12 Volt Power Loss

[dkelly]

Hello all.  I am in need of your assistance.  I have a 2003 Monaco Diplomat.  I am experiencing total loss of 12 volt power in the coach/house. All 110 electrical works.  I have checked the salesman switch at entrance door and flipped in each direction (no power), I have checked the breakers on the inverter and flipped (the inverter has a green charging light on and it is humming) and I took the cables off each side of transfer switch attempting to bypass and power came back on for a day or two but is currently not working.  When it was working, the lights would flicker and were dimmer at times.  I also occassionally heard a clicking noise in the breaker box located in the bed room.

The house batteries are less than 4 months old (four 12 volt interstate) I load checked the house and chassie batteries and they checked good .

I am.attaching a picture of transfer switch and batteries.  Any help is greatly appreciated. currently no heat or interior lights

Edited November 25, 2020 by dkelly
correct spelling

[Highwayman]

In the front fuse box on the driver's side box is a solenoid that controls the house 12 volt power. Make sure that it's working. 

[Frank Bergamo]

Darryl,

the salesman switch controls a solenoid, possibly the one in the picture. Check the big terminals with a volt meter. You should have around 12-12.5 volts on each big terminal with salesman switch on, if working properly. One of the small terminals is the trigger from the salesman switch, the other, if it has two, is the ground. The trigger terminal should also have 12-12.5 volts with the salesman switch on. If the solenoid does not operate properly, you can take the big terminal on one side of the solenoid and connect it to the big terminal on the other side to complete the circuit as a work around. Hope this helps.

[waterskier_1]

First, that is not your transfer switch. It looks like the salesman switch relay.  Can you check the voltage to ground on both the large terminals, individually? They should be the same. The green charging light only indicates that the charger is charging the batteries.  The other circuit breakers on the inverter are for 110 VAC, so that isn't likely the problem.  If it isn't that relay in your first picture, then next I would look at the manual disconnect (switch) near the batteries. 

[Ivan K]

The solenoid in that picture appears to function as a boost solenoid. I have no idea where the salesman is, perhaps in the front as Highwayman says, very different from ours.

[Frank Bergamo]

Looking at the picture closer, I believe Ivan is correct. The solenoid is hooked up to both battery banks to combine them for starting boost. The salesman solenoid must be located somewhere else.

[Dwight Lindsey]

Darryl:

The White Rodgers Solenoid you posted the picture of connects the house and chassis battery banks together when you press the "Batt Bost" switch at drivers location.  In my 05 Knight (which I think is pretty similar to your Diplomat) it's on the side console to the left of the driver.  That's not your issue.

The most likely issue is the "Salesman's Switch solenoid", which in my coach (and probably in yours) is in the front run bay, roadside front.  You're looking for a solenoid that is similar in appearance to the White Rodgers, but probably a little smaller.  You don't need it.  In my opinion and the opinion of many others, there's just no need for that salesman's switch or the solenoid it controls.

What you want to do is locate that solenoid, probably in the fuse box in the run bay and bypass it.  You can probably take both cables off, put a bolt through them and wrap with electrical tape, or in some other manner just bypass the solenoid.

Dwight

 

Darryl:  You probably know this already, but I should mention that for safety, before you bypass the salesman's switch solenoid, turn off the battery disconnect switches in your battery bay.

Dwight

[Dr4Film]

As others have previously stated, the solenoid in your photo has a wire coming from the Chassis Batteries on one side and one wire coming from your House Battery Bank on the other side. This solenoid is typically called an Auxiliary Start Solenoid as it connects the two battery banks together in emergency situations when your chassis battery may not have enough juice to start your engine.

The solenoid you are searching for is most likely another White-Rogers one that is typically called the Battery Cut-Off Solenoid. That one is only wired in series with your house 12 VDC system. I would bypass that solenoid versus replacing it as they are a high failure device. Once bypassed you will never be plagued with not having 12 VDC inside any longer due to a failed solenoid.

[Tom Cherry]

5 minutes ago, Dr4Film said:

As others have previously stated, the solenoid in your photo has a wire coming from the Chassis Batteries on one side and one wire coming from your House Battery Bank on the other side. This solenoid is typically called an Auxiliary Start Solenoid as it connects the two battery banks together in emergency situations when your chassis battery may not have enough juice to start your engine.

The solenoid you are searching for is most likely another White-Rogers one that is typically called the Battery Cut-Off Solenoid. That one is only wired in series with your house 12 VDC system. I would bypass that solenoid versus replacing it as they are a high failure device. Once bypassed you will never be plagued with not having 12 VDC inside any longer due to a failed solenoid.

Richard is spot ON. You can either move BOTH the cables to ONE Terminal (clean all the connections) OR purchase a NAPA P/N 781144.  This is a SHORT jumper. You do NOT want a LONG ONE. That should restore the power. As most have said, the Salesman's Switch was a Brainstorm that was only put there for DEALERS and drives owners CRAZY. It was there so that a dealer could run around at the end of the day and kill all the lights in the MH and turn them back on in the AM.

IT IS A PITA AND WILL FAIL.  Why spend MONEY to replace a component that MOST never, EVER use. My DW would accidentally trip it and I finally just pulled it out. 

 

[Chuck B 2004 Windsor]

If you have a Todd/Toddco transfer switch, you need to get rid of it ASAP.  It has been determined to be a fire hazard.  Monaco had a recall on it, but that recall is no longer valid because Monaco is no longer in business.  In the mean time remove all power from it.  Chuck B

The picture you attached is Not a transfer switch.  Chuck B

[Dennis H]

It looks like you're missing nuts on the front battery posts. Also two disconnected wires...???....Dennis

[Tom Cherry]

7 hours ago, Chuck B said:

If you have a Todd/Toddco transfer switch, you need to get rid of it ASAP.  It has been determined to be a fire hazard.  Monaco had a recall on it, but that recall is no longer valid because Monaco is no longer in business.  In the mean time remove all power from it.  Chuck B

The picture you attached is Not a transfer switch.  Chuck B

It may have the name TODD or it may have IOTA 50R. Either one is a fire hazard and should be immediately, as Chuck posted, removed. The ESCO LPT50BRD is the most commonly used one.

[waterskier_1]

3 hours ago, Tom Cherry said:

It may have the name TODD or it may have IOTA 50R. Either one is a fire hazard and should be immediately, as Chuck posted, removed. The ESCO LPT50BRD is the most commonly used one.

Please explain how the transfer switch would have anything to do with a 12 VDC alternator charging issue. 

[outtadough]

Had your same problem a few years ago.  Cure was a 50 amp manual reset circuit breaker located in the outside roadside front distribution panel.  You may have the same setup.  Luck.

 

Jim - 2005 Camelot

[Tom Cherry]

9 hours ago, waterskier_1 said:

Please explain how the transfer switch would have anything to do with a 12 VDC alternator charging issue. 

Nothing other that information.  Many folks do NOT understand that the ATS that Monaco used for many years were recalled or were problems.  YES...nothing to do with Alternator, but if one person reads and find out and checks and then saves themselves a major problem...

[dkelly]

Many thanks to all.  The many responses was very useful.  I located the correct tranafer switch in the fuse box on the front driver side compartment.  I used a jumper that I purchased from NAPA (NAPA P/N 781144) and all is well.  Full power with no issue.  Very quick fix, thanks to all your help.

Thanks

DKelly.

 

Hello all.  I am in need of your assistance.  I have a 2003 Monaco Diplomat.  I am experiencing total loss of 12 volt power in the coach/house. All 110 electrical works.  I have checked the salesman switch at entrance door and flipped in each direction (no power), I have checked the breakers on the inverter and flipped (the inverter has a green charging light on and it is humming) and I took the cables off each side of transfer switch attempting to bypass and power came back on for a day or two but is currently not working.  When it was working, the lights would flicker and were dimmer at times.  I also occassionally heard a clicking noise in the breaker box located in the bed room.

The house batteries are less than 4 months old (four 12 volt interstate) I load checked the house and chassie batteries and they checked good .

I am.attaching a picture of transfer switch and batteries.  Any help is greatly appreciated. currently no heat or interior lights

[Tom Cherry]

12 hours ago, dkelly said:

Many thanks to all.  The many responses was very useful.  I located the correct tranafer switch in the fuse box on the front driver side compartment.  I used a jumper that I purchased from NAPA (NAPA P/N 781144) and all is well.  Full power with no issue.  Very quick fix, thanks to all your help.

Thanks

DKelly.

 

Hello all.  I am in need of your assistance.  I have a 2003 Monaco Diplomat.  I am experiencing total loss of 12 volt power in the coach/house. All 110 electrical works.  I have checked the salesman switch at entrance door and flipped in each direction (no power), I have checked the breakers on the inverter and flipped (the inverter has a green charging light on and it is humming) and I took the cables off each side of transfer switch attempting to bypass and power came back on for a day or two but is currently not working.  When it was working, the lights would flicker and were dimmer at times.  I also occassionally heard a clicking noise in the breaker box located in the bed room.

The house batteries are less than 4 months old (four 12 volt interstate) I load checked the house and chassie batteries and they checked good .

I am.attaching a picture of transfer switch and batteries.  Any help is greatly appreciated. currently no heat or interior lights

Great. You actually can pull that out.  Serves no purpose. It is a Solenoid (Commonly called a contactor or a relay also).

Chuck made a good point based on the age of your Motor Home. I would locate the 115 VAC Automatic Transfer Switch Has three large pieces of plastic or flexible conduit or maybe large pieces of Romex.  Get the Name and the Model number.  Google that or post it here. If it is any other brand that an ESCO, I would be dubious and then find out the history.

Good Luck.

[dkelly]

Chuck, I was looking to find the transfer switch you are speaking of.  Where would it be located?

 

Darryl K

[Dwight Lindsey]

• It's a rectangular box and it will be at the rear of the coach, where the AC power cord enters the coach.  This is the box that switches between Generator and Shore Power