Tom Cherry

RE chassis battery….many of us use a self taught rule of thumb. When it is HOT (at or approaching 90) and we drive a few hours….and then stop for a break or get home and unhook the toad….and do a few things….and leave the MH to “cook” as in it heats UP when turned off and NO coolant is flowing. If you happen to have the Dash AC on, which adds to the starting torque that the started must deliver….for the usual QUICK FIRE UP….and you turn the key and get that “OMG…it ain’t gonna start” cringe….and then it starts….time to plan or budget within the next 6 - 9 months…..for NEW chassis batteries. The thermal expansion due to the “soaking” the block increase the cylinder compression….plus the AC Compressor load…. When that happens…and the OMG cringe hits, but it starts…..the chassis is getting weak….and you don’t need some biased load test… works for many who have 30 odd years of MH experience and understand how a battery decays… FWIW….works for us….others might differ….

https://www.interstatebatteries.com/products/31-mhd The INTERSTATE 31-MHD 950 was the OEM on the Dynasty's and UP from circa 2005 or so. The Camelot's had the 750 AMP HR battery. The batteries were almost identical. I put in the 950 and it works great...and I believe, is probably the MOST used out there, due to the NATIONWIDE network. FWIW....LAUGH... I put mine in about 4 years ago and got a commercial discount from the Interstate Distributor....and Paid about $135 each.... NO LIE.

FIRST…you need to tell up if the slides are ELECTRIC or Hydraulic. The “solenoid” or misnamed “relay” is USUALLY attached around the hydraulic motor. Yes….a cheap band clamp. That solenoid has a 12 VDC powered coil. The reason it is “more properly” a solenoid is the current. All the 5 pin Bosch relays used throughout the MH have either 25 or 30 Amp rated contacts. Typically, a Hydraulic motor on the Lippert or maybe even the HWH System will pull a max of say, 100 AMPS. Thus the device that “turns on or switches” the power to the motor is properly named a “SOLENOID. OK… Real world. You can buy more brands of 12 VDC solenoids with 100 Amp contacts than “Carter has Pills”…look that up if it ain’t in your vocabulary. They come in many different designs. Lippert uses one that is easy to mount with a band clamp. Folks have bought Solenoids on Amazon with 200 Amp contacts. They have to run new cables as the cables were cut to length for the OEM. Move it a foot over….revise the cables or have new cut. A motor solenoid is replaceable….with the OEM (drop in fit….cables work)….or remote mount it and revise the cables. NO DIFFERENCE…..it will work. NOW….there are solenoids that are more complex….the simple one above has two large studs….incoming and outgoing power. The Motor always RUNS in one direction. The small (hydraulic) solenoids open and close and change the flow of the fluid…. The more complex ones have multiple terminals. They actually have TWO Coils. One coil sends the positive to say, the RIGHT Stud on the moter….as well as the Negative to the LEFT stud. The other coil, magically reverse the Polarity snd Positive goes to the LEFT and ground or Negative to the RIGHT. Bingo….on extension…the motor, say, rotates CLOCKWISE. When the OTHER Coil is energized…to retract….the solenoid reverses the polarity…so the Motor turns CounterClockwise. Which do you have and which brand…. I haven’t a clue. BUT if you read the manual there is, very HIGH probability, of a complete description and an illustration of the System…. FIND IT. Locate it. MOST of the HWH systems are near the steps….the manual tells you, NOW…IF you have a hydraulic system….there can be a number of reasons for the delay. Is the reservoir filled properly. When slides are retracted, the reservoir should have fluid almost up to the cap…or where the cap screws down on.. YES, a Solenoid with BURNED or pitted contacts could be arcing internally….and need replacement. Is there AIR in the lines, on a Hydraulic system, you are supposed to HOLD ON the direction button or switch even AFTER the slide stops. Maybe 3 seconds….or until the whine or noise or pitch of the motor changes….folks often stop….and that traps air. You need to move them in and out several cycles….maybe 5 seconds….or until you pickup the motor’s drastic noise change. It takes several ins and outs….each one with the PROPER “ON” or few seconds….to purge a messed up system… NEXT UP. You will need to have someone work the slides..put a DVOM on the motor studs. Then have someone move the slide….if it pauses…or hesitates….diid the Voltage drop maybe 1/2 to 2 VDC. Should be constant….OK a little variation….but stay generally uniform for the entire cycle. If it bounces around….odds are a ELECTRIC issue like the contacts on the Motor Solenoid pitted…. Then, you do it again….this time measure the voltage on the INCOMING side…if it is constant or drops a bit….and doesn’t fluctuate….in the solenoid….if not….bad connection upstream….snd that a lot of electrical knowledge and Time. IF ELECTRIC, there is a motor or motors driving the mechanism. Some Dynasty’s have dual IN THE WALL Motors….others under and such. WITHOUT knowing the brand and model and type….all hypothetical…post the pictures of the system….read the manual and FIND IT….many have the same system…and know how to help you…

Word of caution. Be CAREFUL where you pick the attaching point. If you pick the downstream point on a heavy load draw, like a mini breaker for a hydraulic motor, then, the meter will read lower….and possibly drive you crazy. You need to look at the prints and trace the cables. Odds are you have 4/0 (0000) Cables from the House and Chassis banks running up, as Ben says. If you install a large crimped ring terminal on each stud. NOW…You have a BOOST solenoid….maybe, due to the vintage of your year. That solenoid is often “generically or incorrectly” as THE BIG BOY. A REAL BIG BOY is an Intellitec solenoid. Some boost solenoids were White Rodgers Or Trombetta. NOW….Time to cozy up with section 9 of your Manual. Will wager that you will find a description and a diagram or illustration of your BOOST. Has TWO large studs. THERE is where you out the METER LEADS. The negatives goes to Ground. TURN OFF both Battery Disconnects. Then turn on Chassis. Measure stud to ground on each stud of the Boost solenoid….the one with POWER….CHASSIS. Label that. Label the other as HOUSE. This will save you from “wondering” when folks tell you to measure or troubleshoot… NOW you know. Have at it…this is the CORRECT WAY…

Check the size of the cables going to the Genny. Been discussed and beat to death. If you don’t have at least 2/0. (00j cables….then that is the issue. Goes for the positive and ground. Many folks that added a third or dedicated battery….upgraded….or did the common sense thing. They have glowing reports. But, in reality, their cables were #2 AWG. MONACO, for reasons unknown to the gods, would run 4/0 (0000) cables to the FRONT and there is a Stud with a 4/0 cable…..but then undersized the cables to the starting studs on the Genny….both sides. Even a 2/0 would or does work. Now, only a small percentage have genny starting issues. But, based on ambient…they have isdues. Not denying that. But few do the proper testing and compare the battery, measuring at the bank, UNDER LOAD. Record that. Then, repeat….measure the voltage on the genny terminal (to Ground). Finally, repeat again on the Rear Genny terminals. IF there is more, underload or when starting, than a 0.1 - 0.2 VDC DROP….then the “cabling” and such….and there must be an issue internally with the starter. BUT…more than that…a high resistance contact or connection….that assumes that the entire run is at least 2/0. The specs on #2 AWG will not carry enough current for a Genny in cold weather. This has been tested and Monaco’s cheapness catches some. Others in mostly warm climates are marginal, but get by. A WHOLE LOT EASIER & CHEAPER than just putting a not needed battery. Real world and proved by testing….#2 AWG ain’t gonna cut it. If you run car jumper cables from the positive stud up front where the genny cable is and a good ground up there….and attach to the rear genny terminals….that demonstrates at. Even small AWG (USUALLY #2) will supplement the cranking amperage. Home audio enthusiasts have done this for years. You run TWO sets or two speaker cables from the amp/receiver to each speaker. One 2 wire speaker cable…twist the leads. Use that for “positive”. Likewise use the other wire, twisted leads, on the negative. The English call it “BiWiring”… sound is awesome. No voltage drop….DUH!

UPDATE....from my Buddy. What he did on mine....NO SUCKEE OUTEE the GAS. He turned the can upside down. That, YES, puts LIQUID in...but he says that it turns to vapor or GAS instantly. That is HOW he got MOST of the SECOND CAN IN. It also speeds up the recharging....just WATCH the pressures and "understand" what is happening... ONE TRICK I USE... Weigh the can (that works for a FULL Aerosol can) first...postal scale...nearest 1/10 of an ounce. Read the NET WEIGHT. SO, if a can weights 14.0 OZ and the NET is 8.0....then you know that it will weigh 6.0 when fully emptied. Lets you KNOW exactly HOW MUCH went in... Good Luck...

OK....clean it up. A MUST. NOW, since this is a SINGLE....as in it only works back and forth (retract and extend) and it ONLY RUNS ONE SLIDE....it is DIFFERENT. You will have to do some digging....but here is my take... You have a REVERSING Solenoid. If I could see the picture of the OTHER SIDE....would confirm it. The solenoid works like this. When it closes (the solenoid COIL is energized) from the EXTEND SWITCH....it provides power to the motor. SO....lets say the two terminals on the motor...as you look in from the plate. Extending, hypothetically, sends POSITIVE to the RIGHT Terminal (Stud) on the motor The LEFT (opposite side) has NEGATIVE. Retracting reverses that...so the RIGHT Terminal has Negative and the LEFT has Positive. Therefore, you do NOT have any "small solenoids" that control the fluid flow. MY FIX... Clean the unit and check the MOTOR Studs and make sure the CAPTIVE or nuts securing the STUDS are tight. That eliminates a high resistance connection. Next UP... follow the cables (maybe ONE) from the motor... That is the MAIN POWER. Measure it. It SHOULD BE around 13.1 or whatever the HOUSE bank is showing. IF it is MORE than the House Voltage by MORE than 0.2 VDC..., you have a HIGH RESISTANCE CONNECTION... If it is the same... Then, MAYBE ALL MIGHT BE WELL. NOW... Have someone move the slide....say OUT. Measure the HOUSE Voltage when it is going OUT... Then retract it...and then extend again. This TIME... Measure the VOLTAGE on the MOTOR (across BOTH Terminals). If you are getting say, a difference...a DROP of more than 0.5 VDC (motor lower than the HOUSE) DURING the same direction....then there is a CONTACT problem in the Solenoid. THAT happens....and you replace the solenoid. NOW...if you want to see how it would WORK using your vehicle... FIRST... Measure the EXTEND Voltage and Determine WHICH STUD on the MOTOR (left or right) is POSITIVE. THEN use the Jumper cables and a vehicle. Put the POSITIVE on the RIGHT. you have BYPASSED the Solenoid....it will RUN or move as long as the Jumper Cables are connected. Have someone yell STOP when it is OUT. You should ALSO hear the motor's pitch or noise change. It will get higher and maybe NOT AS LOUD. That is where you STOP. Then retract it...so you have to REVERSE the Polarity....SAME DEAL., NOW....if the jumper cables do this....and it moves quicker or faster or is less "RATCETEY", you KNOW there is a Voltage issue....and either in the Solenoid (burned contacts) or in the cable connections. IF you have it plugged in or are on 50 Amp....the Inverter will be charging....so that is OPTIMUM... That's how it works. IF it EVER QUITS, there IS a cover plate on the end...you pull out the plug or the cap. Find a nut that fits. Turn it ONE WAY with a DRILL....it move in one direction....same if you REVERSE the drill...it will go the opposite. The fact that you have a functional slide motor and movement....that eliminates all the MAYBE IN THE SWITCHES. The Solenoid, as long as the switches move it in the right direction, means the SWITCHES and SOLENOID are Functional. BUT, you have to measure the HOUSE Voltage (preferably with Genny on or 50A) and see what the motor is reading....and VOLTAGE Drops are signs of either HIGH RESISTANCE connections in the Cabling or in the solenoid. You CAN also Measure the INCOMING Voltage on the MAIN Cable. If it and the HOUSE are, under load, about the same or maybe 0.2 VDC Lower....then all is well upstream of the Positive connection on the solenoid. I quickly found this. NOW....all YOUTUBES are NOT certified or tested and we HAVE found all the experts that post....sometimes do NOT understand. BUT... ODDS ARE...a MATTER of VOLTAGE. NEXT TIP. THE fluid should be just barely below of maybe 1/2 inch down from the TOP of the plastic reservoir....WHEN FULLY RETRACTED. It will GO DOWN when you extend it. SO, always CHECK in the RETRACTED position....and FILL up to say 1/2" BELOW. FINAL LIPPERT TIP. Get the Model Number off the frame or the unit. That IS on your Build Sheet or the RV Data Card or LIST of items. DO NOT CALL LIPPERT and ask for TECH SUPPORT. They do NOT have the OEM PN....you have to go into PARTS. They have the OEM (the base unit sold to Monaco's PN...and the RETAIL or Replacement unit is DIFFERENT. Don't ASK...that is what BOTH SIDES (Parts and Tech told me). THEN parts can advise WHICH entire unit or part....like a motor....that you need. THEN if you EVER have to talk to Tech Support....you give them THE RETAIL Or Across the COUNTER number...and they have all the info there. QUIRKY....yes...but the way their data bases work.

Ivan or others will have to chime in. We had the same issue...after we depleted the first can. My buddy moved or positioned or maybe "beat - shook" the second can and it started to raise the pressure. I DO REMEMBER that the second can took MUCH LONGER to start to impact the pressure than did the first. Almost like the compressor or system was getting "FULLER" and that slowed down the filling. NOW, does this work off a large cylinder or "propane tank" style source....and is different? BUT, that is what I recall. If I can sort out the specifics and the "trick", I'll post...but he said it was a common problem on cars...and knew how to get in a second can...but it was, I think, slower...and NORMAL...

no doubt....and what I said or tried to say....the consultants that worked on the parking deck floor failure had difficulty in identifying the cleats (cast in when the column was cast), had difficulty in determining if ALL the rebar "network" was inside a cleat. They removed the cleat and then demolished it and ascertained that the factory, in SC, had two folks working. ONE did it per the print. The other did it differently...as in the number or maybe size or length on the design print was critical. The floor contracted on a cold night. So, the floor, which was designed due to thermal contraction and expansion, moved TOO FAR OUT on the cleat. The "moment arm" of the weight, moved from say 6" out to 8" out....sheared off the end of the cleat or destroyed it. The cleat was NOT to the design print and missing some critical pieces of rebar....thus the failure. They finally figured out how to inspect or certify all the cleats....maybe 500 or so as it was multideck. They had to REPAIR or design a secondary cleat to would carry the weight due to the contraction. BTW...I had to rebuild a building in Brazil that had a THREE PIECE "TRUSS" roofing structure....held together under tension by some 50 steel cables. Water got into the cables and they corroded and rusted. Think stretching a rubber band across your thump and first finger. When the network or bundle of cables started to fail and rust out.....then the three trusses caved in. THINK of having a rubber band that you could not stretch any tighter and it too ALL your strength to expand and hold your finger and thumb to a certain distance. THEN the rubber band had a defect...and it POPPED...your fingers would expand...as you were forcing them... THAT is what happened to the roof. 5 of the 8 trusses failed... I put STEEL Trusses back up....and reinforced the remaining concrete one. The roof was NOT being maintained and the caulk that protected or covered the "bands" failed and over the years, the cables rusted and the diameter was reduced. For those that have use a Tennious Olsen tensile strength tester....the bands became "an HOUR GLASS" profile...and snapped. THANKS for the comment about using a metal detector.

Thermal Imaging has been used on many “structures” and system (like electrical switch gear). Don’t know the exact data when the equipment and development started, but a consultant that I hired was a leader in using Thermal Imaging in the roofing industry and held seminars or did presentations and such at major commercial and industrial “roof maintenance” events. The use in roofing was to show or detect moisture in the insulation of a commercial roof so you could make an intelligent decision as to whether to recoat or add additional plies or to do a complete tearoff. Water soaked or damaged insulation provides NO R Value so, determining its condition is critical. It is a “contrast imaging” concept…not Superman’s XRAY vision. For max resolution, it is done after say 10:00 PM and stops before sunrise. With the proper equipment and calibration, it can be used…and is very accurate in all climates….and my, now longtime friend, worked on roofs where the wind chill factor was well below zero. Bottom line….XRAY it ain’t. Is is also, due to the cost and the evolution of technology, used on large electrical system….laser guided. But again, it is measuring “thermal contrast” so that a high resistance connection in a high amperage panel or switch gear will be “determined”. It does NOT trace cables. That’s the short version. BTW….there is a concept called “Ground Penetrating Radar”. It’s use is to detect “masses” or objects like buried drums in fields or even, under the right conditions, a floor. It would not give the image you want. Practically, a high class Stud Finder MIGHT….but without then test drilling, a few hits to determine the accuracy, it might not be accurate enough. IF you need the ceiling joist/“rafter” spacing….then drilling and locating one….could be used. There may be technology in the reinforced concrete industry that would give an image and locate the rebar. BUT several years ago, after a cleat on a column failed and the sliding concrete floor caved in on a parking deck. The consultant cross sectioned the column and cleat and found that the vendor did not follow the design prints….thus a few pieces of rebar were left out. FAILURE. Check out if there is a “amazon” device that will detect rebar in a floor or column or do some googling. THAT if what you need….a super accurate steel member (stud?) device…a metal rebar or a stud or such ….that’s what you need. YES…I did my share of construction, demolition and roofing maintenance….

FWIW….these pressures and temperatures are in the older manuals. From a practical standpoint, based feed back from a few members….and one I KNOW understands how to test and add and restore to “factory”; you have to have the MH under cover…..and in building or garage that is “open”…. Then, it is best to leave the MH overnight to stabilize or “SOAK”. Next morning, turn on the AC and let the dash run until, generally speaking (slides in or course….bathrooms closed…bedroom door shut) the interior is cooled to a point that the cockpit temp is close to the galley….in other words….the interior is gonna be as COOL as it will be….based on the charge. THEN, you do the interior (closest to the main vent) measurement. TECHNICALLY the control should NOT be in Max COOL as that shuts down the outside air damper. RARELY will you find a shop that will follow the “theoretical” conditions which the chart was published on. But…if you do this like a lab experiment…and MATCH or duplicate the “design or factory” test….the temperatures and pressures will come close. OK….why is this important and what difference….does it make. Simple…you are chasing your tail and your frustration will increase. REAL WORLD…I had a buddy come over. An experienced and “certified” HVAC tech. BTW, he has an electrical engineering degree for UofPITT and worked for GE at a high level position among other jobs. NO DUMMY. He made a lucrative investment in a “startup” GE and other electrical supply business. He and his buddies sold…and none of them every worked again. He got bored….went to the community college and learned HVAC and helped out his neighbors and also fixed the units on the beach properties he bought…for income. Took the state test…passed…he also, for fun, became a highly sought HS Basketball REF….OH, he played QB in college and was a multiletterman in HS. He tried every trick in the book. He had NEVER worked on a MH out in 85 or 90 DEG ambient….that had SOAKED all day in the southern sun with reflection from my super white new concrete driveway. He gave up, but we put or forced MAYBE 1 1/2 cans in it…. BTW… That was 3 years ago…and it is dropping a little…but did NOT, to the best of my recollection, damage the compressor. My shop has done that 3 times…typically no more than say, 1 1/2 cans….as I ASKED. They had a bulk tank, but weighed before and after….read on…. OK…mad and frustration aside…I kept it at home and finished the other projects….drove it to storage….that was 20 miles. Left the HVAC Tech pocket thermometer in the outlet. Now I cheated…max air. LO & BEHOLD…I glanced at the thermometer. Can’t recall the numbers….but i had increased the Delta T by at least 10…maybe 12 or more degrees. I had COLD AIR….not lukecool air. I called a member…he MIGHT chime in. We talked…he said my analysis was right. In order to use, properly, the chart, you had to go through the conditioning and soak test and be in an enclosed (no sun bearing down) building. He had a minor leak….undefined, but needed a recharge boost every 3 years or so. Mine was similar….as are many here. Neither one, I THINK, ever pulled a vacuum and purged and refilled…like Monaco did. BUT from a common sense and comfort level, he usually picked up at least 10 Deg Delta T and the air was cold….when you out your hand on it. I recently had the unpleasant experience of helping my GS find a “good” used car. MEMORY…a GOOD system on max cool on a normal (80 deg) day will deliver 45 deg air. We drove 25…no exaggeration. He soon learned….if it didn’t feel cool and was not below 50….and the “dealer/owner” said….”JUST HAD IT TESTED AND RECHARGED”…that the individual was less than trustworthy. MY TAKE. It works for me…and mine sure cooled better….never got NEAR the pressures and temps…but I saved several hundred and it cooled just like my trusted OTR shop “fixed or recharged it”…..and I always tested the temp driving back to storage…

Yes…excellent advice. The test will also tell you what type of “charging system” you have. ODDS ARE…based on the year, you have a FULL BIRD or BiDirectional System. Suggest you make a chart. I sent a PDF of one recently to a member and he used it. Not labor intensive. All you need is a VOM and there are notes on HOW to test and where. His data showed immediately what he had….a FULL BIRD… However the data or the voltage readings, as Myron suggested, also demonstrated that it was wired properly and was working properly. He SUSPECTED such, but was uncertain as to HOW to test. Now he knows and is confident that his system is also 100% functional…and also knows HOW to test if he has issues in the future.

Funny, you should clarify this. The Magnum tech, yesterday, said the CORRECT WAY, per the install print or preferred, was a direct line to House bank…. I did NOT verify from the instructions on the old or new AGS….so….if it ain’t that way….the tech said HOUSE and NOT Inverter….as I asked that question specifically…. BUT, said that many techs or installations just picked up the voltage from the Inverter battery terminals. SO, once again….Monaco did NOT always follow a supplier’s instructions….like the Intellitec EMS Thanks….now I know….

Odds are. You have at least two issues. The “hot water” system is dual “fire” as in you use 120 VAC for residential or domestic water heating. The Diesel is used when there is a higher demand, such as “interior” heat. NOW, everyone taking a shower and washing dishes and running laundry all SIMULTANEOUSLY….will exceed the capacity of the electric heater. Memory….and I’d have to pull a AH manual. The diesel burner has about 10 times the capacity of the electric coil or heater. I do this once a year this topic comes up….so, maybe only 5X…. OK…the hot water system does not depend on Diesel for ordinary hand washing and dishes and a shower or two….it just takes LONGER to recover and heat back up. Therefore, download the manual. It is on the Aquahot site, if not already in the “file” of all the component owner’s manuals that originally came with the Motor Home…if you can’t locate on the AH site…call…and they will send you a link. Do the step by step troubleshooting guide for “NO HOT WATER”. Next…there is another topic, similar, running. No Diesel is the result of, 90 - 95% of the time, lack of maintenance as well as “AGE”. The burner nozzle “plugs up”. The AH trained and certified tech that does my PM says that the more you use the diesel, the longer the nozzle lasts. When it sets for long periods of time, even though there is a filter on the diesel. It starts to gum or plug. Now…the nozzle is not just an orifice….like on a garden hose sprayer. It has a sintered metal passage….think tiny metal honey comb. The fuel, under pressure, goes through this and then is atomized and is a “spray” inside the burner housing. Most people experience a “needs PM” condition every 2 - 4 years….and that depends on the “cleanliness” of the fuel they use. The typical DIESEL PM is a new filter and a new nozzle and burner housing adjustment….and a thorough cleaning inside the “burner assembly”. NO IGNITE…then there is a detailed trouble shooting guide for the electrical and electronics. The PM also includes a functional test of every zone to ensure the pumps (4 or so) work as well as the fans on the small “radiators” where the heated boiler antifreeze is circulated. If you can use a VOM and follow the instructions….most can trouble shoot the “no hot water”. That’s it…. Read the manual as to the “operation” and how this whole complex monster works….then tackle the NO HOT WATER. Once fixed….then move onto Diesel….IN THAT ORDER….the “SYSTEM” or Hot Water heating HAS to work….OK, you COULD have a dead electric heater and the Diesel would work….but domestic hot water depends on the AC Heating system to work..

Thanks for the clarification....but it did provide more INSIGHT into the TYPICAL issue. I used SS Pop Rivets and they are a PITA to remove....and you also need the long handled tool....a pliers type will destroy itself....if you give it enough brute force... BEEN THERE...

UPDATES....and some of the FOG cleared...but JUST when I thought it was clear...a STORM Moved in. First. The AGS, regardless of the older 5 KNOB AGS or the AGS-N... uses the HOUSE BATTERY Voltage. It is SUPPOSED to be wired directly to the HOUSE BANK Connections. It DOES NOT receive input from the Remote. Terminals 3 and 4 are the VOLTAGE Sensing leads....on the AGS hard wired connector. NOW...all the debate about running wires and such....Magnum and Frank McElroy cleared this up. The amount of Voltage Drop one would get on the TWO #12 wires running from the Batteries to the FRONT (mine is in the FRB) and Frank's is in the rear...adjacent to his Inverter is MINISCULE. This is a SENSING Voltage....and NOT a load carrying one. SO, either location...properly wired, will work and there would be maybe few MilliVolts difference in one in the front vs the rear. SECOND... AND THIS IS THE KILLER... Even MAGNUM was confused on this. If you have a 2008 (at least on the Dynasty) 5 KNOB one....then the Magnum Remote was totally different and functioned differently. If you have the the SAME or same "VINTAGE" remote as on the 2008 Dynasty....then HOW you set the AGS and it works is TOTALLY DIFFERENT. The REMOTE only "enables it".... You can NOT set the parameters... NOW, on my 2009, I have the SAME AGS. BUT, my ME-RC was capable of PROGRAMMING IT. If you look at the two photos....one from the 2008 Dynasty and mine from the 2009 Camelot....then the mystery is solved. THE POINT, other than the conflicting or dueling remotes... The AGS will read the Battery Voltage. If you have EITHER remote... You have to then set the ON point to a LOWER Voltage...and you have to understand the UNDER LOAD compared to RECOVERY....as well as go ONE TENTH lower on the START. See the previous posts.. This should clear it up...or it does for me...

We each have our guesses. IF the PO did all the changes...then he did them using the SAME terminals as Monaco used. MY GUESS.... The wiring on TODD's is CORRECT. I have reached out to Richard (Dr4Film). He sent me a schematic of his. It was exactly like Todd's....save the GEN SET terminal was used. And I know HIS worked...or I think it did. SO.. Whatever. There IS a BIRD on Todd's....looks original to me. Don't have the print. Todd's wiring looks OEM. It works like it should. THAT is a fact. Whether or NOT the PO was adept enough to make it work....he sure was neat and his wiring skills mirror those of Monaco. His OTHER circuit mods are way low on the totem of PROFESSIONAL... How bout we leave it here? I WILL, once I get time, publish the info that I was provided on the Lambert. That is for HISTORY, but some might find that interesting. I hate to ask this... but Todd's only SHOWS two Bosch Relays... One is the Lambert Lockout on the RIGHT. The OTHER is the Cold Weather Relay. I did NOT see the relay in his that I THINK I saw on one of your prints...again...not trying to open any more cans of worms....we have enough already to catch enough croppies for a massive fish fry. BUT...it has been a learning experience....obviously not all are interested... BUT, the first post DOES describe in detail how a BIRD SYSTEM WORKS....which is always a deep dark mystery....and they BOTH work, generally, the same. Just different control...but the concept is the same as with the regulated (reduced) PWB voltages... ON TO OTHER QUESTS... Thanks...

Maybe we looked at two different Pictures. On page 1, Todd posted a lot. Look at the BIRD here. If you scrolled up on page 2, you saw Mark's pictures. You're not the first to make reference to Mark's pictures and NOT Todd's. Go back to Page 1... I think that clears it. To confirm or just restate. Todd did a COMPLETE voltage test on HIS module...which has 4 of the wires connected. it does NOT have the Gen Set wire....and THAT is something that folks will debate for years. BUT...Todd's is exactly like MINE...save the Purple Wire and mine has the additional Control Relay... I added it as some folks get confused... This was the ISOLATION relay that Monaco added, I think, is still or was still used...up until they KILLED the Monaco MH's Hope this explains it...if NOT call me... Battery BoostCutoff switches.pdf

Also called "TINNERS RIVETS" they are usually HARDER (been heat treated) or are made from a harder base steel. The rivets in the Monaco door scissors are soft...way to soft. The TWO HAMMER trick works, as long as one is careful. MOST of the Monaco techs, though, used the old "BEND IT UP OR DOWN". That actually made it worse and sometimes the scissors hit. Bending the entire pivot point does have a SHORT term benefit as the contact points are different and they are NOT as worn....but if you keep doing that, then there is NO FRICTION in the joint. SO...do NOT bend up or down to correct. IF there is contact or rubbing...correct that. There have been TWO successful long term fixes....and that is NO SLAM on actually beating it or flattening the rivet. IF you catch it soon enough, the the flattening or creating more tension will work. BUT...past that, for the WORN or abused ones.. Replacing the Rivet with a Tinner's rivet. We had a very learned member....he knew Monaco and had one of the FEW Crown Royal bus conversions. He ran a small business and was a "character". He bought a box of the proper size Tinner's Rivets. He had a nice hydraulic press in his shop. He installed a NEW Rivet and carefully seated or compressed it for the right tension. That Rivet did NOT FAIL....many members...perhaps 50 or more had their's fixed...and Mikee's fix....never went bad. The second was an individual in Tennessee. Randall Bergen. He was a parts manager for an car dealership. He found that there was a "replaceable" rivet that had an OEM (Chevy or Ford or whoever) and it was exactly the right size. NOT having the hydraulic press, he became an expert at installing and seating or peening or compressing the new OEM rivet. Again. 100% success. He was on IRV2 and other places. He fixed mine at least 10 years ago. It still has OEM tension and holds the door open during gusty winds. Did a search of the topics.... HERE is a 2022 post. TRIED his cell....said unavailable...BUT NOT Disconnected. Don't know about the email..... Randall Bergen, 249 Cherry Blossom Trail, Dandridge, TN. 37725 - repairs scissor arms - $40. This was a few years ago, so I'd call or email him to check if he is still repairing them. 865-323-1277 rjb4jcpa@gmail.com DO NOT KNOW if he is still alive.. but....he would be my first try....as I KNOW what he did and the rivet he used is a LONG LASTING FIX... That's my history. The folks that have installed a strut are pleased... SO, whatever works for you...

THANKS for those prints. They show, and I will pass them on, that Monaco actually built it that way. I was TOLD that there never was a BIRD isolator in a 2002 as it was NOT on "HIS" print. BUT, that is neither here nor there and is an offline issue. BUT, I will take exception to you final comment. The PO did NOT DO ANY REWIRING of the circuits on the BIRD 5 pin module. Todd, after he did our voltage tests....and Frank and I reviewed them.... was asked to do ONE MORE THING. He did a voltage test...as well as a functional test of the module. SIMPLE. CHECK the pins under EACH CONDITION. ALL power OFF... NADA. NO POWER. HOUSE ON....CHASSIS OFF... Coach Battery (or House if you prefer).... 12 VDC (a loose term....full voltage). NO Power to module on any other pin. HOUSE and CHASSIS ON... SAME DEAL. Coach Battery has POWER.. IGNITION IS DEAD HOUSE and CHASSIS ON....TURN ON IGNITION. BINGO....Coach Battery and IGNITION now have 12 VDC. That is exactly the way is should be wired. That is exactly the way it shows in all the intellitec PDF.....that is exactly the way MINE is working. AND...we knew from his first set of experiments....that the RELAY (now called on newer units...SOLENOID) was sending out a PBW 3.4/3.5 VDC signal and that the WR Solenoid was humming along and engaged and working. SO, look at the pictures in his photos on the OTHER or STARTED THIS topic. ALL OEM....even the zip ties are in place. NOW...When Todd and I talked after his final voltage or pin out or "FUNCTIONAL" testing of the BIRD...I mentioned something about Mine had a RELAY. In the ORIGINAL BIRD wiring....the Boost Switch came into the RELAY terminal....and then ran over to the Solenoid. That PURPLE wire is in tact and is OEM. He said, OH YEAH. I tested that one. When you push the BOOST, you get 12 VDC on the wire. THUS....its wired exactly to Intellitec specs. In his, the diode (internal on the Relay circuit) protects the board...so when you zap the WR with a FULL 12 VDC to lock that sucker IN... That works....and the backfeed is eliminated or prevented by the diode. Intelltiec told me about that. And it was pulled and issues....thus the relay.. That's it... Please read my recent commentary. WE NEVER SAY NEVER about a Monaco. Todd's has the PANEL with the PN and also the description. SO, it was "factory" that way. BUT, from my knowledge and also Todd's testing, the module is STILL wired OEM and it works. Don't aske me what that silly white wire does. All I KNOW....the SYSTEM works and Todd has no issues. BUT, we did discuss....let the BIRD or the WR fail....he is gonna gut it, like you did and put in the ML-ACR. I did NOT realize how cheap they are now. Thanks for all your input....

WOW….if he didn’t have the 04, like I thought….then the diagram he sent me is exactly the same as yours….except, Monaco DID use the GEN SET Terminal… THANKS A BUNCH… OK…was going to post this as followup. Monaco would release prints for a Model Year. Lets say a wiring revision that required a component and a new or different harness. IF that component and harness came in early….ODDS ARE….we have seen this, that the assembly line started using it. So, a change for a 2002….was made as a RUNNING change and the end of MY 2001….had the new and improved 2002 features. NEXT scenario… Prints released. Component is late or harness….KEEP BUILDING….and the 2002 were EXACTLY LiKE the 2001’s….yes that happens….so No MATTER what the Manual or Prints say….the SHOW (Assembly Line) must go on. FINAL scenario…. Engineering needs a test MH to see if the NEW Component with the NEW harness works…..they go down and supervise a build….all well….it is released. NOW, that applied to stock units, in some cases, a special order….was custom built. NO WHERE is the prints updated. Monaco had a “iffy” approval for custom builds…. Dealers with high volumes could work with the factory and get a ONE OF A KIND special. THINK THAT IS BS. A buddy, who got me into Motor Homing was a large dealer. Also on the “elite dealers” Committee. He ordered custom MH’s for NASCAR drivers (that couldn’t afford a Prevost) as well as Crew Chiefs. He speced out a HR Navigator with things that Monaco used to put in their Crown Royal Bus conversions. This MH was way more advanced than a Signature. It cost TWICE as much….but only half or less than a Prevost. It had all the features….plus 4 MORE Intellitec Modules. This was a first run 2005. The driver was superstitious. All the LED’s in the Motor Home Intellitec lighted switch pads were custom made by Intellitec. The YELLISH GREEN was a PURE and Intense BLUE. He was probably one of a few dealers with that pull. Monaco ALSO wanted, from a marketing perspective, their UPPER ENDS in the Drivers and Crew Chief’s lots at the track, YES….I SAW IT…didn’t know anything but remember the COST and the BLUE LED conversion… FINALLY Monaco would take a mid model year….do a special build. Paint it like next year’s graphics and install the upgrades. We have members here with a documented floor plan that is NOT in that Model year….next year….yes… but was sold, after the show….or soemtimes AT THE SHOW and is a MY older that the sales Brochure. NEVER SAY NEVER…you look at what you have and verify factory….prints might NOT square…BUT Monaco built it.

We’re on the same page, except the real world is this. The normal load, for discharge, per Trojan, us supposed to be 10% or so of the total bank’s capacity. I THINK that is correct….Lithiums or AGM’s may be different….read the owner’s manual for them. OK….typically, during at least 5 different run down or exercising tests….this is real world. Have a 450 Watt halogen work light. If you divide 450 watts, by the battery voltage, that is a little less than 40 Amps. OK…that is close enough so 10% of my 4 bank amp hours is 45. DRIVE ON. NOW, when the DVOM battery voltage drops to 11.9….I stop….I might let it run and see a 11.8 blip. So….remove load. If you disconnect the jumpers and wait maybe 20 minutes….all of this is what Trojan told me or I asked for confirmation…..then measure the individual batteries. Obviously half the voltaage, but if you read the SOC table….and do a hydrometer test….they will be right at 50% discharged. That was the goal… NOW, check the electrolyte…..perfunctory but good practice. Rarely have to add. I have a dowel with a scribed mark. That mark, when you put it in a cell and it touhes the plate….is exactly half way between the plate and the bottom of the well….where Trojan says to always fill to. Install Jumpers….recharge….when FLOAT…..then pull Jumpers….and wait. They read per DVOM and hydrometer close to 100%. Hydrometer is usually a bit higher….or way better, but Voltage is dead on. NOW….that is real world…plus how Trojan says do it. In reality….one SHOULD turn off both disconnects BEFORE removing or reinstalling jumpers. If there is an arc and you have an Intellitec MPX, it may go into START UP….and if there is a microsecond interruption….the IPX or CPU or Modules go or can go haywire…. I have HAD to kill the house switch and then wait and restart for a clean “boot” or startup sequence. NOW…in your example, the variations are NORMAL….except the true way to exercise and also evaluate your bank is with a constant load. NOW….there is a timed circuit on the Magnum AGS. That allows for quick hits of high current….and that is called a “smoothing” timer…so, it does NOT say.. OMG. Prevents false positives or unnecessary AGS Start Signal. But, if your Low Battery Cutoff is set too high, you will, based on either instantaneous or shorter timer, shut down the whole system. I will ask Magnum for a review to confirm…..as well as where or what powers the remote….

The topic of question about charging has been resolved. Since it was a general interest issue, the results of the tests as well as how Todd’s 2002 Windsor was “factory” configured is now in a new topic. Here is the link. Please respond or comment on that issue there. Thanks….

Jim, you make a good point. I spent almost 2 hours with a member that understands the “Lambert” a lot more than I do. I am working on a few notes or corrections that we discussed and he sent me some prints….will be a day or so. My only comment to what he said and what you posted. He says he has never seen a 2002 Windsor with the Intellitec IRD or Bird. YES, we see coaches all the time….like…never saw Monaco make this nor is there prints…. I have seen, but can’t recall how your bay looks. We have pictures of two separate 2002 Windsors with the Intellitec IRD/BIRD 5 terminal module. Now, we do KNOW it is FACTORY. The white molded panel say so….as it was Monaco screen printed….PN and all. If you go back and look at the first thread, there is also another panel or block diagram….it says Charging “module or device…memory)….so we know that particular 2002 Windsor left that way. Another person posted a similar picture. Bottom line….it was factory installed. Todd did the voltage testing and also tested in 4 different modes. It works exactly like my 2009 system does….except one tiny detail. Later on, Monaco added a control relay for the BOOST. In the early years….the 12 VDC boost signal (momentarily held on) signal came to the BIRD via a Purple wire. It was fed INTO the RELAY terminal. BTW….Intellitec now calls that “Solenoid”. Then, it was run to one side of the WR solenoid. Thus….no boost switch ON….BWP 3.5 VDC to solenoid. Push the boost….full 12 VDC. NOW….there is a little factoid a few know, Intellitec had a blocking diode inside….so no backfeed. Maybe for a coil backfeed??? Anyway….the dropped it. BIRDs started failing. Monaco added an isolation relay to feed the coil from the BIRD or when pressed, the boost was 12 VDC. Later, Intellitec PUT IT BACK IN. Bottom line. Frank and I discussed the results of Todd’s testing. Yes….it is a FULL FLEDGED and documented (on the two Monaco labels or panels) and it works and is functional….Past that??? Still reviewing prints….but what Todd has, as far as the BIRD is factory and it works, Second point…..and you may be more knowledgeable. I THOUGHT, erroneously, that the Lambert worked when in storage…. BUT, I was told, with a robust amount of authority…..NO….the Lambert would only “steal” or maintain the chassis if there was charging voltage present on the Hiuse…. That was said to correct my “misunderstanding” of the Lambert. THUS, we agreed…..if there was a BIRD configuration…..as IS IN Todd’s 2002 Windsor…..no NEED for the Lambert. Monaco’s assemblers OFTEN put in unnecessary stuff, after a print revision…..no one explained it to them. They often built experimental units or show coaches. WHO KNOWS. But, there were TWO 2002 Windsors with the factory plastic plates that show the BIRD….and one of them works exactly as it was designed…..and yes, if the comment on the Lambert and its need for the house to be charged, is correct….and I bow to the member’s knowledge….then the Lambert was not needed….but left in. Later today….but probably in a few days….I’ll try to edit and clarify. The one thing that we, the other member agreed on…. The pictures show it installed. It works as designed. The PO gutted the Lambert and removed the Salesman solenoid. But the Charging Module was factory….an embossed or screen printed Monaco label and block diagram…. How many 2002 Windsor’s were that way? Don’t know. There was, he said, some experiments, IIRC, in 2003. DR4Film had a BIRD in his 2004 Windsor… Let me update this. If you want to call and help me understand, you have the number. Thanks,,,

OK…real world here….done 3 slides and put in Guardian plates. Jacking the slide. You need a 24” or so 2 x 4. This will be the “T” or top portion of the Jack. Next….you gotta measure. You CAN use a floor hydraulic jack or an automobile screw jack. This ain’t like lifting the Washington Monument. I used TWO 2 x 4….laminated (deck screws) for the Jack LEG. You measure like this… Bottom or undrside of the slide to a LEVEL surface. The MH needs to be LEVEL….very important. BUT…my sloped driveway wasn’t. I picked two points on the outer edge (the underside….not the flange. I was installing Guardian plates and knew how wide they were. I gave myself 2” clearance….so…that point was the edge of the 24” TEE or TOP. Now…in theory….the lack leg will be 12” further in. Mark that….on each side. Now measure down to the driveway or whatever. Say 36”…..now the math. Subtract 1 3/4” for the TEE….use 2”…. Next….when the jack is totally down….how high is the pad. BTW…Bottle Jacks are my choice….then an Auto screw. Trying to control a floor is NOT what I would use. SAY the Jack is 12” from bottom of base to top of pad, when fully down… Subtract 12”. NOW, you gotta put it in and get it in position….maybe 1 - 2” “working or clearance”….but the longer then the higher the jack….so use 1”. Subtract 1”. That is a total of 15”…..you measured 36”…..your Jack Leg, after you screw it onto the 2 x 4 will be 36 - 15 or 21”. if the surface is not level….do the other end. next is simple….position each jack and raise the jack until the T Jack (post) contacts the slide….then raise each side about 1/8th inch. You need a “measuring” or reference point on the slide so you know “how much” the slide….at the side wall is raised. BTW….The point, as to how far from the MH the T post is….varies. If you decide to run the T post perpendicular to the side wall….then the points will be different. Memory says I centered the distance from the outer edge of the slide to the side wall….then ran the TEE perpendicular…. Some do it, I think, the other way. THE MAIN THING….only use one jack to move 1/8” or so on that side…..then do the other end. I only raised mine to get the underside of the slide up enough to slide in the Guardian plate….with maybe 1/16” or so clearance. The rest is pure common sense and “how do I fix what I broke”. I KNOW for a fact….than on a living room slide with a refrigerator, it typically takes 4 guys to lift and remove it. Obviously all connections to mechanism and umbilical have to be removed. They put it on a cart positioned right behind it. Bedroom slides are 2 -3…a fullwall slide….GOD only knows….and a dealer will probably not removed tell you to go to a Monaco repair center where they have the cart and such. BUT simply raising and working under it and replacing or putting in a Guardian plate….piece of cake. The “wear” hopefully, is just external…..and NOT from a leak. You do a small hole saw core….maybe 3/4” and examine the core and the sides for “ROT” or mosture My three were all superficial issues….nary a drop of water. Don’t make false conclusions without facts and coring. When you grind or cut off the lower side frsme for the Guardian Plates…..you’ll know….in an instant…water or rot….damage or NONE….