HOW TO clean up the wet battery and goop - SAFELY...??

[Les Hurdle]

Hi Folks,

Wow, my old Southwind was easy compared to the Monaco's ;-)). When I bought the coach 2004 Cheetah. love most of it] a couple of months back batt's were dusty ie; dry on top.  The other day I looked and around the pin [+] there was crud and a small amount of liquid.  Don't know if that is acid or distilled water.  Either way, what is causing the 'liquid' and might I presume it then causes the crud?  Is the batt dying?  Just clean it up?  What to do?

Looking at the picture the lh side indicates there may have been an earlier leak??

What type/kind of batteries are these?

Les

[96 EVO]

They are flooded lead acid batteries (FLA), and unless you spilled some distilled water filling that cell, your battery is leaking, and needs replacing.

If you don't know how old the bank is, as in, you never installed them, change them all out!

Just did that myself, today!

One more thing..... As soon as the distilled water enters the cell, it's now battery acid.

Edited August 23, 2023 by 96 EVO

[DavidL]

give that bay a nice power wash.

Check all cells for correct fluid levels.  Like 96 evo, I am betting you have some cells that are drying up.

 

[Les Hurdle]

I've never used such batteries........... do the strips pull off the 'plugs/entrance' to the cells?   Now of-course, what is the best to buy?

L

[Rikadoo]

Also if you are gonna do the job yourself or a nieghbor is gonna do it, take a picture of where all the cables are connected so you reconnect them the way they came off…

[Martinvz]

The “strip” at the top can be removed by turning the wings in the center to release the locks and the lifting it up.

CAUTION: there is battery acid in those holes that are now open. Keep your fingers out of the holes. Safety glasses and latex gloves would also be recommended. 
If you have easy access and can look into the exposed cells you should see that the tops of the plates are covered by fluid (battery acid)  If these are not, then add Distilled water (do not use tap water). 
If you cannot see into the cells, you could use your cellphone camera and a light source to see. Worst case you will have to remove the batteries to check.

Take pictures of your batter bank before you disconnect anything and keep it for future use.
You can disconnect the power by cutting your 120/240v source power and disconnecting the 12v by turning the cutoff switch. All power to the “house” will be off. You can now remove one of the bridging cables on the battery bank so that each battery will only show its voltage. You can use a VOM (assuming you have one and know how to measure the voltage) my measuring the voltage between the positive  and negative post of each battery. The reading should be greater than 6v and preferably higher than 6.2v. If not, then replacement would be recommended.

If one battery is bad and the others appear tho be good then you could replace just the one with another of the same brand or, in an emergency with one of a different brand. The best is to replace all the batteries with net ones of one brand. Mike Sokol had a post just yesterday on this topic, see his Facebook group or website Rvelectricity.com). His site has a lot of useful electrical info that can help you with your questions.

Best batteries: There are many options and generally Trojan batteries are accepted as the best and most expensive. Duracell is a good alternative and can be found at Sam’s Club, Batteries Plus and other outlets. Costco carries Interstate batteries but I have not had great success from them and cannot recommend their GC2 batteries (golf cart battery) but many others will disagree with me. 

 I hope this all helps.

Edited August 23, 2023 by Martinvz

[Les Hurdle]

Thank y0u

Good idea, must admit I usually try the leave cable 'curled' in their position ;-))

[Tom Cherry]

Basics...  Read the Paper in the file on Battery 101. 

Specifically, get some safety glasses (over your specs if needed) with the wrap around or sides covered.  Wear old clothes or you can "age some jeans" and sell them.  Use Latex gloves.  OK...

Next.  I would consider doing a few things BEFORE I started taking things apart.  If you have a Pull Out Battery Tray....then pull it out...and it should have a DRAIN.  If not and you have to lift and set the batteries in place, then order a "battery" lifting strap ($5-$10 - Amazon) or find one locally.  Basically a strap with two hooks and you have an indent or place to put it on each side of most batteries.  WAY EASIER AND SAFER.

So, take Pictures...  LOTS and also use some blue painters tape and mark where the positives GO..  Use another color or Masking tape and mark the Negatives with that....to keep them separated and so you can reassemble.  Do the same for the Chassis as well.

NOW pull out the batteries.  Mark them and I would also put them back into the same "locations".  Not critical, but good practice.

On a surface (put down plastic and have it drain to somewhere, NOT a nice grassy spot, and gently wet down the top of each.  Use a poultice of Baking Soda and enough water so that it is thick..and can be brushed one with a small brush or poured on (pancake syrup style).  Then neutralize the acid.  takes only a minute and when the fizzing stops...gently RINSE (not high pressure wash) the tops.

The WINGIE things are the cell caps or covers.  They rotate one way and that releases that entire cap.  In your picture, the vertical tab or lever on the outside...push it towards the POSTIVE terminal...and it (the entire assembly) lifts up.

NOW....You WILL NEED some Distilled Water (Pharmacy or anywhere they sell Bottled Water)  NOT SPRING or TAP water.  Next...you need a Syringe or a small funnel...  A drinking water bottle with a FLIP UP and DOWN Cap works great.  The TRICK is NOT TO OVERFILL...that LOOKS like the issue...and I was guilty...

OK...next up, you need a 1/2" or 3/8" hardwood dowel...maybe 8" long and a knife and a Sharpie and a tape measure or 6" scale.  

FIRST....  Insert the dowel (battery sitting on fairly level surface) and let it rest or drop down to the plates.  Mark the SIDE of the dowel at some reference point...like the top or the top of the cell...it depends on how your battery is made.  NOW, use a good flashlight and shine down into the cell.  Start to LIFT the dowel, slowly and STOP when the bottom of the Dowel is flush with the "well" or the sunken place.  The well usually has side slots and a bottom.  Get the dowel up and stop when it is flush with the bottom part of the well.  MARK the Dowel again. Wipe off the dowel (paper towel and it IS acid...so have a plastic container for them).  Measure the distance between the two marks...to the nearest 1/16".  ADD ONE sixtenth to that...so it if was 7/16....make it 8/16 or half an inch.  NOW, measure UP on the Dowel from the end.  Make a Sharpie Mark there...in my example...1/2".  Then take the knife and SCORE a small groove around the dowel....NOW, you have a BATTERY DIPSTICK.   From NOW ON....you always FILL to that Mark and NEVER OVERFILL.  That will eliminate your leaks and keep your batteries clean.

Go back to the BOX...clean the terminals with the Baking Soda... maybe have a plastic bowl in there to keep from spattering.  You can then use a cloth with the baking soda poultice on it and wipe out the box.  Use a cloth and rinse...  See if you need to wire brush or sand and paint.  Rustoleum Primer and then Rustoleum Pickup Truck Bed Liner works great.  I would clean the surface with some ACETONE first and let it dry for an hour of so...Then use the Primer....wait (see the can) and then coat with the BedLiner (read the times) and put on at least 2 coats. 

You MIGHT need to order a hydrometer from Amazon.  EZRED SP101 Battery Hydrometer

https://www.amazon.com/E-Z-Red-SP101-Battery-Hydrometer/dp/B000JFHMRU/ref=sr_1_5?crid=2NN79PRMQ5Y4Z&keywords=hydrometer%2Bfor%2Bbattery%2Btesting&qid=1692805684&sprefix=hydrometer%2Bfor%2Bbatt%2Caps%2C91&sr=8-5&th=1

When you use it...there is a cast in (plastic housing) line at the TOP.  FILL ALL THE WAY UP and hold it level.  It also makes a GREAT suction or pump for getting out excess (I over filled at time or two) tool...you can REUSE the electrolyte in an adjacent cell if you goof.

Order a spray can of Battery Anti-Corrosion and then thoroughly coat the terminals and the nuts when you reassemble.  Then, check the batteries twice a year.  Battery 101 also tells you how to exercise if you don't run for a while off the inverter.

Class dismissed....Have at it...

[Mocephus]

I have the Flo Rite battery watering system on our FLA batteries. It makes maintaining the water in the batteries super easy. It would be a great addition to your new battery bank.

https://www.flow-rite.com/filter-by-type/pro-fill-clampless-tubing-installation/?gclid=Cj0KCQjw3JanBhCPARIsAJpXTx6w_pZw89YTe0YjMX5V5JJbBsm-sCkxwyT0eXboNUrMaZxVJLj9zOQaAsHfEALw_wcB

[Les Hurdle]

Thank you... now I'm getting the hebe jeebies........  why would 3 out of 4 batteries all start to leak within a day our so of each other?

They are 2 years old and as far as I can see never leaked before.   [I'm a dunce with this stuff]. Are they being overcharged?  By what?  Maybe just a phenom.  we just had 110 degree temps etc.

I always say I know enough but not enough.

[96 EVO]

When was the last time you added water?

[Les Hurdle]

I have no excuses, but this is a new coach to me and ,my wife and I are going through H**L since our house flooded last Nov and the contractor is a complete flake..... I've even taken some of the jobs away from him which I will do myself...... so I've ignored the coach somewhat..........  I plan to get it all out this w/e and see what is what,

L

 

[Tom Cherry]

36 minutes ago, Les Hurdle said:

Thank you... now I'm getting the hebe jeebies........  why would 3 out of 4 batteries all start to leak within a day our so of each other?

They are 2 years old and as far as I can see never leaked before.   [I'm a dunce with this stuff]. Are they being overcharged?  By what?  Maybe just a phenom.  we just had 110 degree temps etc.

I always say I know enough but not enough.

Les,

You ask a good question.  BUT, there is no GOOD answer unless you have a "log" or did random recordings of the Volts and Amps on the inverter remote.  You need to first address the issues.  IF you do NOT want to do all the clean up....then skip to the step and make yourself a Battery Dip Stick and then properly FILL (not OVERFILL...that leads to the mess like you have) the batteries.  Once your get the levels right in each one....then do some spot cleaning with a rag and baking soda...and THEN monitor.  IF and that is a CAPITAL IF the batteries are overfilled and it is hot, then maybe YES...or NO.  

So, KISS.  Take the time to make your dipstick.  THAT is a heck of a lot easier than eyeballing.  THEN set the Levels and let it GO.  That is the first step...then REPORT back. I overfilled mine.  I messed up my tray.  I thought a little more water is better.  It DON'T WORK THAT WAY....  

Let us know.  Sorry for your frustration....but this is the simplest...

[Les Hurdle]

Thanks Tom........... frustrated ;-)) Try working with some music producers or worst still 'artists'........ that's frustration.... especially if a film score and the suit says he wants it to sound more 'green'.  Yep, got a switch for that.  I will do as you say, In the meantime I have turned them off and will get one checked at the store.

L

 

[96 EVO]

Les, if you have a hectic life and can't reliably keep an eye on the acid level in your FLA battery's, you would be better off replacing them with maintenance free Advanced Glass Matt (AGM) batteries!

A little more money, but, install and forget until they are no longer performing up to snuff 😉!

If you go this route, call the manufacturer of your Inverter/ charger, and let their tech support run you through the proper charge settings for the batteries you install.

Just 2 days ago I spent $1125 on house batteries. I know it sucks, but batteries are a commodity!

Think of it as your renting power rather than buying! With FLA batteries like you have, the $per month of rental can be reduced a bit depending on how much time you spend looking after them!

Edited August 24, 2023 by 96 EVO

[Tom Cherry]

6 minutes ago, 96 EVO said:

Les, if you have a hectic life and can't reliably keep an eye on the acid level in your FLA battery's, you would be better off replacing them with maintenance free Advanced Glass Matt (AGM) batteries!

A little more money, but, install and forget until they are no longer performing up to snuff 😉!

If you go this route, call the manufacturer of your Inverter/ charger, and let their tech support run you through the proper charge settings for the batteries you install.

Ben,

We differ on AGM's and Trojan says that you can NOT just put in an AGM into a MH and rarely run it down and expect it to last any longer than an FLA and sometimes it lasts less.  The technology is basically the same... a "Volta" cell.  BUT, if you regularly use and discharge or drain down the AGM., then you will have less "labor and and upkeep".  But, it you just let them sit around and never discharge them, then they are not a good value.  They have to be exercised and run down at least 3 times every 4 -  6 months...and if you are diligent and do that...then they will last as long.   BUT, you didn't have to do the PM and check the electrolyte level.  BUT, you also pay a premium for that "convenience".

Bottom line...you got the time and are bored and understand how to maintain an FLA, you spend less money, as myself and others do.  BUT, if you don't want the hassle of checking them and maintaining an FLA, then purchase the AGM, but you STILL have to use them or exercise them...just like the AGM and you pay a price for the "don't need a hydrometer.

It is a PERSONAL decision and you have to understand the pros and cons and exactly WHAT the premium is getting you...and it is NOT a guaranteed longer life....sometimes...far from it.  that is my point.  

That's my take on it....and I DO understand your comment about the hassle and mess....but the "No Longer Performing up to snuff" may come quicker or will not be any longer...so the premium is what you are paying for in NOT HAVING TO DO ELECTROLYTE MAINTENANCE   Things that many us do without it being a hassle and then chalk it up to "Owning and Maintaining" our MH...

[96 EVO]

Tom, You know how to get the most out of a house bank.... I know how to get the most out of a house bank, but, some have a life outside looking after their batteries, (unlike us 😁) and I think we've found one!

Some owners, batteries in their RV is like the battery in a clock. Install it, and when the hands stop turning, it's time for a new one!

I see it all the time!

Edited August 24, 2023 by 96 EVO

[Les Hurdle]

definitely punched and bored.

Thanks for the input........ interesting thing to me is the surfaces had ben dry and I have not put any liquid in........ I'll know more when I drag the beast out into the mountain air and take a 'look.'

I think I have been chastised and ridiculed.

Hmmmmm never ever had to moly coddle batteries before, why are Monaco's so different?

I wont attempt light hearted banter again I'll maintain the vibe of the list.

L

 

[Raymond]

Just heard from an Interstate battery engineer that Interstate is about 12-months away from releasing its ‘solid state’ battery. That may be a game changer for all these maintenance issues we’ve been discussing for years on flooded batteries!

[Tom Cherry]

9 hours ago, Les Hurdle said:

definitely punched and bored.

Thanks for the input........ interesting thing to me is the surfaces had ben dry and I have not put any liquid in........ I'll know more when I drag the beast out into the mountain air and take a 'look.'

I think I have been chastised and ridiculed.

Hmmmmm never ever had to moly coddle batteries before, why are Monaco's so different?

I wont attempt light hearted banter again I'll maintain the vibe of the list.

L

 

Not trying to insult or embarrass you.  One simple question.  Since you have not, I believe, owned the Cheetah for a long time and I assume not gone through 110 Df ambient…. Did you check and make sure the electrolyte levels were OK after purchasing or did you service?  If No, then that may, with no disrespect, be the issue.  Hot temps and overfilling will result in gassing off (water vapor) forming and escaping on the top.  Trust me…I didn’t fully understand and my first years of overfilling always had a wet top and eventually drained and I had to refurbish the tray and I learned….

Next up, the most frequent “OMG overcharging” comes from “equalizing”…the more…GEE, probably need to do that…say every other month, the higher the current and the more propensity for “boiling over”.  Magnum recommends it.  Trojans say ONLY if the batteries were abused and need to be “shocked”.  Therefore they only say do it after the batteries look like a household of children, each with a different sperm donor…and be aware, it could damage Or if they have been neglected, even a heavy duty equalizing can cause harm and not correct years of lack of normal PM.

OK…then, finally, yes…an Inverter can go haywire.  But, it would be obvious if the remote was checked periodically….as in voltages over say 15 VDC and Current over 120 A.  Magnums seldom do this…don’t know about the other brands,

But starting out thinking there is an equipment failure is not the most cost effective solution.  Cleaning up and getting the batteries filled properly and then exercising them and finding out the real “Recharged SOC” is the first step.  Then, if they gas and the voltage and current are high….look for an equipment issue.

Some DO take the path, unfortunately, of new batteries and even a new inverter…but later on found a bad cable or connection or corrosion on ground studs or…you name it.

We, moderating staff, try to monitor topics and offer, if we are qualified, best recommended practices…according to as the Manufacturer, Inverter and Battery company…so that is what we do.

Bottom line, yes…rarely do we have an overcharging issue… and the usual cause of your situation is lack of maintenance or such.

Please do not take this as a reprimand….but there is no “universal” gripe about Monaco MH’s killing batteries….the charging systems are standard and, based on what I read on other threads, considered as “top drawer” compared to other brands.

That’s the answer to your rhetorical question….

[Les Hurdle]

Yes, life got in the way.  Namely a flooded house and a few other silly little life things... lousy contractor, doctors, even at 80 long hours of WORK etc.

I actually looked at the manual today re batteries [way too much tech which means nothing to folks like me........  ask me about audio and music, I'm your guy].  It was interesting, the removable tray for the batteries isn't there and all of the inverter info doesn't add up to that which is on the panel, nothing which shows or goes to 'standby' .  Also, last night the tops of the batts were dry again........... mind you, these look like the cheapest from O'Rielly........ I plan on getting them cleaned up and levels checked this next Sat.

I read on some other website Interstate were not recommended [JD Power] maybe I'll hang on for the solid state stuff.

Thanks for the help

 

L

 

[96 EVO]

Any chance water is dripping down onto your batteries from above?

[Les Hurdle]

We just had a hurricane and earthquake so yes, but the moho is un a 3 sided shed and I didn't see any other water in the bay.  On of the batts certainly has other goop' on it which looks like grease...... I'll check at the w/e.

I might add a personal note, since I have had this moho it has been to the shop twice, front alignment and wet bearing gasket, other than that it has sat since we have to live in it until our speedy contractor finishes the house.

L

 

[96 EVO]

Any sink's or laundry equipment above that bay?

[Tom Cherry]

42 minutes ago, Les Hurdle said:

Yes, life got in the way.  Namely a flooded house and a few other silly little life things... lousy contractor, doctors, even at 80 long hours of WORK etc.

I actually looked at the manual today re batteries [way too much tech which means nothing to folks like me........  ask me about audio and music, I'm your guy].  It was interesting, the removable tray for the batteries isn't there and all of the inverter info doesn't add up to that which is on the panel, nothing which shows or goes to 'standby' .  Also, last night the tops of the batts were dry again........... mind you, these look like the cheapest from O'Rielly........ I plan on getting them cleaned up and levels checked this next Sat.

I read on some other website Interstate were not recommended [JD Power] maybe I'll hang on for the solid state stuff.

Thanks for the help

 

L

 

Back to Ben’s point…do you have a leak?  Without enrolling an old rocker in an electronics class…might i offer the following.  But if you had Litmus paper…maybe..  LOL…

Spend a few minutes and clean up the tops and make yourself a dip stick and service the batteries.  Obviously use a cloth and rinse, sparingly, the tops.  Spraying a coating of anti corrosion is cheap insurance.  So all is neat and clean…

Cut a piece of plastic Visclene (the stuff contractors use to prevent dust or water or such) and then tape it in place, maybe 3 inches over the House batteries..Simple duct tape works miracles.  Watch and monitor.  If my hunch is correct….no more gassing.  If Ben’s thoughts are correct, then you will see the source of the water.

Finally, don’t depend on any NAPA or O’Reilly or such to do a REAL load test on Deep Cycle batteries.  An Interstate GOOD distributor will discharge and recharge a few times…and them measure the “best recharge voltage they can get” on the batteries and also check the specific gravity.  Dollars to donuts…a cheap tester will err on you needing new.  Those cheap testers (under $100) are notorious for being inaccurate.  The higher ($300 - $500) ones, like a good battery shop has are great… BUT designed for STARTING batteries.  They cannot measure the SOC in a deep cycle without having them rundown and recharged and getting the cells back to their best condition.

I use Interstates  for cranking and think they are great….I also buy them locally from a distributor for less than Costco sells the SAME battery.  I only recommend Trojans, for either purpose, and they are the Gold Standard for RV/Marine…they wrote the book…. 

That is what I would do…and not throw money at something that has not been diagnosed or trouble shot….let us know…