Wabco Air Dryer - Questions and Filter info

[dandick66]

I don’t drain the air tanks very often, but I noticed a while ago that I was getting oil in my air tanks.  After some thought, I’m wondering if there’s a problem with the dryer filters I bought.  In hindsight ,  I don’t recall ever having any oil when I drained the tanks before changing the filter.  I have no idea how long the “original to me” filter was in, but I’ve put 2 of these World America filters on I. 5000 miles.  I thought maybe the first one was defective, but looking at the filter, I don’t see any evidence of oil residue (photo attached).  
                                         
Is it possible that the dryer is defective (stuck check valve)?  Also, I’ve heard of oil coalescing filters.  I’m wondering if I should try one of those?

 

Dan D.            
2012 Diplomat
 

[birdshill123]

That filter may be Chinese. My experience is that when there is oil in the dryer your compressor is worn. 

 

 

 

 

[Ivan K]

I agree with Bruce, as far as i know, the oil has to be coming from the compressor through the desiccant. Either the piston is not sealing or there is oil mist in the air it is compressing. My compressors air intake is already precompressed air from the turbo, not sure about yours. Some small amount might still be acceptable but myself I never got any water or oil.

[cowpoke]

Yes, I agree compressor..

[Jdw12345]

You might want to check your crankcase ventilation system also, depending on how the system was designed it may not be operating correctly, that new of a coach my require a positive crank case ventilation. 

[96 EVO]

You can get away with aftermarket filters in some positions, your air dryer isn't one of them!

I made that mistake once. Only genuine Wabco filters now!

Also... If you get a new desiccant filter and there's any holes or tears in the shrink wrap, you don't want it! 

Edited April 22, 2023 by 96 EVO

[1nolaguy]

I am embarrassed to say that I do not know where the air dryer or filter is located on our 2005 Safari Cheetah DP. I do "occasionally" drain some water from the air system at a petcock located at the back passenger side of the MH, to the right of the engine bay. I am not sure if this is the low point of the air system or if there is a separate drain. I do not know where the filter is or even if it exists on our model. Can someone in the group educate me on location(s) and also a recommended maintenance schedule.

[jacwjames]

It has a large wire braided type hose coming from the compressor, just start at the compressor and follow the hose.  They usually mount fairly close to the compressor. 

Mine is on the passenger side bolted to the lower chassis rail tucked up high. 

You should be able to start your engine and walk back and listen for the dry to purge after it builds pressure. 

Edited April 22, 2023 by jacwjames

[dandick66]

13 hours ago, birdshill123 said:

That filter may be Chinese. My experience is that when there is oil in the dryer your compressor is worn. 

 

 

 

 

You’re probably right about it being Chinese.  I don’t see any evidence of oil in the dryer , unless I’m missing something.  Look at the picture, there’s no sign of oil.  
                   
I’m hoping it’s not the compressor.  I’ll take a look today to see how difficult it is to get off.  I’m sure it will be pretty heavy.  I ordered a genuine WABCO oil coalescing filter today.  I’ll see if that will keep the oil out of the tanks.  

13 hours ago, Ivan K said:

I agree with Bruce, as far as i know, the oil has to be coming from the compressor through the desiccant. Either the piston is not sealing or there is oil mist in the air it is compressing. My compressors air intake is already precompressed air from the turbo, not sure about yours. Some small amount might still be acceptable but myself I never got any water or oil.

My compressor gets air from the air cleaner.  I attached the page from the Maxxforce service manual.

[Ivan K]

So your turbo would be eliminated as a potential source of oily air, that's a very good thing.

[Tom Cherry]

1 hour ago, 1nolaguy said:

I am embarrassed to say that I do not know where the air dryer or filter is located on our 2005 Safari Cheetah DP. I do "occasionally" drain some water from the air system at a petcock located at the back passenger side of the MH, to the right of the engine bay. I am not sure if this is the low point of the air system or if there is a separate drain. I do not know where the filter is or even if it exists on our model. Can someone in the group educate me on location(s) and also a recommended maintenance schedule.

Your manual should have an entire section on the air dryer.  Read it.  If you can't find it or don't have the manual, this use this link to my manual.

https://www.monacocoach.com/service-and-repairs/

Go to the Owner Manual section.  2009 Camelot.  Download it and go to pages 210 or so.  There is a great set of instructions.  If you stay in that section and read the info before the air dryer, it tells you how to drain the system and that should be done twice a year. If you have water, you are at great risk of rusting the canisters for your brakes and big $$ repairs.  Again, read your manual as the fittings may be different.

Typically, the air dryer is a WABCO.  You MAY have a filter number called out in the specifications in your manual.  I  can't find any online Cheetah manuals.  The Wabco needs to be changed every 3 - 4 years.  It is about as simple as running a microwave.  You drain out all the air.  You need a strap wrench (oil filter type) and your loosens the filter.  There will be some seals (maybe 2...memory) that you need to make sure that comes off the base or housing.  I usually put a little Plumber's Silicone grease (Lowes has it) LIGHTLY on the seals to lubricate them.  Wipe it off so there are no lump....you just "Wet" them....not spread it like jelly.

Hand tighten the filter and then maybe 3/4 - 1 turn afterwards.  Don't get carried away, otherwise you will have to drive a screwdriver through it and knock it loose.

The filter can be anywhere in the engine compartment...USUALLY.  Mine is a side radiator, so I can't show you a picture.  You can GOOGLE Wabco Air Dryer or IRV2 Wabco Air Dryer and select "Pictures or Images"

That's it.  If you have water....ATTEND TO IT NOW...

Here is a picture of one.  There will be TWO lines (air) and it can be mounted with the filter UP or Horizontal (maybe facing down...but I don't know).  If you raise the engine cover.  Drain your air.  Then start the engine and hustle back there....the WHOOSH you hear will be from the Wabco.  Look and listen....that's it...

 

 

14 hours ago, dandick66 said:

I don’t drain the air tanks very often, but I noticed a while ago that I was getting oil in my air tanks.  After some thought, I’m wondering if there’s a problem with the dryer filters I bought.  In hindsight ,  I don’t recall ever having any oil when I drained the tanks before changing the filter.  I have no idea how long the “original to me” filter was in, but I’ve put 2 of these World America filters on I. 5000 miles.  I thought maybe the first one was defective, but looking at the filter, I don’t see any evidence of oil residue (photo attached).  
                                         
Is it possible that the dryer is defective (stuck check valve)?  Also, I’ve heard of oil coalescing filters.  I’m wondering if I should try one of those?

 

Dan D.            
2012 Diplomat
 

https://www.irv2.com/forums/f115/oil-in-air-dryer-383715.html

Start Googling.  Wabco air dryer filter oil IRV2 or Wabco air dryer filter oil.

Many hits and discussion.  Take with a grain of salt...LOL....we make sure folks here know what they are talking about.  Seriously, lots of hits and such to read.

[96 EVO]

Your air dryer filter is always going to be installed above the air dryer body ( pointing UP), so that any moisture can drop down to the purge valve!

Good chance you will find your dryer mounted above your drive axle, or possibly in one of your rear bays. It needs to be lower than the engine mounted compressor, so that you can't get a block of ice form in the feed line from the air compressor!

[1nolaguy]

Tom, thanks so much for your quick reply and for all the information. I followed the link you provided and while I could not find a manual for our 2005 Safari the 2005 Diplomat is very similar so I downloaded it. It is completely different that the owners manual that came with our MH, which is more like an owners (sale) brochure. The owners manual I down loaded still did not give a filter location but since 96 EVO said they are always located near the engine I will start there, The photo really helps as now I at least know about what I am looking for.

Thanks so much for your helpful and informative post.

[Alan Goolsby]

As always be careful working under your coach.

Alan G.

95 Dynasty 

[dandick66]

22 hours ago, Ivan K said:

So your turbo would be eliminated as a potential source of oily air, that's a very good thing.

I was able to get “eyes on” the compressor.  It is a Bendix TU-FLO 750.  From what I’ve been able to find on the web, these are a pretty common item. It look like they weigh 53 pounds, so that’s certainly manageable.  It seems like the pricing for these things is all over the map.  I see rebuilt ones and new ones ranging anywhere from $600 to $4,000.00.  They also sell rebuild kits, so I don’t know if this is something I can tackle myself.  I need to do a lot more research.

Dan

[jacwjames]

Back ~40 years ago when most of the underground equipment relied on air brakes we used the TuFlo compressors on most of the rigs, very dependable under severe conditions.  Night and day difference in operating conditions. 

I have read of compressor failures on RV's but not often but it can happen.

Here is a link to troubleshooting the compressor, it does have steps to test for oil discharge, might be worth your effort to go through the steps.  https://www.bendix.com/media/documents/products_1/compressorsgovernors_1/troubleshootingguide.pdf

One thing I'd do is take the compressor line feeding the air dryer and see if there is any appreciable amount of oil in it.

As to rebuild, they do make kits and I found this video

 So it's possible to rebuild but takes some special tools.  If you have time to remove the compressor and get an idea of its internal conditions you can then decide to make an attempt at rebuilding.  We do some compressor rebuilds in the mines but used mechanics that took the time to do it right.  Take the time to clean it up and look for name plat info to make sure you get the right one for mounting etc.

The prices do have a wide range for refurbished compressors, if I went that route I'd rely on reviews of the seller.  Last thing you'd want would be to replace and have a bad rebuild compressor.  You might call the seller and ask if there is any documentation on testing after rebuild. 

If it were mine and since it will have to be removed, if troubleshooting says it's bad, I'd remove and look at the insides, if the piston walls are good they a rebuild would be worth investigating further.

[dandick66]

11 minutes ago, jacwjames said:

Back ~40 years ago when most of the underground equipment relied on air brakes we used the TuFlo compressors on most of the rigs, very dependable under severe conditions.  Night and day difference in operating conditions. 

I have read of compressor failures on RV's but not often but it can happen.

Here is a link to troubleshooting the compressor, it does have steps to test for oil discharge, might be worth your effort to go through the steps.  https://www.bendix.com/media/documents/products_1/compressorsgovernors_1/troubleshootingguide.pdf

One thing I'd do is take the compressor line feeding the air dryer and see if there is any appreciable amount of oil in it.

As to rebuild, they do make kits and I found this video

 So it's possible to rebuild but takes some special tools.  If you have time to remove the compressor and get an idea of its internal conditions you can then decide to make an attempt at rebuilding.  We do some compressor rebuilds in the mines but used mechanics that took the time to do it right.  Take the time to clean it up and look for name plat info to make sure you get the right one for mounting etc.

The prices do have a wide range for refurbished compressors, if I went that route I'd rely on reviews of the seller.  Last thing you'd want would be to replace and have a bad rebuild compressor.  You might call the seller and ask if there is any documentation on testing after rebuild. 

If it were mine and since it will have to be removed, if troubleshooting says it's bad, I'd remove and look at the insides, if the piston walls are good they a rebuild would be worth investigating further.

Jim,

Thanks for the info.  The coach only has 45,000 miles, so the compressor should still have a lot of life in it.  I definitely need to do some reading and reading.  I’ll try to look at the line going to the dryer today and post the results.

 

[dandick66]

While looking at the compressor I noticed the governor has the exhaust port plugged.  Everything I’ve read online says that is a big no-no.  I’ve circled the exhaust port in the attached photo.  I don’t think that would have anything to do with excess oil, but I picked up a replacement and will install it tomorrow.  
 

Dan

[96 EVO]

No ports on your governor should vent to atmosphere!

If your air system worked well in the past, I'd be leaving that alone.

[Yoaks5]

On a previous coach I had it had an isc 300 hp cummins in it. This was about 10 years ago so the details are foggy but I was having the same issue with oil getting into the air tanks. After much testing and research I was about to change the compressor thinking it was bad. I called the dryer manufacturer (think it was haladex purair plus) and their tech guy recommended rebuilding the dryer. Said either the isc or the dryer (can't remember which) need to maintain pressure on the line coming into the dryer. Once I rebuilt it that stopped my oil problem. 

[dandick66]

11 minutes ago, Yoaks5 said:

On a previous coach I had it had an isc 300 hp cummins in it. This was about 10 years ago so the details are foggy but I was having the same issue with oil getting into the air tanks. After much testing and research I was about to change the compressor thinking it was bad. I called the dryer manufacturer (think it was haladex purair plus) and their tech guy recommended rebuilding the dryer. Said either the isc or the dryer (can't remember which) need to maintain pressure on the line coming into the dryer. Once I rebuilt it that stopped my oil problem. 

That sounds like an easier solution than changing out the compressor.  It’s certainly worth a try.  Thanks.

[dandick66]

On 4/23/2023 at 8:59 PM, 96 EVO said:

No ports on your governor should vent to atmosphere!

If your air system worked well in the past, I'd be leaving that alone.

Upon further investigation, the port wasn’t plugged.  It has a small brass cap with a very fine screen- from a distance it looked like a plug.

 

[Mike H]

I checked my manual and it gives a MERITOR WEBCO filter # P950011.  When I searched on line I keep coming up with this TORQUW 950011 filter for $40.  Is this one of those Chinese filters?  If so, then where is everyone finding their WEBCO filters?  BTW, my manual says to replace every 2-3 years and I'm way overdo.

[96 EVO]

Mike, pretty sure I got my last Wabco filter on Amazon.

[Tom Cherry]

44 minutes ago, Mike H said:

I checked my manual and it gives a MERITOR WEBCO filter # P950011.  When I searched on line I keep coming up with this TORQUW 950011 filter for $40.  Is this one of those Chinese filters?  If so, then where is everyone finding their WEBCO filters?  BTW, my manual says to replace every 2-3 years and I'm way overdo.

Mike,

Did you look on the existing filter.  I checked your manual.  YES...it says R950011.  That is what mine says.  I think that the P number is just some wrong information.  Here are the part numbers that I have.... and I KNOW they work.

Baldwin BA3574 - I TRUST BALDWIN....yes...I used them for the engine air filter

Fleetguard AF27817 - Again, I run these OEM Cummins parts...of course

Donaldson P953571 - Same as Baldwin....I have run their air filters.

Bendix 109994 - This is in the Parts List....and I would trust Bendix, since they invented or are the daddy rabbit in air brakes....

I TOTALLY agree with you.  Buy a NAME brand....  FWIW, during my research, which I added two part numbers to my own records....I ONLY found the Donaldson on Amazon for $60.  NAPA gets over $100 for one of them.  GO FIGURE.  Any of the FOUR aftermarket Brands or NOT OEM above, IMHO, will be trustworthy.

NOW, if you are a "Curious CUSS", Call Wabco and ask them for the NEW (I think there may be at least 4) PN that replaced or will work just as well as the R950011.  If you do that, then please contact @Frank McElroy.  He is the Parts Guru....and will update the Parts List.  

Frank, I have used the above part numbers for the R950011.  I DID look them up and the 2008 Dynasty has the same number as my 2009 Camelot...so it seems pretty universal.  You can add them.

Mike....that's it.  I agree with Ben, I THOUGHT I had seen the WABCO on Amazon....but right not, it is AWOL...