdshill123 said:

Kevin. You should not add SCA to an OAT coolant. Not required. Unless you are a chemist I would not fool around with anything other than distilled water and that coolant.

Yes - I absolutely agree.  The coolant I am going with is not OAT - but I appreciate the heads-up.  No chemistry experiments with my 8.3...