Wipers stopped working - NOTE CCM KONGSBERG SYSTEM!

[Guest Kent Madison]

On 2009 Holiday Rambler Navigator Bismark 4 my windshield wipers stopped working. First the low/high button would not work but the intermittent button would work and the washer button. Then they all stopped working and I don't have any wipers. Both of the fuses are good (CCM fuse and board fuse). I took the wiper motor out and opened it up and all looks great inside. I turned the armature a few turns and all was free and it opened the park switch. I plugged it back in and the motor returned to the park position but I could never get it to move again. I took the buttons on the steering wheel apart and all the LED's at each button have their lights on. I tested the two cube relays in the CCM area and they are both good. I don't have a CCM reader to see any of the codes and wanted to purchase a CCM code reader but I cant find where to get one. We really don't have any repair shops for motor homes in our area so I wanted to just own my own CCM reader.

[Gary 05 AMB DST]

Sounds like the park/stop switch is involved.

Gary 05 AMB DST

[Garry Donohue]

If you have a smart wheel…On my 07 Dynasty, I pried off the center wheel cover, and cleaned with a clean cloth, the contacts that the push buttons contact. The wipers have been working fine now. I rarely use them as I apply Rainex before each trip. With that big wide windshield, the rain just blows off. I reapply on my return trip as well. 

[Guest Kent Madison]

Gary   The start/stop switch looked in great shape and it ohmed just fine so I don't think that is it, but it might be.

Garry  I have electric contact cleaner so maybe I will take the smart wheel switch apart and spray some in there to see if they clean up.

[Garry Donohue]

Couldn’t hurt

[vito.a]

Does your 2009 Navigator have the Kongsberg multiplex system?

If so, does the wiper control go through it?

Our older coaches use the VIP Smart wheel system.  

[Frank McElroy]

1 hour ago, Kent Madison said:

On 2009 Holiday Rambler Navigator Bismark 4 my windshield wipers stopped working. First the low/high button would not work but the intermittent button would work and the washer button. Then they all stopped working and I don't have any wipers. Both of the fuses are good (CCM fuse and board fuse). I took the wiper motor out and opened it up and all looks great inside. I turned the armature a few turns and all was free and it opened the park switch. I plugged it back in and the motor returned to the park position but I could never get it to move again. I took the buttons on the steering wheel apart and all the LED's at each button have their lights on. I tested the two cube relays in the CCM area and they are both good. I don't have a CCM reader to see any of the codes and wanted to purchase a CCM code reader but I cant find where to get one. We really don't have any repair shops for motor homes in our area so I wanted to just own my own CCM reader.

A code reader won't help.  Have you already added the supplemental 5volt supply?  This is a known failure point on the Kongsberg CCM systems.

 

 

[Guest Kent Madison]

I don,t think so as it looks like it is the CCM system. I am not sure what your system would look like.

 

[WayneC]

2 hours ago, Garry Donohue said:

If you have a smart wheel…On my 07 Dynasty, I pried off the center wheel cover, and cleaned with a clean cloth, the contacts that the push buttons contact. The wipers have been working fine now. I rarely use them as I apply Rainex before each trip. With that big wide windshield, the rain just blows off. I reapply on my return trip as well. 

I use rainex as well,use on the boat windshield,  when running down the lake in walleye tournaments in the rain the water just beads right off

Wayne

1999 Signature ceaser 

[Frank McElroy]

1 hour ago, Kent Madison said:

I don,t think so as it looks like it is the CCM system. I am not sure what your system would look like.

 

You CCM system does NOT have a SmartWheel control box.  All SmartWheel functions flow through the CCM module.  A weak 5volt supply from the CCM to the steering wheel keypads will cause SmartWheel function like the wipers and cruise control not to work.  Read my posted link to see if your symptoms fit.  If so, do the 5 volt supply fix.  This is a well known problem.  It's not a matter of IF it's just a matter of WHEN the 5 volt supply from the CCM MOSFET will fail.  You could also have an issue with the clock spring or cable connection but on your coach, by far the problem will be fixed with the 5 volt supply modification.

It you want to test to be sure it's a 5 volt supply issue, measure the 5 volt feed with and without a keypad pressed.  If it drops below 4.9 volts, that's your problem.

[Guest Kent Madison]

Frank.  Thanks for your earlier post about this. I checked and I have 3.7 volts at the steering wheel and also at the smart-wheel positive wire leaving the CCM. So I ordered the 12V to 5V converter that was suggested for $14 from Amazon and I will install it when it arrives. Do feed the 5 volts positive and negative into the wire by splicing it in so that it feeds both the smart wheel wire and back feeds the CCM output smart wheel wire also? Or just cut the wire and not back feed back into the CCM?

 

Thanks for all your knowledge and willingness to share it.

[Frank McElroy]

Eric Russell made a great how to repair video.

 

[Guest Kent Madison]

Thanks that was great. Do you know if I spliced into the wire and allowed it to back feed the CCM would it provide the correct voltage to the CCM and maybe help other outputs on other CCM areas?

[Frank McElroy]

11 minutes ago, Kent Madison said:

Thanks that was great. Do you know if I spliced into the wire and allowed it to back feed the CCM would it provide the correct voltage to the CCM and maybe help other outputs on other CCM areas?

Absolutely DO NOT back feed to the CCM.

[Guest Kent Madison]

Thanks. That is what I needed to know.

[Frank McElroy]

Internally, the CCM uses a separate MOSFET to generate output power on each of the output wires.  The MOSFET is also current limiting.  That's why you don't see any fuse on an output wire as long as the current is under 10 amps.  MOSFETs like any other component don't last forever.  Unfortunately, Monaco designed the SmartWheel and dash switches to never shut off.  Over time (10+ years) failures on the smart wheel started to show up first with wiper problems.  About a year or 2 back, while helping out Brett, I discovered the root cause to be a failing MOSFET in the CCM.  That's when I came up with the simple 5 volt power supply fix.  It has already fixed dozen of coaches.

[Guest Kent Madison]

I have all the parts ordered and hope to fix it for good on Friday. Thanks for your help.

[Rikadoo]

i found this on a 05 HR, Navigator… originally it started out as wipers that would not park, then quit alltogether. Used electronic cleaner then covered with electrical grease from then on worked perfect. I am ALWAYS amazed on the stuff i find

[Guest Kent Madison]

Is that the plug going to the wipers itself as mine is round and very well sealed?

[Rikadoo]

Yes it plugs in with a standard plug on one side, on the end you see is apen pin with slip on female connectors. The point of showing it is to resonate with the old phrase… these motorhomes are like snowflakes not two are made the same🤦‍♂️ when i found that plug i had NEVER seen anything like that before. Ya just got to stay open to what if an run with the punches

[pwhittle]

27 minutes ago, Rikadoo said:

Yes it plugs in with a standard plug on one side, on the end you see is apen pin with slip on female connectors. The point of showing it is to resonate with the old phrase… these motorhomes are like snowflakes not two are made the same🤦‍♂️ when i found that plug i had NEVER seen anything like that before. Ya just got to stay open to what if an run with the punches

I found the same plug on a 2005 Signature.

Paul

 

[Guest Kent Madison]

Interesting. Thanks..I will post picture of my fix after I get it done.

[Guest Kent Madison]

After replacing the two solenoids that run the tag axle lift dump valves and stopping the error message on the Valid leveling system the wipers started working again. Could the bad solenoid coils have been putting to much load on the CCM and causing the wipers to not work?

[Frank McElroy]

The short answer is no - the power gear valid leveling system has no impact on wiper functions.

[Guest Kent Madison]

Ok thanks. I still only have the 3.5 volts going to the smart wheel. I have the 5 volt power converter ordered so I will still put it in even tho the wipers started working again.