Tom Cherry

Odds are. You have at least two issues. The “hot water” system is dual “fire” as in you use 120 VAC for residential or domestic water heating. The Diesel is used when there is a higher demand, such as “interior” heat. NOW, everyone taking a shower and washing dishes and running laundry all SIMULTANEOUSLY….will exceed the capacity of the electric heater. Memory….and I’d have to pull a AH manual. The diesel burner has about 10 times the capacity of the electric coil or heater. I do this once a year this topic comes up….so, maybe only 5X…. OK…the hot water system does not depend on Diesel for ordinary hand washing and dishes and a shower or two….it just takes LONGER to recover and heat back up. Therefore, download the manual. It is on the Aquahot site, if not already in the “file” of all the component owner’s manuals that originally came with the Motor Home…if you can’t locate on the AH site…call…and they will send you a link. Do the step by step troubleshooting guide for “NO HOT WATER”. Next…there is another topic, similar, running. No Diesel is the result of, 90 - 95% of the time, lack of maintenance as well as “AGE”. The burner nozzle “plugs up”. The AH trained and certified tech that does my PM says that the more you use the diesel, the longer the nozzle lasts. When it sets for long periods of time, even though there is a filter on the diesel. It starts to gum or plug. Now…the nozzle is not just an orifice….like on a garden hose sprayer. It has a sintered metal passage….think tiny metal honey comb. The fuel, under pressure, goes through this and then is atomized and is a “spray” inside the burner housing. Most people experience a “needs PM” condition every 2 - 4 years….and that depends on the “cleanliness” of the fuel they use. The typical DIESEL PM is a new filter and a new nozzle and burner housing adjustment….and a thorough cleaning inside the “burner assembly”. NO IGNITE…then there is a detailed trouble shooting guide for the electrical and electronics. The PM also includes a functional test of every zone to ensure the pumps (4 or so) work as well as the fans on the small “radiators” where the heated boiler antifreeze is circulated. If you can use a VOM and follow the instructions….most can trouble shoot the “no hot water”. That’s it…. Read the manual as to the “operation” and how this whole complex monster works….then tackle the NO HOT WATER. Once fixed….then move onto Diesel….IN THAT ORDER….the “SYSTEM” or Hot Water heating HAS to work….OK, you COULD have a dead electric heater and the Diesel would work….but domestic hot water depends on the AC Heating system to work..

Thanks for the clarification....but it did provide more INSIGHT into the TYPICAL issue. I used SS Pop Rivets and they are a PITA to remove....and you also need the long handled tool....a pliers type will destroy itself....if you give it enough brute force... BEEN THERE...

UPDATES....and some of the FOG cleared...but JUST when I thought it was clear...a STORM Moved in. First. The AGS, regardless of the older 5 KNOB AGS or the AGS-N... uses the HOUSE BATTERY Voltage. It is SUPPOSED to be wired directly to the HOUSE BANK Connections. It DOES NOT receive input from the Remote. Terminals 3 and 4 are the VOLTAGE Sensing leads....on the AGS hard wired connector. NOW...all the debate about running wires and such....Magnum and Frank McElroy cleared this up. The amount of Voltage Drop one would get on the TWO #12 wires running from the Batteries to the FRONT (mine is in the FRB) and Frank's is in the rear...adjacent to his Inverter is MINISCULE. This is a SENSING Voltage....and NOT a load carrying one. SO, either location...properly wired, will work and there would be maybe few MilliVolts difference in one in the front vs the rear. SECOND... AND THIS IS THE KILLER... Even MAGNUM was confused on this. If you have a 2008 (at least on the Dynasty) 5 KNOB one....then the Magnum Remote was totally different and functioned differently. If you have the the SAME or same "VINTAGE" remote as on the 2008 Dynasty....then HOW you set the AGS and it works is TOTALLY DIFFERENT. The REMOTE only "enables it".... You can NOT set the parameters... NOW, on my 2009, I have the SAME AGS. BUT, my ME-RC was capable of PROGRAMMING IT. If you look at the two photos....one from the 2008 Dynasty and mine from the 2009 Camelot....then the mystery is solved. THE POINT, other than the conflicting or dueling remotes... The AGS will read the Battery Voltage. If you have EITHER remote... You have to then set the ON point to a LOWER Voltage...and you have to understand the UNDER LOAD compared to RECOVERY....as well as go ONE TENTH lower on the START. See the previous posts.. This should clear it up...or it does for me...

We each have our guesses. IF the PO did all the changes...then he did them using the SAME terminals as Monaco used. MY GUESS.... The wiring on TODD's is CORRECT. I have reached out to Richard (Dr4Film). He sent me a schematic of his. It was exactly like Todd's....save the GEN SET terminal was used. And I know HIS worked...or I think it did. SO.. Whatever. There IS a BIRD on Todd's....looks original to me. Don't have the print. Todd's wiring looks OEM. It works like it should. THAT is a fact. Whether or NOT the PO was adept enough to make it work....he sure was neat and his wiring skills mirror those of Monaco. His OTHER circuit mods are way low on the totem of PROFESSIONAL... How bout we leave it here? I WILL, once I get time, publish the info that I was provided on the Lambert. That is for HISTORY, but some might find that interesting. I hate to ask this... but Todd's only SHOWS two Bosch Relays... One is the Lambert Lockout on the RIGHT. The OTHER is the Cold Weather Relay. I did NOT see the relay in his that I THINK I saw on one of your prints...again...not trying to open any more cans of worms....we have enough already to catch enough croppies for a massive fish fry. BUT...it has been a learning experience....obviously not all are interested... BUT, the first post DOES describe in detail how a BIRD SYSTEM WORKS....which is always a deep dark mystery....and they BOTH work, generally, the same. Just different control...but the concept is the same as with the regulated (reduced) PWB voltages... ON TO OTHER QUESTS... Thanks...

Maybe we looked at two different Pictures. On page 1, Todd posted a lot. Look at the BIRD here. If you scrolled up on page 2, you saw Mark's pictures. You're not the first to make reference to Mark's pictures and NOT Todd's. Go back to Page 1... I think that clears it. To confirm or just restate. Todd did a COMPLETE voltage test on HIS module...which has 4 of the wires connected. it does NOT have the Gen Set wire....and THAT is something that folks will debate for years. BUT...Todd's is exactly like MINE...save the Purple Wire and mine has the additional Control Relay... I added it as some folks get confused... This was the ISOLATION relay that Monaco added, I think, is still or was still used...up until they KILLED the Monaco MH's Hope this explains it...if NOT call me... Battery BoostCutoff switches.pdf

Also called "TINNERS RIVETS" they are usually HARDER (been heat treated) or are made from a harder base steel. The rivets in the Monaco door scissors are soft...way to soft. The TWO HAMMER trick works, as long as one is careful. MOST of the Monaco techs, though, used the old "BEND IT UP OR DOWN". That actually made it worse and sometimes the scissors hit. Bending the entire pivot point does have a SHORT term benefit as the contact points are different and they are NOT as worn....but if you keep doing that, then there is NO FRICTION in the joint. SO...do NOT bend up or down to correct. IF there is contact or rubbing...correct that. There have been TWO successful long term fixes....and that is NO SLAM on actually beating it or flattening the rivet. IF you catch it soon enough, the the flattening or creating more tension will work. BUT...past that, for the WORN or abused ones.. Replacing the Rivet with a Tinner's rivet. We had a very learned member....he knew Monaco and had one of the FEW Crown Royal bus conversions. He ran a small business and was a "character". He bought a box of the proper size Tinner's Rivets. He had a nice hydraulic press in his shop. He installed a NEW Rivet and carefully seated or compressed it for the right tension. That Rivet did NOT FAIL....many members...perhaps 50 or more had their's fixed...and Mikee's fix....never went bad. The second was an individual in Tennessee. Randall Bergen. He was a parts manager for an car dealership. He found that there was a "replaceable" rivet that had an OEM (Chevy or Ford or whoever) and it was exactly the right size. NOT having the hydraulic press, he became an expert at installing and seating or peening or compressing the new OEM rivet. Again. 100% success. He was on IRV2 and other places. He fixed mine at least 10 years ago. It still has OEM tension and holds the door open during gusty winds. Did a search of the topics.... HERE is a 2022 post. TRIED his cell....said unavailable...BUT NOT Disconnected. Don't know about the email..... Randall Bergen, 249 Cherry Blossom Trail, Dandridge, TN. 37725 - repairs scissor arms - $40. This was a few years ago, so I'd call or email him to check if he is still repairing them. 865-323-1277 rjb4jcpa@gmail.com DO NOT KNOW if he is still alive.. but....he would be my first try....as I KNOW what he did and the rivet he used is a LONG LASTING FIX... That's my history. The folks that have installed a strut are pleased... SO, whatever works for you...

THANKS for those prints. They show, and I will pass them on, that Monaco actually built it that way. I was TOLD that there never was a BIRD isolator in a 2002 as it was NOT on "HIS" print. BUT, that is neither here nor there and is an offline issue. BUT, I will take exception to you final comment. The PO did NOT DO ANY REWIRING of the circuits on the BIRD 5 pin module. Todd, after he did our voltage tests....and Frank and I reviewed them.... was asked to do ONE MORE THING. He did a voltage test...as well as a functional test of the module. SIMPLE. CHECK the pins under EACH CONDITION. ALL power OFF... NADA. NO POWER. HOUSE ON....CHASSIS OFF... Coach Battery (or House if you prefer).... 12 VDC (a loose term....full voltage). NO Power to module on any other pin. HOUSE and CHASSIS ON... SAME DEAL. Coach Battery has POWER.. IGNITION IS DEAD HOUSE and CHASSIS ON....TURN ON IGNITION. BINGO....Coach Battery and IGNITION now have 12 VDC. That is exactly the way is should be wired. That is exactly the way it shows in all the intellitec PDF.....that is exactly the way MINE is working. AND...we knew from his first set of experiments....that the RELAY (now called on newer units...SOLENOID) was sending out a PBW 3.4/3.5 VDC signal and that the WR Solenoid was humming along and engaged and working. SO, look at the pictures in his photos on the OTHER or STARTED THIS topic. ALL OEM....even the zip ties are in place. NOW...When Todd and I talked after his final voltage or pin out or "FUNCTIONAL" testing of the BIRD...I mentioned something about Mine had a RELAY. In the ORIGINAL BIRD wiring....the Boost Switch came into the RELAY terminal....and then ran over to the Solenoid. That PURPLE wire is in tact and is OEM. He said, OH YEAH. I tested that one. When you push the BOOST, you get 12 VDC on the wire. THUS....its wired exactly to Intellitec specs. In his, the diode (internal on the Relay circuit) protects the board...so when you zap the WR with a FULL 12 VDC to lock that sucker IN... That works....and the backfeed is eliminated or prevented by the diode. Intelltiec told me about that. And it was pulled and issues....thus the relay.. That's it... Please read my recent commentary. WE NEVER SAY NEVER about a Monaco. Todd's has the PANEL with the PN and also the description. SO, it was "factory" that way. BUT, from my knowledge and also Todd's testing, the module is STILL wired OEM and it works. Don't aske me what that silly white wire does. All I KNOW....the SYSTEM works and Todd has no issues. BUT, we did discuss....let the BIRD or the WR fail....he is gonna gut it, like you did and put in the ML-ACR. I did NOT realize how cheap they are now. Thanks for all your input....

WOW….if he didn’t have the 04, like I thought….then the diagram he sent me is exactly the same as yours….except, Monaco DID use the GEN SET Terminal… THANKS A BUNCH… OK…was going to post this as followup. Monaco would release prints for a Model Year. Lets say a wiring revision that required a component and a new or different harness. IF that component and harness came in early….ODDS ARE….we have seen this, that the assembly line started using it. So, a change for a 2002….was made as a RUNNING change and the end of MY 2001….had the new and improved 2002 features. NEXT scenario… Prints released. Component is late or harness….KEEP BUILDING….and the 2002 were EXACTLY LiKE the 2001’s….yes that happens….so No MATTER what the Manual or Prints say….the SHOW (Assembly Line) must go on. FINAL scenario…. Engineering needs a test MH to see if the NEW Component with the NEW harness works…..they go down and supervise a build….all well….it is released. NOW, that applied to stock units, in some cases, a special order….was custom built. NO WHERE is the prints updated. Monaco had a “iffy” approval for custom builds…. Dealers with high volumes could work with the factory and get a ONE OF A KIND special. THINK THAT IS BS. A buddy, who got me into Motor Homing was a large dealer. Also on the “elite dealers” Committee. He ordered custom MH’s for NASCAR drivers (that couldn’t afford a Prevost) as well as Crew Chiefs. He speced out a HR Navigator with things that Monaco used to put in their Crown Royal Bus conversions. This MH was way more advanced than a Signature. It cost TWICE as much….but only half or less than a Prevost. It had all the features….plus 4 MORE Intellitec Modules. This was a first run 2005. The driver was superstitious. All the LED’s in the Motor Home Intellitec lighted switch pads were custom made by Intellitec. The YELLISH GREEN was a PURE and Intense BLUE. He was probably one of a few dealers with that pull. Monaco ALSO wanted, from a marketing perspective, their UPPER ENDS in the Drivers and Crew Chief’s lots at the track, YES….I SAW IT…didn’t know anything but remember the COST and the BLUE LED conversion… FINALLY Monaco would take a mid model year….do a special build. Paint it like next year’s graphics and install the upgrades. We have members here with a documented floor plan that is NOT in that Model year….next year….yes… but was sold, after the show….or soemtimes AT THE SHOW and is a MY older that the sales Brochure. NEVER SAY NEVER…you look at what you have and verify factory….prints might NOT square…BUT Monaco built it.

We’re on the same page, except the real world is this. The normal load, for discharge, per Trojan, us supposed to be 10% or so of the total bank’s capacity. I THINK that is correct….Lithiums or AGM’s may be different….read the owner’s manual for them. OK….typically, during at least 5 different run down or exercising tests….this is real world. Have a 450 Watt halogen work light. If you divide 450 watts, by the battery voltage, that is a little less than 40 Amps. OK…that is close enough so 10% of my 4 bank amp hours is 45. DRIVE ON. NOW, when the DVOM battery voltage drops to 11.9….I stop….I might let it run and see a 11.8 blip. So….remove load. If you disconnect the jumpers and wait maybe 20 minutes….all of this is what Trojan told me or I asked for confirmation…..then measure the individual batteries. Obviously half the voltaage, but if you read the SOC table….and do a hydrometer test….they will be right at 50% discharged. That was the goal… NOW, check the electrolyte…..perfunctory but good practice. Rarely have to add. I have a dowel with a scribed mark. That mark, when you put it in a cell and it touhes the plate….is exactly half way between the plate and the bottom of the well….where Trojan says to always fill to. Install Jumpers….recharge….when FLOAT…..then pull Jumpers….and wait. They read per DVOM and hydrometer close to 100%. Hydrometer is usually a bit higher….or way better, but Voltage is dead on. NOW….that is real world…plus how Trojan says do it. In reality….one SHOULD turn off both disconnects BEFORE removing or reinstalling jumpers. If there is an arc and you have an Intellitec MPX, it may go into START UP….and if there is a microsecond interruption….the IPX or CPU or Modules go or can go haywire…. I have HAD to kill the house switch and then wait and restart for a clean “boot” or startup sequence. NOW…in your example, the variations are NORMAL….except the true way to exercise and also evaluate your bank is with a constant load. NOW….there is a timed circuit on the Magnum AGS. That allows for quick hits of high current….and that is called a “smoothing” timer…so, it does NOT say.. OMG. Prevents false positives or unnecessary AGS Start Signal. But, if your Low Battery Cutoff is set too high, you will, based on either instantaneous or shorter timer, shut down the whole system. I will ask Magnum for a review to confirm…..as well as where or what powers the remote….

The topic of question about charging has been resolved. Since it was a general interest issue, the results of the tests as well as how Todd’s 2002 Windsor was “factory” configured is now in a new topic. Here is the link. Please respond or comment on that issue there. Thanks….

Jim, you make a good point. I spent almost 2 hours with a member that understands the “Lambert” a lot more than I do. I am working on a few notes or corrections that we discussed and he sent me some prints….will be a day or so. My only comment to what he said and what you posted. He says he has never seen a 2002 Windsor with the Intellitec IRD or Bird. YES, we see coaches all the time….like…never saw Monaco make this nor is there prints…. I have seen, but can’t recall how your bay looks. We have pictures of two separate 2002 Windsors with the Intellitec IRD/BIRD 5 terminal module. Now, we do KNOW it is FACTORY. The white molded panel say so….as it was Monaco screen printed….PN and all. If you go back and look at the first thread, there is also another panel or block diagram….it says Charging “module or device…memory)….so we know that particular 2002 Windsor left that way. Another person posted a similar picture. Bottom line….it was factory installed. Todd did the voltage testing and also tested in 4 different modes. It works exactly like my 2009 system does….except one tiny detail. Later on, Monaco added a control relay for the BOOST. In the early years….the 12 VDC boost signal (momentarily held on) signal came to the BIRD via a Purple wire. It was fed INTO the RELAY terminal. BTW….Intellitec now calls that “Solenoid”. Then, it was run to one side of the WR solenoid. Thus….no boost switch ON….BWP 3.5 VDC to solenoid. Push the boost….full 12 VDC. NOW….there is a little factoid a few know, Intellitec had a blocking diode inside….so no backfeed. Maybe for a coil backfeed??? Anyway….the dropped it. BIRDs started failing. Monaco added an isolation relay to feed the coil from the BIRD or when pressed, the boost was 12 VDC. Later, Intellitec PUT IT BACK IN. Bottom line. Frank and I discussed the results of Todd’s testing. Yes….it is a FULL FLEDGED and documented (on the two Monaco labels or panels) and it works and is functional….Past that??? Still reviewing prints….but what Todd has, as far as the BIRD is factory and it works, Second point…..and you may be more knowledgeable. I THOUGHT, erroneously, that the Lambert worked when in storage…. BUT, I was told, with a robust amount of authority…..NO….the Lambert would only “steal” or maintain the chassis if there was charging voltage present on the Hiuse…. That was said to correct my “misunderstanding” of the Lambert. THUS, we agreed…..if there was a BIRD configuration…..as IS IN Todd’s 2002 Windsor…..no NEED for the Lambert. Monaco’s assemblers OFTEN put in unnecessary stuff, after a print revision…..no one explained it to them. They often built experimental units or show coaches. WHO KNOWS. But, there were TWO 2002 Windsors with the factory plastic plates that show the BIRD….and one of them works exactly as it was designed…..and yes, if the comment on the Lambert and its need for the house to be charged, is correct….and I bow to the member’s knowledge….then the Lambert was not needed….but left in. Later today….but probably in a few days….I’ll try to edit and clarify. The one thing that we, the other member agreed on…. The pictures show it installed. It works as designed. The PO gutted the Lambert and removed the Salesman solenoid. But the Charging Module was factory….an embossed or screen printed Monaco label and block diagram…. How many 2002 Windsor’s were that way? Don’t know. There was, he said, some experiments, IIRC, in 2003. DR4Film had a BIRD in his 2004 Windsor… Let me update this. If you want to call and help me understand, you have the number. Thanks,,,

OK…real world here….done 3 slides and put in Guardian plates. Jacking the slide. You need a 24” or so 2 x 4. This will be the “T” or top portion of the Jack. Next….you gotta measure. You CAN use a floor hydraulic jack or an automobile screw jack. This ain’t like lifting the Washington Monument. I used TWO 2 x 4….laminated (deck screws) for the Jack LEG. You measure like this… Bottom or undrside of the slide to a LEVEL surface. The MH needs to be LEVEL….very important. BUT…my sloped driveway wasn’t. I picked two points on the outer edge (the underside….not the flange. I was installing Guardian plates and knew how wide they were. I gave myself 2” clearance….so…that point was the edge of the 24” TEE or TOP. Now…in theory….the lack leg will be 12” further in. Mark that….on each side. Now measure down to the driveway or whatever. Say 36”…..now the math. Subtract 1 3/4” for the TEE….use 2”…. Next….when the jack is totally down….how high is the pad. BTW…Bottle Jacks are my choice….then an Auto screw. Trying to control a floor is NOT what I would use. SAY the Jack is 12” from bottom of base to top of pad, when fully down… Subtract 12”. NOW, you gotta put it in and get it in position….maybe 1 - 2” “working or clearance”….but the longer then the higher the jack….so use 1”. Subtract 1”. That is a total of 15”…..you measured 36”…..your Jack Leg, after you screw it onto the 2 x 4 will be 36 - 15 or 21”. if the surface is not level….do the other end. next is simple….position each jack and raise the jack until the T Jack (post) contacts the slide….then raise each side about 1/8th inch. You need a “measuring” or reference point on the slide so you know “how much” the slide….at the side wall is raised. BTW….The point, as to how far from the MH the T post is….varies. If you decide to run the T post perpendicular to the side wall….then the points will be different. Memory says I centered the distance from the outer edge of the slide to the side wall….then ran the TEE perpendicular…. Some do it, I think, the other way. THE MAIN THING….only use one jack to move 1/8” or so on that side…..then do the other end. I only raised mine to get the underside of the slide up enough to slide in the Guardian plate….with maybe 1/16” or so clearance. The rest is pure common sense and “how do I fix what I broke”. I KNOW for a fact….than on a living room slide with a refrigerator, it typically takes 4 guys to lift and remove it. Obviously all connections to mechanism and umbilical have to be removed. They put it on a cart positioned right behind it. Bedroom slides are 2 -3…a fullwall slide….GOD only knows….and a dealer will probably not removed tell you to go to a Monaco repair center where they have the cart and such. BUT simply raising and working under it and replacing or putting in a Guardian plate….piece of cake. The “wear” hopefully, is just external…..and NOT from a leak. You do a small hole saw core….maybe 3/4” and examine the core and the sides for “ROT” or mosture My three were all superficial issues….nary a drop of water. Don’t make false conclusions without facts and coring. When you grind or cut off the lower side frsme for the Guardian Plates…..you’ll know….in an instant…water or rot….damage or NONE….

OK….my take….and what Magnum told me. The AGS Module is NOT, when using the REMOTE, taking any signal from a remote on the battery. Whatever value is being input or provided to the Magnum remote….that is the Digital or Multiplexed value or control for the AGS….regardless of old 4 or new AGS-N. Therefore, if you use the remote readout as the “gospel” or the set parameter for “start” or turn on, then, as I posted, you need to know how that correlates to the real world of the HOUSE BANK. That takes into account the “innate error”, as Magnum verified, of the remote meter…..versus the Battery Voltage. NEXT….you have to know how much voltage drop you are experiencing ….UNDER LOAD. You then set the START voltage based on that….but you subtract 0.1 or one tenth. The Magnum reaction or “OMG, START should be based or calculated that way. PUT another way. Lets say you want to start when the batteries reach 50% SOC. That is defined as the “recovery” voltage….NOT the under load voltage. Per the charts….the SOC for 50% is about 12 VDC. LETS ASSUME the Magnum meter is perfect….your DVM and it are dead on. NOW, lets assume that your UNDER LOAD Voltage is 11.9 VDC…..and you KNOW, through testing that when that stabilizes…..or remains constant….that the bank will recover to 12.0. SO….as LONG as the UNDER LOAD voltage is 11.9….OK. BUT when the under load voltage hits 11.8…..then it is time to start and recharge…NOT 11.9… SO, per Magnum and Trojan, you set the AGS to 11.8. The Magnum has a timed delay…..so maybe after 2 minutes….assuming the voltage is stabile….and it reads 11.8….BINGO the genny starts. You had a brief, inconsequential time of a couple of minutes where the SOC dropped to say 45% or so….but you met the objective of “recharge” when SOC is LESS than 50%. OK….hope that helps….. NEXT UP….you need to know the delta or error or difference between the REAL DVOM House voltage and what the Magnum remote reads….once you know that is Zero or maybe 0.1 or probably closer to 0.2…..then you adjust or use the correlated Remote voltage. Worse case….say there is a 0.2 VDC error. You set your Magnum based on expecting it to be 11.8….OPPS, in reality…the Battery Voltage is higher…..as the Magnum remote TYPICALLY, per Magnum, reads LOWER. Thus, 11.8 on the REMOTE is actually 12.0 on the DVM. NOW to correlate and achieve your 50% SOC, you have to set the VOLTAGE LOWER….0.2 ERRROR…..OMG….that will be 11.6. BLASPHEMY. NOPE reality. SO when someone says…..NEVER SET BELOW 12.0….there are two misconceptions. First….that should be 11.9….as when 12.1 DROPS to 12.09….that is a 12… NOPE….when the UNDER LOAD Hits 11.8….that is the correct value. second….the meters are NOT PERFECT. REALITY….Monaco put the AGM’s up front or back in the rear. If in manual, I THINK that the placement here and voltage issues or drops are ONLY Relevant when you use it in manual mode. In the REMOTE MONITOR controlled mode….the REMOTE is the “Voltage Keeper”. Call Magnum and verify. SECOND, I have NO IDEA if you have a BMK what the remote wil read compared to the DVOM at the battery. Test and then adjust….or maybe not needed. THIRD, @Frank McElroy did a little “rewring”. I don’t remember exactly why, but he changed it so the actual REMOTE reading has less LOSS. He will have to chime in. THATS MY UNDERSTANDING and the explanation and logic of how to properly set the AGS from the remote…. NOW, you see, if your mind took months like mine did to develop snd understand the above scenario……why Magnum decided NOT to “tell the average” owner….but in detailed discussions…..this is how it works…..and Trojan says….when the Under Load voltage….which is NOT the true or recovery voltage…..usually 0.10 - 0.20….you set the AGS to come on 0.1 below that….

MODERATOR NOTE. Ken is correct. It is a rule to do a title or subject search, prior to a new tooic. @Ali-026 Ordinarily , your new topic, which is a virtual repeat of the other one, would be merged. BUT….due to the age of that topic and the number of replies….as well as “the staff has a life, too” and we didn’t catch it earlier….this topic stands. However, here is the old one….and as Ken says….the gist of the replies were in the old thread….not merging. Please review this and get more information…. Please follow the guidelines for key word search prior to staring a new topic. Thanks for doing that in the future….

Moderator EDIT. Title was edited for info and clarity. OK… You have great answers….to summarize and also help you find the information next time, we always hope that before a topic is posted, than an owner reviews their. Owner’s manual. Sections 8 and 9 provide a lot more than just what you asked. You wil learn a lot….and don’t be discouraged if it all sort of “blows your mind”….it happens to most….and even now, I still learn nuances that I didn’t know or sometimes correct a misunderstanding. The inverter charges the House Bank. But, how this all happens and the “OMG”….no outlet power or lights or such is a common question. So read about how the inverter works and actually take the manual and identify the components and understand how to “read or program” things like the Inverter remote. ANOTHER valuable resource is the SALES BROCHURE… You can download the manual as well as the Sales Brochure here. https://www.monacocoach.com/service-and-repairs/ OK….quickly….from the Sales Brochure we find out a LOT. The end has ever section or system. And based on going over prints for others, I’m pretty confident….your Genny starts off the House. Rick IS correct….Monaco flipped and flopped.. The LOWER ends from Camelot on down, in 2007 were HOUSE GENNY CRANK. The Dynasty and up were CHASSIS GENNY CRANK. Rick’s “no right or wrong“ is correct but since at least 2007 (maybe a year or so earlier) and until Monaco (Navistar owned after bankruptcy in 2009) was sold to REV circa 2013/14….this is almost iron clad. BUT one never knows….nor does one know if a Previous owner, or an owner like Ben, chose to swap… it is done. OK….next up….the charging….I got off track due to looking for a link and giving you a resource. You have, most likely, a Magnum inverter. Read the section 8. If you find the Inverter Remote….odds are….it says MAGNUM. An Inverter is actually a dual purpose device. It supplies 120 VAC power from the house 12 VDC bank.). It is ALSO a CHARGER….that charges the House bank. So, in your case….when you run the gnerator….or are on AC (Pedestal) power….the Inverter’s “CHARGING” section is ON….unless you turn it off and most never do.. SO it charges your House Batteries. When you drive, the engine alternator charged the CHASSIS Bank. If you carefully READ the charging section 8…Page 155. It states….when driving….The Alternator will CHARGE the House…Conversely….Pedestal Power or Genny will CHARGE the Chassis. That is called BiDirectional charging….a MUST. OK….enough “lessons” for today. BUT….when a new or inexperienced member starts asking questions about electrical and such….we have to post a STANDARD and IMPORTANT warning. THERE is a KNOWN SAFETY DEFECT in the OEM Systems. Look on page 155. If your rig has the IOTA 50-R Automatic Transfer Switch, it MUST be replaced. It is defective and has the potential for a FIRE or other damages. Your coach is an “orphan”. Navistar bought Monaco in bankruptcy. They have NO LEGAL Obligation to recall MONACO installed items. They recalled all 2010 models that had this switch and replaced them. If yours has this switch (see picture), it is DANGEROUS. We recommend that you use the Motor Home sparingly….and immediately rectify. Many good ATS out there. The most popular “stocked” switch is the ESCO LPT50BRD….AKA “LYGHT” ATS. Many have researched and selected other brands and models. You can do a search here Use IOTA and click on EVERYWHERE…..then select TOPICS. Pages and pages of every post. The two sentences that I wrote sum it up. PLEASE verify which brand you have and if IOTA…be aware of the potential danger. Good luck….welcome aboard…

NOTE....This is a FOLLOWUP or the "BTW" or MORPHED question towards the end of the following topic. Todd, and THANKS TO HIM, did a lot of leg work and actually tested his BIRD system. So, if you are NOT familiar with that thread....please scroll down to where he asked questions about the charging system... There will be a NOTE on it referring to this post for the final answer. We felt it was NOTEWORTHY enough to actually start a new topic... I AM receiving some offline feedback and discussions. IF there is something in this post that needs correcting...I have ITALICIZED that text or paragraph as I promised some members that I would do...or have verified something that they thought was wrong...Two Way Street. As a background, Todd's 2002 Windsor is different from many others. how many and what percentage...no one knows. Todd was able to START the engine with the Chassis Battery disconnected and got a warning on his Victron Shunt based "Battery Monitoring Kit"...which is what Magnum also calls their system. Had he NOT had it.....the gauges probably would have been "FUNKY". This occurred 10 or more years ago and we did a test...with some willing Camelot owners. TEN (or so....memory...not ONE or TWO) would NOT start with the Chassis OFF. BUT ONE DID and the Gauges were crazy. YES....That is NOT how one is supposed to do it. BUT, like many of us, Todd accidentally TURNED OFF the Chassis....it happens. OK... Once that was resolved...that, AGAIN, the same model....built within some time frame, will be different..IT happens. Many use the term SNOWFLAKES... LOL. Todd's Rig has had some "GUTTING". The PO removed and taped off the Salesman Switch. He had also disconnected the Lambert Maintainer. Todd posted pictures and we discussed. Suggest you scroll the other thread if these are not "embedded in your brain"... SO... Todd agreed to do the testing. We have spent a week on it due to vacations and such. I also discussed with Frank McElroy. I also did a key word search in the PDF of the 2002 Windsor manual. If you don't know how to do that....I'll explain at the end. I did this morning. There are 471 uses of the word BATTERY. There are over 60 words that start with MAINTAIN. I ALSO...more carefully, which is what I tell folks to do...but sometimes SKIM...shame on me....the DISCUSSION on Charging. BOTTOM LINE. Todd's 2002 Windsor DID, from the Factory, have FULL BiDirectional of BIRD Charging. See Page 9-227. In all fairness, the later manuals used BIRD or DiDirectional terms....and THAT is what I and others that help and pull manual MIGHT look for. BUT... It DOES Charge the HOUSE while Driving. It DOES Charge the CHASSIS when on Generator or on AC (Shore) power. NOW...Todd has a great Solar system. He uses it in Dry (no power) storage. We discussed and when the batteries do NOT NEED charging....and all is WELL....the 100 Amp White Rogers Battery Connect or BOOST Solenoid drops out....as the BIRD (Diesel or Diesel2) module controls it. SO, the BIRD (Diesel) Module, which is original....WORKS. He tested the White Rodgers solenoid. The contacts are GREAT. There is NO voltage DROP. OK....BUT NOW THE SURPRISE...It is SUPPOSEDLY a Continuous 12 VDC Solenoid. YES...WR says so. Tried googling and looked at many spec sheets, but, you can NOT find the MINIMUM Voltage. The BIRD Module sends out a Pulsed Band Width or "regulated" signal. OK... That means...the voltage is 12 VDC, but the BIRD pulses it so that it is only ON for about 25% or so of the time. The "Pulse" is sent out...say 25 to 50 times per second. This is exactly HOW the Injectors work on your car or diesel. They turn ON and OFF say 35 times every second. In the ORIGINAL Bosch fuel injectors, used in almost all of the late 80's (the clones as well), that was 50. FACT as I was project Manager to BUILD a Bosch Injector. NO IDEA, on the BIRD, without a scope, the Hertz or Cycles or Frequency....say 25 times. That means that the solenoid could see, at 100% ON....the 12 VDC for 40 Milliseconds. BUT, since this is a REGULATED PULSE and Todd measure the actual VOLTAGE on the coil...it shows up on a DVOM as say around 3.5 VDC. The ORIGINAL Intellitec tech support guy said 3.0 to 4.5 VDC (read on a meter) was OK. NOW, for any Dynasty owner....you have a SPECIAL #6 Board that replaces the BIRD Diesel 2...your pulsed or average voltage is higher....around 8 VDC on the meter. OK....how did I use or understand all the numbers and such.... and what does it MATTER? GLAD you asked that. If we divide 3.5 VDC by 12.6 VDC...you get .28 or 28% ON. NOW if the pulse Hertz is say 35. You divide 1000 (milliseconds) by 35. The ON or MAX time is 28.5 Milliseconds. TO GET 3.5 VDC (on the DVOM), that means that the pulse width or ON time is 28% of 28.6 or 7.2 Milliseconds....and the frequency is 35 TIMES per second. OK...that means that coil is "EFFECTIVELY" only seeing or has a FULL 12.6 VDC for (35 X 7.2 Milliseconds) or 252 Milliseconds or about 25% of the TIME. SO, the 12 VDC is on for 25%....and OFF for 75%. THUS...the voltage on a DVOM is 3.5 VDC. I KNOW that you are worried about a POP QUIZ....There is NONE. BOTTOM LINE. WE DID NOT KNOW that the White Rodgers Solenoid would WORK at this lower or average (3.5VDC) voltage. SOME Solenoids must have a full 12 VDC. OK...NOW... for the last piece...I and YOU HOPE... When the BIRD modules says.. OK... COIL....I'm gonna ENERGIZE YOU....it KNOWS it needs a "2 X 4" to wake up the COIL and get it going. SO, for a few seconds (how long...read the Intellitec PDF)...say 12 - 15 seconds....it sends out a PURE or continuous 12 VDC Signal PROBABLY PULSED at 100%...but effectively like a DIRECT Non Pulsed signal.. REMEMBER THIS...IT IS IMPORTANT. Then the Voltage is PULSED down to 3.5 VDC. THUS, the coil runs COOLER. Again...SOME solenoids MIGHT NOT WORK with the LOWER Voltage. OK...WHY is this important....to THOSE of us that have the 200 AMP (most used) PURE Intellitec Solenoid....if we PUT a PURE or 100% 12 VDC and held it on for a minute or so....the coil will start to overhead. Therefore...on the BIRD on the Camelot's and the #6 Board on the Dynasty's....the 200 Amp solenoid is always operating at a LOWER voltage. Now the Dynasty makes more noise and is hotter. DUH....8 VDC vs 3.5 VDC. You can NOT hold you hand around the Solenoid...it is THAT HOT... OK...back to Todd and his 2002 Windsor. For whatever reason; Monaco had the Lambert Maintainer as as STOCK or BASE feature......and they sometimes worked or other times did not. That is very nicely and simply explained on page 9-252. IT WAS INTENDED for use in DRY storage. The Lambert (Amp-L-Start or clones) all work the same way. SOME have more sophisticated...and hopefully MORE RELIABLE... circuits. BUT, if you had a charged or good HOUSE, the Lambert would steal (they are called THIEVES) voltage. AND then when the House got too low....as in CANNOT crank the Genny, they would shut down...to keep from draining the House. In THEORY...GREAT. Practically....BASED on the comments from over 15 years....marginal. I talked for a long time....many years ago, to the Plant Manager (maybe Mr. Lambert?) and he explained HOW they worked and the diode circuits and the logic. BUT, they have and do fail. Sometimes they quit charging the Chassis. Sometimes they DRAIN the House. OK...Monaco included...as a STANDARD feature a Lambert. WHY....my GUESS. That they knew some MH's were in Covered Storage WIHOUT the ability for a Solar to work. SOLAR was an OPTION....NOT a standard feature. The BIRD (BiDirectional) and Maintainer WERE. Have NO idea if the stock 60 Watt Solar, with NO LOAD....would support both...depends on the sun and other factors. BUT...here's the BOGO from using the KEY WORD SEARCH.... INVERTER is used 146 TIMES. I learned, and it will help others who have issues, that there IS an ON/OFF switch on the Inverter (Trace). SO, for SOLAR only Charging, without the Lambert (or such), if you leave ON the HOUSE Switches....then BOTH Batteries will be charged. By the ON/OFF Switch...being on the Inverter...you can TURN IT OFF...thus the only parasitic drain should be the ECM (ECU) and the Allison Brain. That assumes you don't have any extra goodies hooked up. I do NOT know if Todd's Victron uses a smidge of parasitic current to keep it "functional". NOW a NOTE and a REPEAT to KILL the MYTH for the MAGNUM's. They do NOT have a HARD SNAP or mechanical ON/OFF switch. Many will (and have vehemently...unfortunately) stated that you can "TURN IT ALL THE WAY OFF" by pressing the REMOTE BUTTON. WRONG (Magnum VERIFIED THAT TODAY 5/8). The MAGNUM is always, (like a Plugged in TV) in STANDBY. If you unplug a new smart TV...bet it goes into all sorts of gyrations and screens. IT HAS TO. But when you push OFF, it goes to black...but the little RED light is ON....so when you push POWER....INSTANT screen...no Startup. The Magnum works the same way. TWO techs said...when you push the ON/OFF remote switch...all that does is turn it "off", but it STAYS IN STANDBY. It will STILL draw up to 3 AMPS (tested my several here) NOW...if you really want to TURN IT OFF....and eliminate the Parasitic drain....TWO WAYS. Push, quickly...no NOT hold the POWER button on the Inverter. BUT, some folks, per Magnum have difficulty and don't look at the lights. The EASIST and MOST Reliable method...do the SOFT RESET. THEN STOP....do NOT power it BACK ON by pushing the POWER button. Then the draw will be a few milliamps. OK...do NOT fall into the TRAP....turning OFF the 30 Amp breaker is the same as UNPLUGGING from SHORE. The inverter is STILL in the Standby MODE. Plug in a phone charger....it works... SO, if a Magnum owner wants to REMOVE the Parasitic STANDBY LOAD... Do the SOFT RESET. BUT STOP...do NOT push the POWER BUTTON, which is the last step. THAT is how it is done... BOTTOM LINE....the 2002 Windsor was way MORE advanced as was commonly posted here. It HAD BiDirectional Charging (per the manual and TESTED on a STOCK or unaltered system). It HAD a Maintainer. That was FOR NO POWER or SOLAR in storage...but you had to keep the HOUSE charged or periodically charged....otherwise....the Lambert powered OFF (sometimes prematurely...other times when the HOUSE has been drained) and you SHOULD be able to keep the Chassis Charged. That's it. YES...TOO LONG...but this is how it works....and also how the current Dynasty and above work. IF you have a BIRD Module...then odds are...YES...BiDirectional. NEVER fully understood that. Richard (Dr4Film) sent me a hand drawn schematic of how his 2004 Windsor worked. OK....it was similar to mine. BTW... ONE MORE MYTH. The GEN SET Terminal on the BIRD really does, on a Monaco....NOTHING. Many, but not Todd's, came with a signal wire.... I THINK...so Memory...that some 2002 Windsor's came that way. Richard's did have the Generator signal. MATERS NOT....the BIRD works with and without it. DON'T ASK for more. WOW...if you made it this far. If you have a PC or Laptop and use the freebie Adobe reader. Download your manual and save it on your hard drive. Open it FROM THE HARD DRIVE using Adobe. In the UPPER right is a FIND box. Type in any key word... Battery; Inverter; Maintain or whatever and you get a Word Count of how many times used. If you use the RIGHT ARROW or hit enter...it scrolls through every page with it. NOW...that also works on SOME of our prints. Like the OEM Monaco's. SOME of the Scanned (from the Manual) support it...but some were saved and that option, for whatever reason...BOMBS...of course BATTERY is used. BUT when it is, and this is a REAL blessing...on a print. You can find a switch or a term... Like.. SLIDE. Every PRINT (assuming it supports the FIND) that has the word SLIDE on it will then allow you to go directly to it. That, for me, saves a TON OF TIME. Sorry about the length...but this is the only topic or post, that I think is out here...that discussed this issue. MIGHT do it in a FILE....too tired now. Happy troubleshooting and a shoutout to TODD as well as FRANK. NOW WE KNOW...

You just confirmed what I posted two days or so ago...and what AH always TELLS FOLKS....and what my Tech told me. Thanks.... Read the post that is about 8 posts UP....

To clear up a few things....which might not be fully understood... In the LATER modules...and this impacts the 2012 Dip that was the ORIGINAL failure and probably (most likely) the Patriot Thunder....and Ben's 2008 Camelot is this way. When you have a certain level of remote....then the knobs on the AGS are meaningless. Thus, in the failure case...you could have them randomly set. When you use the REMOTE and set the AGS parameters...that bypasses all the mechanical or manual programming. You have to read your MH manual as well as the Manual for your "Rev Level" or version of the remote. Thus, tinkering with the knobs on the 2012 does nothing. NOW.. the TEST BUTTON does work. BUT, if you want to use the AGS and do the manual programming, you have to DISCONNECT IT...as in PULL the NETWORK cable. The OTHER cable is the Temp Thermocouple mounted behind the Dometic Thermostat in the interior. I THINK that you can use it in the manual....or NOT CONNECTED to the REMOTE mode... BUT, then IF the NETWORK CABLE is connected....it is TOTALLY REMOTE CONTROLLED.... That's the way it works....and Magnum went over this during a troubleshooting. I THINK, the even with the NETWORK cable hooked up... the TEST BUTTON will work. BUT....IF you use the TEST MODE on the REMOTE....It MIGHT TEST OK...but in reality...it won't work. OK....A BOGO OR A FREEBIE....IF YOU WANT TO POPERLY USE AND UNDERSTAND YOUR AGS...AND THIS APPLIES TO MAGNUM AND THE 4 KNOB...OR THE NEW AGS-N NEVER, EVER set the knob nor the Remote setup to lower than 11.7 VDC. Folks have different opinions...so this is the STRAIGHT SKINNY from Magnum. Magnum says that what I am about to post is TOO COMPLICATED to put in their manual...and the average owner's eyes would glaze over. THIS is covered in the BATTERY 101 and the Magnum Setup Files that I wrote...and can be downloaded. Magnum does NOT guarantee but +/- 10% ACCURACY for the Volt Reading on the Remote. IT IS IN THE SPECS. SO, you MUST know the Correlation between the actual VOM Battery Voltage and what Magnum remote displays. Mine is about 0.15 - 0.20 VDC LOWER on the remote than on the SCREEN. BUT, the screen value is what drives the AGS... NOW....when your batteries are running down....and you have them under load....if you measure the Battery voltage....and record the Remote. That is MY ERROR. Magnum said it is NORMAL. Next up. When a battery is under a normal load, you can read the voltage. BUT, if you remove the load... then let the battery rest and recover....the voltage will return or recover or POP BACK. Many phone calls to Trojan and this is a FACT. SO...if you don't want to get under the theoretical 50% State of Charge (SOC)... Then most folks will set the Remote to 12.0 VDC. In reality....they are SHORT CYLING or starting the AGS when their batteries are at perhaps 65 to 70% SOC. WAY TOO HIGH. OK...let that sink in...and again....Trojan and Magnum were my "sources" or the "SHELL ANSWER" man and they BOTH confirmed these two factoids. It is SAFE to set the Magnum to say 11.8 or so....maybe 11.7 FOR THE AGS Start Voltage. THAT gets the batteries drained lower. Magnum says that they don't know HOW bad the batteries are. IF you do the load tests...and some have, as I did...then knowing the correlation of the voltage readings... 11.8 is safe. SOME SAY...11.9. Still to high for me. BUT, arbitrarily...without understanding HOW the Magnum AGS works and where it gets is signal and also how a battery works....will shorten the life of your batteries. OK.. every once and a while. NO ISSUES. BUT, if you use the AGS more than a few times each season...or if you really, as you SHOULD, let your batteries drain, under load to 50%, then use 11.8 VDC. THAT has a second advantage. By letting your MH actually EXERCISE and discharge or run down your House Bank to a 50% SOC, you do NOT need to do the 3 - 6 months DISCHARGE (3 cycles) that Trojan recommends. We have members, me included, that get 8 or so longer YEARS from our Trojans buy doing the Preventative Maintenance DISCHARGING. We use Battery Miser caps so the electrolyte (actually the Distilled Water) does not boil off and is recovered). We rarely add an ounce to each cell. We load test and our batteries are at 95 - 100% GOOD AS NEW...as in the SOC Specific Gravity and Voltage charge shows that. THAT is the lesson for today....

OK...Steve and I talked. To summarize... He has has issues in the past. He can replace the MAIN Headlight Fuse...that 25 A drives or sends switched power via the Main Headlight Relay. He can put in a new fuse. ALL IS WELL. BUT, the moment he starts the engine....blows the 25 Amp fuse. Please look at this print...posted before. We have had ONE instance....or maybe two. A VIP Wheel MH had a Relay in the Daytime Running Lights socket. For WHATEVER REASON. That killed the MAIN Power Fuse. Did NOT kill the 15 Amp fuse going to the VIP and the Headlight switch. NOTE...that the Headlight Relay gets its COIL power from the Headlight DRIVER Relay below. OK....bear with me and this is more of a WHAT IF than a pure analysis. Notice that there is a 15 Amp fuse providing power to the light switch as well as the VIP controller. Therefore you can send a signal or power UP to the input of the Headlight Relay....and that 15 Amps would briefly power the headlights or the clearance lights and such. If there is a dead short somewhere in the controller and that power line is shorted....100% when engine is running. BINGO...it also backfeeds the headlight 25 Amp fuse. AGAIN...I'm just trying to wrap my head around it...so if anyone has more knowledge...please jump in here. Steve needs HEADLIGHTS. The temporary work around. He removes the output (Terminal 30) from the Headlight Relay. He attaches a fused (5 A) HOT Chassis lead to it. NOW, he has power to the HI/LO switch. His LOW beams will come on. He can switch to HIGHT. He will test... THEN start the engine....and pull out the headlight switch to PARK. REMEMBER....when he blows the 25 Amp fuse....the parking and clearance lights STILL WORK.... SO, he installs a simple home light switch in a handy box....double stick taped to a convenient location. When he drives at night....he turns ON the headlights like one would do "aux" driving lights. The control circuit is now hot to the HI/LO and he can dim and drive. I THINK this will work. Steve is on board and will test. ANY IDEAS WHERE the Ignition ON or RUNNING "GROUND" signal is coming from? Headlights and Fog lights.pdf

From a Moderator's standpoint, it is suggested that the back and forth for information and such an exchanging phones be done in a PM. That keeps this from being cluttered. Once the issue is resolved, then post what happened. There appears to be three members involved...but I may be wrong. One PM from either one to the other two and then the issue can be resolved or exchange phone numbers... From MEMORY.... We have a person who has a relative that works for is affiliated with Louisville Engineering. Many folks have used Louisville Engineering for remanufactured or refurbished AH boards. They have been a good tech source and, in one case, they actually supplied a harness and relays to isolate a circuit as the particular coach had a "GEE...WHAT IS THIS?" issue. ONE zone, when the Dometic simply "CALLED" for heat and closed the "DRY CONTACTS" on the Aquahot board....would short out the board. The board always "shorted" in the same exact place...and it was on the PUMP circuit. That is a "TRACE" circuit from the main point on the board that is activated when the wires are "connected"....as in the Thermostat and the Control Module is calling for heat. We traced the circuits and measured and such. There was NO STRAY voltages or such coming the Control Module. In fact, when the thermostat or ON/OFF leads were shorted...or tested with a jumper....it happened. Then it got funky. The owner had an Ebay pump....which might NOT have been the CORRECT wattage...so maybe the short was an overload. BUT, Louisville Engineering designed an isolation harness so that the power for the zone came from a separate fused feed and the circuits were isolated and if there was an accidental ground in the control leads....the ON/OFF was totally in ONE circuit. SO, Louisville has had some good feedback. Hope you guys sort through how to get a tester and what Louisville does and can and cannot do. THEN let us know. A phone call save a lot of posting and typing. Thanks for understanding...

YES, Frank is obviously the SKILLED tech on the K'Berg system. I have seen other pictures that he texted me of his "RIGS". From my warped sense of humor viewpoint... I had the thought that if I looked hard enough, we could see the ghost of Steve Jobs and perhaps a flashback with Bill Gates....as they BOTH did their tinkering in a garage or their dorm room. The ability to figure out complex electronics and resolve seemingly impossible things lives on... We once had a member who's job it was to "FIGURE OUT" why a high priced (think hundreds of thousands of the Defense Department Funds) board "FAILED" and what the company had to do to prevent a reoccurrence. These boards were from God only knows how many different products that one of the MAJOR (maybe largest) Defense Contractors in the US. This individual was one of a team of Ex Military Techs that were hired locally by this company. When the DoD would return a failed board....say, they were testing a new version of a Tomahawk missile...and there was more electronics on it that K'Berg ever dreamt. The DoD wanted it analyzed. The Designer had to write up a corrective action program to ensure that the next time they pushed the FIRE button....the missile launched. The EE-PhD's that designed them KNEW the circuits. However, they (er SOME...not all...but MOST) were somewhat less than well versed when it came to actually building their creations. They specified all the component and the circuits. THEN, the PCB Guru's had to design the board and then figure out HOW to build it. SOME of these were HAND BUILT... Some were high demand...so there was a small automated or semi-automated assembly line. BUT...when it FAILED....it went to the "SKUNK WORKS" in the basement. These folks had to examine it with microscopes and figure out if there were cracks or open circuits in the traces....or whether a capacitor failed and started the chain reaction. Our Ex Member was a whiz at this...but he said he and his buddies suffered from "BRAIN BURN OUT"...and the circuits were so complex... Every time I see one of Frank's "projects"... I think about my friend, who we often call or email and his job after his service.. It takes a special skill and Frank's spans the Theoretical or Design....down to the BOARD....something that is RARE. We are lucky to have him. He also helps me learn so that I can assist others without his guidance....and for that I am eternally grateful. FINAL comment. I have a "control" issue with my well and residential pump and also an upgraded (now required) pressure switch and the "bypass and refresh" loop installed by my friend, a Professional Geologist that works on large cities wells and is one of the experts well known in the South East. Finally, I designed a simple relay controlled solenoid system that will resolve DW's "we ain't got any pressure". She said... Now THAT is brilliant.....wire it up and get it running. I took that opportunity to tell her that the knowledge that I gained here....even though I had done all sorts of process control and was also an EE for 2 years....the PRACTICAL here.... was what helped me simplify the final version....and make it work. So, much of the electrical and electronics advice that is given is thanks to Frank and also the input of others....and we are blessed to have him....along with others... Paul Whittle, for example, that are well versed in the Intellitec MPX control systems in all Dynasties (Circa 2006) and above.... GREAT JOB...as usual...

ODDS ARE…bad motor. Mine failed (same year as yours) in a similar manner. Would start to move or such….but never locked in. Whether it starts to move and only a little or moves almost to full opening, but stops…. It is a SAFETY HAZARD. Mine “looked” OK, until my 100 pound 16 YO GD stepped and the steps collapsed and retracted. She was able to catch herself and did not fall….her 75 YO GM might not have been so lucky. The motor is designed to go full cycle. NOW…there is a “current limiting” citcuit. I think that is in the motor….and not the controller. There is a very simple….but “often not used….until new parts lime a controller is replaced….and nothing changed….” Coachstep or Lippert Coachstep trouble shooting guide. You do not have to remove the step….just follow the simple “instructions”. Follow the instructions in the troubleshooting guide or section at the end. You do NOT have to drop the step to install a motor. It ain’t the easiest task…but 90% or more do it. The techs do it. The only caveat…a new motor, which can be purchased many places and from many “offshore” vendors will have to be CAREFULLY positioned. I ordered a “stickered” OEM motor from ebay. The three hole bosses or the 3 holes where the bolts go through the motor and then screw into the frame….were “off”. I gave up. CW down the road had a “Stromberg Carlson” OEM motor for $20 more and I paid $75 for the labor…. SOME have carefully drilled out or used a circular file to open up the holes. Just don’t go in there and drill them to say “1/4”. The motor is supposed to be rigidity mounted. If you open them up so there is say 1/8” clearance in every hole…the motor is gonna shift or move. You take it slow and get it to barely fit. Mine had two holes that perfectly aligned… always the same one. I would have carefully opened that hole (it is a zinc die cast housing….easy to file off a little)…until the screw engaged the frame. It was 100 degrees….could have been a small burr in that hole, NOW do NOT USE THE STEP. Assuming you have lubricated the pivot points and have lubed the “rack”. Everyone has their pet spray. The Boeshield is the darling of the “bikers” or cyclist…. Triflow is the darling of shooters….and professional locksmiths. If there is rust and corrosion on the pivot bolts or points, then Liquid wrench works well. Many here have a witches brew that they swear by. As long as it was working snd moving slightly…a Liquid wrench would be my choice…. But later on …a good lube. WD40 will also work. But LW and WD40 are not “leave in place” lubes…they clean…and free up. The Boeshield and Triflow are not penetrants…they lube. The “bikers” say that the Boeshield is “stickier” than Triflow…and one does NOT want a sticky lube used in a firearm’s action. I use garage door spray on the rack and the pivot points…. JUST QUIT USING IT…until you determine the cause. Rarely, very rarely, is it anything but a motor or a little rusted pivots….so it is easily repaired.

This is a classic sign of the nozzle being gummed up or the filter clogged. Mine will run 2 years or so,…then…NOPE. The standard service is to replace the Nozzle and the filter and to adjust the “burner” or reposition it. I would not start to chase anything….until I has that done or watched a video and did that myself. Then, read the manual or find a video and start to troubleshoot the startup cycle as well as some of the common failure items.

Sounds like a plan to me. You got it. My approach would be the same for my Camelot….except…one dead soldier….NEW ARMY. Now….this is MY OPINION….and my circumstances and my “skill set”. I am going to pay my trusted tech to do it….I could do it…but I fix things that are more complex and don’t have anyone to help with the toting and lifting…..or a good helper. NOW….having said that…I know a lot more about the ins ans out and MPX “uniqueness” than he probably does. I know that if trouble occurs….and Imhave the complete Dometic package, the Dometic dealer tech support will assist him. IF there was a “BLACK BOX” tester that one could hook up on an install and then get idiot lights or whatever….that the RJ Data Cable to the thermostat is “working”….and he had one….then i MIGHT consider the MicroAir. Since I have personally talked to tech support at Dometic, MicroAir….and also Coleman to see about making a RecPro work…. I don’t want to have to start changing control modules and such. My ONLY criticism of MicroAir….other than not knowing the reliability of their units. Their design engineers know way LESS about how a Dometic system works than most who read and learn here. They just “tore apart” the 5 button and 10 button and fed it data on a bench and then cloned the functions. They have NARY a clue as to what happens on the other end….all they know is how to send a coded signal. NOW…maybe, like Frank did for the Kong’b….the circuit designers bought the control modules and breadboarded up a system. OK….that’s how they did it, BUT…the two techs….in 2 separate phone calls said….we do not “understand” how the MPX works. We know that our units, regardless of type or vendors, will interchange. We do NOT, at our level, know how nor will we trouble shoot. The requirements are that the owner must have a reliable and functional downstream system….or in your case….a Dometic system…. CC CCC or CCC2. Thanks for calling. We have already had issues where the folks here fixed or identified the issue….a bad Controller and MicroAir was clueless….but would ship a replacement…. Sort or like you having a big hole in an aluminum wheel…tire will not hold air. You don’t know it. The tire shop gives you a new tire….but don’t know how to test. YES…my warped logic….but, if it is all Dometic….no finger pointing and a source for fixing. Maybe a tech might…but techs seemed to be “stumped” more and more and don’t want to work on our legacy units. I watched a tech use a laptop and install some gee whiz complex upgrade to a high dollar rig. He knew it all or was on the phone and ran the diagnostic. BUT…asked a question about a simple amps and volts issue on a hydraulic unit…said….you need a new unit….we don’t really troubleshoot… Mobile techs are the same. Been in caravans and the techs installed new parts until it worked… MY OPINION….others will differ…

Well NOW….isn’t that interesting….here is my take on it. And you might have just offered a good insight…. OK…your PREVIOUS Windsor, Myron has stated…..and he is a great tech….no 12 VDC to rear. Comes in on the front. The control module distributed the 12 VDC back to the thermostat. It also sent it the other way to the rear. Maybe…pure speculation….Monaco used the ONE WIRE 12 VDC feed. That is all, and this has been tested, that is needed. It also squares with the installation instructions. It works. Myron is right. If you LOST the 12 VDC pair in the Data Communications Cable….then, you would lose the unit. NOW…run a hot wire or 12 VDC to the rear. First….reset to factory…..get an FF. At that point, then the OTHER 2 pair is running the MPX. Since the rear has 12 VDC….then a faulty data cable (open in the 12 VDC) will work….but only if the MPX pair is OK. That is how I UNDERSTAND and from the manuals and also folks here and helping troubleshoot. NOW…as to the PREVIOUS Aquahot in your Windsor. My “knowledge base” is for a model or two newer…but if I assume that the control boards look similar…maube not as many zones, but similar, Richard, to your 06 Dynasty…here is how it would (should have worked). Each individual thermostat was only an ON/OFF unit. Totally MECHANICAL….not powered. When the temp dropped below the set point….say set was 70 and it dropped to 67, the mercury containing bulb, had two WIRES in the “drop” or mercury. Same as turning on a wall switch, the thermostat was “calling” for heat. Once the temp hit 70….the mercury in the thermostat only had ONE wire….in it. Like turning off a light switch. The newer AH boards have TWO Terminals or WIRES for a “thermostat” connection. There is NO DC or whatever. Use a paperclip and jumper….the pump starts and the blower (for that zone) starts. Fast forward to your 2006 Dynasty. I’m…SPECULATING….Monaco eventually did do the belt and suspenders….and ran 12 VDC to every AC control module. Why Frank’s Dynasty had none??? Ask the engineer. The PRINT does not show it….I think….and it ain’t there. I don’t have my laptop on vacation so the 25 sets of model year wiring diagrams I downloaded aren’t with me….I’m on my IPAD. OK…Richard, here is how your system works….I will NOT go down the hidden controller or ZONE 4. BUT…. If you have TWO thermostats or one….it works this way. Each Zone controller has a FURNACE DIP switch. If one ZONE or any ZONE shows FURNACE or HEAT….that controller’s DIP is CLOSED…..that is how it works. If you had the NO AQUAHOT version.l..there is a front and rear furnace, the Front zone has HEAT/FURNACE. The controller closes a dry set of wires….they run to a furnace control board…like a light switch…it comes on, In your case, wherever or whatever ZONES has a HEAT or FURNACE option….there is ONE pair of wires going to a particular zone on the AH control panel. As I said…jumper those two screws…paperclip….the pump and fan come on. In the 07 Dyansty and up….Monaco added a “hidden Module”. In the owner’s manual….there is a chart that shows the zone numbers….which thermostat….if dual and which zone where the heat works. The MIDDLE ZONE, on the 07 & higher….have a special ZONE for AquaHot or HEAT. There is a standalone controller….when you set whichever zone for the middle to HEAT….the hidden controller….with a remote temp sensor….takes over and turns ON or OFF the circuit for heat. That is the way it is wired…..they way it works. NOW…Frank and I helped a very astute tech that had installed his own new Dometic units and the Dometic CCC2 thermostat(s….may have been two). He had NO AC in the middle. Finally, we got an update. He had some how “pushed or tucked” the two outgoing wires to the AH under something or whatever. He communicated that it WORKED before….not NOW. Had to be a DOMETIC problem. He “lost” the AH wires. He insisted….MONACO left them out. Now…there is NO WAY it would have worked before…. In his install, he lost them….and did it up right…but was also extremely confident….he made no mistakes. After a while….he went back….maybe to try to “PULL” the wires that Monaco forgot. OPPS….he had buried them….hooked them up. NOW IT WORKS. That is NOT uncommon….techs do it…novices do it…I’ve lost a wire….we all can “do it”. But….if you rely on the prints….and it worked before….it has to be operator error. This is a simple or complex system,…based on your skill and experience. Our goal, as moderators….help folks understand….and that is what Daniel is starting to absorb. I think it took me at least 3 years just to begin to learn about the MPX and I had installed Home systems and troubleshot….now, I learn or confirm, from each topic… NEVER KNEW that the 2002 AH had separate Heat Thermostats….THANKS!,