Les Hurdle Posted July 5, 2023 Share Posted July 5, 2023 2004 Cheetah My son from the UK is in the US for a few days. His job is a crashed/vehicle inspector. I asked him to check my airbags because they just didn't seem right. He did something I had not seen or heard of. He tapped them. With the suspension down, most had a dull thud. The rear passenger side rang like a bell. Sure enough it was not down. As I had suspected these past weeks. So we ran the system up and down a few times....... pass. side remained up. [airbags at rear are not both the same re manufacturer.] Our checks showed the process used to deflate bags is as per the manual [he deals with this stuff all day especially via wrecks]....... so, how do I get the rear pass side bag to deflate? Les Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hex_nut Posted July 6, 2023 Share Posted July 6, 2023 The answer depends on whether you have air leveling or not. If you have air leveling, you have a problem with a solenoid sticking. If you do not have air leveling, then you probably have a broken or maladjusted ride height valve on that side. Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Hurdle Posted July 6, 2023 Author Share Posted July 6, 2023 I'm always confused by some of the language 😉. Air leveling, when moving, or leveling the coach on a ramp? I use jacks to level the coach on a ramp. At the rear of the coach are two solenoids [sorry can't find pic right now] if it is them, how do I; 1. know the solenoid is stuck [whack it, which one ?] 2. if the ride height valve, is that a job for a pro? Thanks for the heads up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hex_nut Posted July 6, 2023 Share Posted July 6, 2023 It sounds like you have hydraulic (or electric) jacks for leveling and not air leveling (air leveling uses the air springs to level the coach while parked). Your coach should have two ride height control valves on the rear axle and one in the center of the front axle. The ride height control valves are not solenoid valves, but mechanically activated air valves that are attached to the axles with rods and lever arms. The lever arms are adjustable so that you can adjust the correct air level for in motion travel. The rods and arms are often connected with clamped rubber bushings that fail over time. If you are going to make adjustments or corrections to this system, I would highly recommend that you spend the time learning how to safely make any adjustments. If you are under the coach when the air system loses all air, the results can be catastrophic. Please be careful. If I am going to get under mine, I run it up on 4" blocks and then put jack stands under the frame. Having 35,000 pounds fall on me is not a pleasant thought. Good luck exploring the source of the issue. I am surprised that some of your air springs are deflating but not that one. I think my coach has a single dump valve for deflating and I assume yours does also. Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happycarz Posted July 6, 2023 Share Posted July 6, 2023 There are three dump valves to empty your air bag, one for the front, one for the RR and one for the LR. The rear valves are next to each other. Air up your coach, turn the engine off and press the dump valve. Some coaches need the key on. If yours is so, turn key on, engine off. Have your son stand at rear of coach to listen for the air escaping from the dump valves. Maybe only one is working, but he’ll hear that one and then find it. The one next to it could have broken wire to it, or mud daubers could have plugged up the exhaust port. Another thing to try once you find the dump valves and one is working and the other isn’t, and with the above addressed first, is to take the nut off the top of the valve on both valves and swap the coils from one to the other. Then see if the problem goes from the left side to the right side. Those valves really are pretty good and last forever, almost. I would think broken wire or exhaust port plugged. BTW, the two are wired in parallel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Hurdle Posted July 6, 2023 Author Share Posted July 6, 2023 thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Hurdle Posted July 6, 2023 Author Share Posted July 6, 2023 My son leaves today so time was sort......... we changed the electric leads over on the solenoids, that made no difference. Now will take them apart tomorrow [I'll be unsupervised ;-))] I presume yu mean the units in the pics below.... undo the nut at the top [system down] and switch them over then air up, then dump? Are the coils charged? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happycarz Posted July 6, 2023 Share Posted July 6, 2023 Yes, Les, those are the solenoids. Spray them off with Brakleen or something similar. Don’t worry about the label losing the printing. If you like, wipe off the label with a cloth and take a picture. Take off the top nut and remove both solenoid coils. If you look closely, you’ll see a collar on the brass fit into which the yellow tubing goes. Push the collar down with an adjustable wrench opened to the size of the yellow tubing. Then, while holding the collar down, push the tubing in and then pull out. Only one will come out as the other yellow line will be hard to remove with the pressure on it. There are two Phillips screws on the bottom of each, securing it to the welded on angle iron piece. Get a long handle #2 Phillips screwdriver and make sure you are seated in the screw head, then remove the screws. The long handled screwdriver is so you can get straight on the screw. I regular handled screwdriver will also work, just be square to the screw. Take the screws out and remove the non working solenoid. That is the one you can’t get the tubing out of. Then turn it around to look at the exhaust port see if it is plugged. If not plugged, return here for next step. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Hurdle Posted July 7, 2023 Author Share Posted July 7, 2023 currently no air in system........ I presume I can still do as you suggest? [at the w/e] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happycarz Posted July 7, 2023 Share Posted July 7, 2023 If the bag is full, the line to the non working dump valve will be pressurized. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Hurdle Posted July 7, 2023 Author Share Posted July 7, 2023 assuming the solenoids are attached L & R wen I remove the right one what kind of pressure will be in the line? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happycarz Posted July 7, 2023 Share Posted July 7, 2023 75-90 lbs. If there is enough slack in the line, you could cut the line about an inch from the solenoid, leaving enough line on the solenoid to extract it. When reassembling, use a sharp utility knife to have a nice clean cut on the tubing before reinserting into solenoid valve, and wipe tube so it looks new and shiny for a good seal. But, before you cutting line, take the valve retaining screws out with the lines still attached and turn valves around to see the exhaust ports. The exhaust port is on the opposite to the intake port. Make sure some critter didn’t build a nest in it. On some, maybe most, there will be a porous sintered brass fitting attached. That is to keep bugs out. It just screws in to the valve. Unscrew it to see if that solves the exhaust problem. The airbag will deflate and the coach will settle when that pressure is released. Be prepared. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Hurdle Posted July 23, 2023 Author Share Posted July 23, 2023 Previous owner came by today. As suggested above he he knew to push down on the brass 'collar'. Tube came out with air........... bag now deflated. Took the solenoid apart it was super clean. [did note a brown ring at the base of the 'piston']. While still unassembled had my wife operate the dump switch, the one still assembled solenoid clicked. Reassembled solendoid/w/tube, checked with the dump switch. Both clicked. In a few days I may inflate the system and see if all is ok. If not, given I have to presume the electrics are ok, I'll buy a couple of solenoids . Found this co. https://www.radwell.com/en-US/Search/?q=2603. The only numbers I can see are 06032. or 2603. Neither come up........ where might one buy these solenoids? If the bag stays inflated is the issue the 'valve' which control the ride height? thanks to all for the help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Hurdle Posted August 31, 2023 Author Share Posted August 31, 2023 Perhaps a silly question........... for reasons far too long winded to explain I need to know is it ok to move the coach on empty airbags for about 20 feet forwards then backwards? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank McElroy Posted August 31, 2023 Share Posted August 31, 2023 6 hours ago, Les Hurdle said: Perhaps a silly question........... for reasons far too long winded to explain I need to know is it ok to move the coach on empty airbags for about 20 feet forwards then backwards? The short answer is yes as long as you are on a flat surface and you move in a straight line without turning the wheels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivan K Posted August 31, 2023 Share Posted August 31, 2023 That's how I drive through our 12' tall garage doors... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul J A Posted September 1, 2023 Share Posted September 1, 2023 On 8/31/2023 at 8:06 AM, Ivan K said: That's how I drive through our 12' tall garage doors... Don't the air bags start to inflate as soon as you put the Tranny in gear?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivan K Posted September 1, 2023 Share Posted September 1, 2023 37 minutes ago, Paul J A said: Don't the air bags start to inflate as soon as you put the Tranny in gear?? Not when I keep holding the down button on HWH pad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul J A Posted September 1, 2023 Share Posted September 1, 2023 2 hours ago, Ivan K said: Not when I keep holding the down button on HWH pad. T y. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Hurdle Posted October 17, 2023 Author Share Posted October 17, 2023 On 7/22/2023 at 5:00 PM, Les Hurdle said: Previous owner came by today. As suggested above he he knew to push down on the brass 'collar'. Tube came out with air........... bag now deflated. Took the solenoid apart it was super clean. [did note a brown ring at the base of the 'piston']. While still unassembled had my wife operate the dump switch, the one still assembled solenoid clicked. Reassembled solendoid/w/tube, checked with the dump switch. Both clicked. In a few days I may inflate the system and see if all is ok. If not, given I have to presume the electrics are ok, I'll buy a couple of solenoids . Found this co. https://www.radwell.com/en-US/Search/?q=2603. The only numbers I can see are 06032. or 2603. Neither come up........ where might one buy these solenoids? If the bag stays inflated is the issue the 'valve' which control the ride height? thanks to all for the help Inflated airbags, went on a short w/e trip, rt rear airbag would not deflate. Removed plastic pipe, air escaped so I presume there is no blockage between the solenoid and the airbag. Disassembled solenoid, nothing wrong that I can see. Checked operation via dump valve. Swapped 12v lines all ok. Tech previously said it is the only place where a defect might be.......... obviously not so.......... any other ideas why the unit wont deflate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ray Davis Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 2 hours ago, Les Hurdle said: [did note a brown ring at the base of the 'piston']. Depending on what the brown ring was maybe it was stuck. Did you swap the 12v lines back? That may totally confuse the auto-leveling controller. If you go back and read Harry's posts I think he has given you excellent things to look for. One example is the exhaust port on the back side of the manifold where your 6 solenoids are mounted, dirt daubers think those holes are there just for them. There should be a R & L exhaust port/hole on the backside 3 hours ago, Les Hurdle said: Swapped 12v lines all ok Explain, did that fix it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Hurdle Posted October 17, 2023 Author Share Posted October 17, 2023 OK. Hopefully this wont take too long but I have not been able to solve the issue. I spoke to KIP who make the solenoids. They would not sell them refereed me to Monaco Coach......... who didn't have any. [part# 1X1182] Hopefully pics below will be in # order. 1. original parts. I disassembled the right one, cleaned it all out it worked fine. 2/3/4. rt solenoid functions with a spring etc. [3 is just another solenoid shot] 5. left solenoid disassembled. This one seems to have a rubber cushion inside the main body. assembled both units. Pumped up the bags. Dumped... same. minimal amount of air out of left solenoid nothing from the right. remove plastic pipe from rt solenoid rear bags go down !! 6/6a. I marked the 12v incoming. Reversed them made no difference............ why does the rt have 2 white 2 black and left only one? I have to presume the issue is now electrics............. where to start in the rats nest ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Hurdle Posted October 17, 2023 Author Share Posted October 17, 2023 I should add. With ign on, dump switch activated there is power to the 'connectors'. If I add 12v to the cable attached to the solenoid the solenoid operate ok....... rubber collar version is much slower. So I'm stumped. L Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivan K Posted October 17, 2023 Share Posted October 17, 2023 (edited) If I understand your description, is what I marked in the picture the part that you call a 'rubber cushion' ? Also, your coach has jacks and these are just dump valves that should activate simultaneously, right? Edited October 17, 2023 by Ivan K Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Hurdle Posted October 18, 2023 Author Share Posted October 18, 2023 HI Ivan, Yes and yes in order to release the airbags. I'll have to check but am now wondering if the voltage is less than 12 hmmmm and if so how to correct it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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