Replacing Gas Cooktop

[richmelcole@sbcglobal.net]

To make my 02 Windsor all-electric coach, I want to replace the gas cooktop with a True Induction double burner TI-2B counter insert cooktop.  I noticed an enclosed area above the silverware drawer where the gas cooktop set in will have to be removed for ventilation and some countertop will have to be cut out and some countertop gap filled in.  Appreciate any guidance to help me complete this upgrade.  Rich

[Rick A]

I can’t think of a good reason to do this in our case because we travel and boondocks as well. So it’s off the scale for me but I’ll be interested to see what other RVers say. 

[waterskier_1]

You will likely need to run a new line to power a two burner induction cooktop too.

  - Rick N 

[Romeo84]

This was on the list of things to do this year! So funny. The only thing we Use in our camper was the stove. I wanted to remove the tank and make a giant tool storage compartment.  Saw someone at a campground last This year that did the exact same thing so I know it's possible. 

Like the other guy said Need to do a little research on power... in my signature I have an outlet under the sink for a subwoofer. Pretty sure it's a downstream run that could be turned independent. Curious how much a small 2 burner induction stove uses. Can't be more than a microwave?

 

[cnot305]

I did this a few years ago in our 07 Dip PDQ. I moved the outlet wires that were under the right side of the sink and moved it to the side hole once I removed the old stove top. I found and stained a piece of wood and remounted a towel rack where the exposed hole was left by the knobs. Cut the Corian and inserted the Tru Induction top. 

[Tom Cherry]

9 hours ago, Romeo84 said:

This was on the list of things to do this year! So funny. The only thing we Use in our camper was the stove. I wanted to remove the tank and make a giant tool storage compartment.  Saw someone at a campground last This year that did the exact same thing so I know it's possible. 

Like the other guy said Need to do a little research on power... in my signature I have an outlet under the sink for a subwoofer. Pretty sure it's a downstream run that could be turned independent. Curious how much a small 2 burner induction stove uses. Can't be more than a microwave?

 

Check the plate on what you intend to buy or a similar unit.  The Sub outlet will be on the Inverter as it is part, if you are correct, the HEC system.  If so, then do the math.  You need to look at the feed to your Inverter.  Odds are, it is 30 amps.  Next is to look at the plate on the inverter.  Inverters are rated two ways, but most folks don’t understand.  There is the “inverting” capacity….typically, unless someone swapped it out, 2000 watts.  It has an internal ATS that passes through or allows you to have a greater output or more power to the rig.  30 A would give you 3,600 watts (30 X 120 VAC).  BUT, the inverter has to charge/maintain batteries.  During peak load, that could be 100 A X 13.5 VDC or 1,350 watts.  But, at float, maybe 200.  So, Magnum rates theirs, as do others on usable wattage “most” of the time.  A 2000 watt inverter can have as much as 3,000 watts on shore.  Some of the older inverters, that I have found manuals for folks with issues, were not that “stronng or less pass through.  OK.  SAY 3,000 watts.  Divided by 120 VAC…25 Amp.  The True Unit TI-2B requires a dedicated circuit of 15 A.  Assuming you still have the Convection Microwave, that requires 15 A.  Thus, your inverter does not have sufficient pass through power.  I have looked at a lot of 120 VAC prints on upper ends where high demand appliances or devices were installed or there were options for them on the prints.  Dishwasher, Induction cook tops, fireplaces, etc. ALL have a dedicated 15 A breaker…so, you Will need a dedicated 120 A circuit run from the main panel.  Don’t know if you have a Sub Panel, if so, that is fed from the main and typically you have TWO 30 A inverter (dual in-dual out), but the microwave only has the “on shore” ATS. So, power from a sub panel is still on the inverter circuit….unless you rewire and get an electrician (house or commercial) to figure how to get it there….from a Sub.  Your prints are the first stop…

The first step might be, “How or CAN I get a dedicated - 15 A Breaker in the main panel - circuit to the kitchen?”.  Then start looking at the units and physical installation. 

[Dr4Film]

Does your coach have the Insta-Hot accessory like my 02 Windsor had? If so and don't use it you could plug the Induction Cook-top into that outlet. I would also suggest installing a 120 VAC switch to turn the cook-top on and off. That is how ours is wired in the Dynasty we now own.

Regarding the Corian, I would look for a shop that has the tools and expertise to work with Corian. I did that on my Windsor when I switched the cook-top from the 3 burner Atwood stove to the Seaward Princess Gourmet 2 burner cook-top.

[waterskier_1]

I guess my comment about likely needing to run (additional/new) power might have been a bit vague. 

First, you will need to decide if you want a "cooktop" or a "portable" unit.  By convention, a "cooktop" is permanently installed, and usually consists of two 1800 Watt burners.  This is a 3600 Watt unit and usually requires 220 VAC connections.  These are likely not what anyone is considering, since it would only work on a 50 Amp Shore Power Connection, and would require significant rewiring to supply 220 VAC to the unit.

A "Portable" unit typically has 2300 - 2600 Watts spread over the two burners (1150 - 1300 Watts for each burner) although you can get lower powered units, and single burner only units.  A 2300 Watt unit would require a dedicated 20 Amp circuit, while a 2600 W unit would require a 25 Amp circuit.  This is assuming no other loads on the circuit. 

Second, you need to decide if you want this to work off an inverter.  As Tom points out, most coaches have a 2000 Watt (some 2500 Watt and newer coaches 3000 Watt) inverters.  Obviously you would need at least a 3000 Watt inverter just to power a portable induction unit.  All Electric coaches typically run two inverters, and newer technology incorporates 24 VDC or 48 VDC systems, versus our typically 12 VDC systems.  Then consider battery requirements if you plan on running off grid.  If you run the cooktop only 30 minutes a day (I'm assuming at full power for this), that would be 1150 Watt-Hrs consumed.  

I'm not saying it can't be done, but it will likely require more electrical design considerations than just plugging into a Subwoofer outlet. 

  -Rick N 

Edited August 25, 2023 by waterskier_1
Correct A-Hr to Watt-Hr math error.

[Romeo84]

1 hour ago, Dr4Film said:

Does your coach have the Insta-Hot accessory like my 02 Windsor had? If so and don't use it you could plug the Induction Cook-top into that outlet. I would also suggest installing a 120 VAC switch to turn the cook-top on and off. That is how ours is wired in the Dynasty we now own.

Regarding the Corian, I would look for a shop that has the tools and expertise to work with Corian. I did that on my Windsor when I switched the cook-top from the 3 burner Atwood stove to the Seaward Princess Gourmet 2 burner cook-top.

We have the switch and the faucet for the insta hot in our signature. Is that a dedicated run?

Tom, I think you wrote out exactly what I was thinking. Thats why I haven't done it yet i don't want to run a whole new independent line. But now I'm interested to see if that insta hot run like dr. Mentioned is Independent. 

 

[waterskier_1]

19 minutes ago, Romeo84 said:

We have the switch and the faucet for the insta hot in our signature. Is that a dedicated run?

Tom, I think you wrote out exactly what I was thinking. Thats why I haven't done it yet i don't want to run a whole new independent line. But now I'm interested to see if that insta hot run like dr. Mentioned is Independent. 

 

I don't have a wiring diagram for 2000 Sig (or Dynasty or Exec which would all be the same), but in 2001 the Dynasty, Exec and Sig the insta-hot shared it's outlet with many other outlets:  The wall lamp, D/S O/H, Bar O/H, Galley O/H, 3rd Galley Recpt, Ice Maker, Stove (for electric ignition), Insta-Hot, Galley Lower, Front TV, Home Stereo, VCR DSS, Front P/S O/H, ceiling chandelier, D/S wall lamps, Dinette Table  O/H, Dinette Rear O/H, Dinette Table Cabinet.  Note that some of these are options.  Also, these are all on the Inverter.

  -Rick N.

[Dr4Film]

49 minutes ago, Romeo84 said:

We have the switch and the faucet for the insta hot in our signature. Is that a dedicated run?

Tom, I think you wrote out exactly what I was thinking. That's why I haven't done it yet i don't want to run a whole new independent line. But now I'm interested to see if that insta hot run like dr. Mentioned is Independent. 

 

I doubt that the Insta-Hot is a dedicated run. I mentioned that as a possible source to plug the True Induction cook-top into versus having to run another Romex to that area. Plus we do NOT use ANY high amp draw device unless we are hooked to sufficient shore power or have the generator running. We have always maintained that logic with the Windsor and now with the Dynasty. I don't like to over stress the House Battery Bank or the Inverter, both of which are expensive to replace. The Trace/Xantrex Inverter in the Windsor is original and still working strong for the new owners after nearly 23 years of service.

The True Induction Cook-top we have in the Dynasty is NOT 240 VAC, but rather 120 VAC model which shares 1800 watts of power. It is model TI-2B.

https://tinyurl.com/3tt8uyay

 

[Romeo84]

3 minutes ago, Dr4Film said:

I doubt that the Insta-Hot is a dedicated run. I mentioned that as a possible source to plug the True Induction cook-top into versus having to run another Romex to that area. Plus we do NOT use ANY high amp draw device unless we are hooked to sufficient shore power or have the generator running. We have always maintained that logic with the Windsor and now with the Dynasty. I don't like to over stress the House Battery Bank or the Inverter, both of which are expensive to replace. The Trace/Xantrex Inverter in the Windsor is original and still working strong for the new owners after nearly 23 years of service.

The True Induction Cook-top we have in the Dynasty is NOT 240 VAC, but rather 120 VAC model which shares 1800 watts of power. It is model TI-2B.

https://tinyurl.com/3tt8uyay

 

Oh man that's exactly what I was looking for!!!!!

[Dennis T]

I also installed the 1800 watt true induction several years ago and used the insta-hot circuit with no issues.  In my case the cooktop does not work on MSW inverter.  I have never seen that as a real issue.  Since the gas cooktop was the only propane appliance I rerouted the flex hose originally used for the cooktop to a quick connect in front of the rear wheel in conduit to use for my weber grill.  I just removed the regulator from the weber and bought a flex hose.

[Raymond]

On 8/24/2023 at 4:06 PM, richmelcole@sbcglobal.net said:

To make my 02 Windsor all-electric coach, I want to replace the gas cooktop with a True Induction double burner TI-2B counter insert cooktop.  I noticed an enclosed area above the silverware drawer where the gas cooktop set in will have to be removed for ventilation and some countertop will have to be cut out and some countertop gap filled in.  Appreciate any guidance to help me complete this upgrade.  Rich

We replaced our propane with electric in the same space. A new circuit had to be added otherwise it would share the same circuit as the microwave. We kept the propane tank and use it to run our outdoor bbq. Love it!

[Tom Cherry]

21 minutes ago, Raymond said:

We replaced our propane with electric in the same space. A new circuit had to be added otherwise it would share the same circuit as the microwave. We kept the propane tank and use it to run our outdoor bbq. Love it!

Looks great...and some folks MIGHT try to share the Microwave.  That would UGLY if one turned on the Microwave and the Cooktop unit.  It might actually burn up the contacts in the Inverter where the ATS that supply power to the interior is and that would effectively destroy the Inverter as that relay is part of the main board, typically, so new board or new Inverter.  At best, it would pop the pin breakers on the Inverter.

All our inverters were never designed to supply TWO full line load (15 Amps each) circuits.

I assume you have a dedicated line from the main 50 Amp AC panel and it only can be used when on Genny or Shore.  That is the proper way...and the way that Monaco did them on the all Electric MH, UNLESS they added a second, standalone, Inverter..

Just want to reinforce this as the mythical circuitry of the Inverter and how it HAS to work to get 120 VAC power inside is a but overwhelming...

Thanks for the post.

[Raymond]

36 minutes ago, Tom Cherry said:

Looks great...and some folks MIGHT try to share the Microwave.  That would UGLY if one turned on the Microwave and the Cooktop unit.  It might actually burn up the contacts in the Inverter where the ATS that supply power to the interior is and that would effectively destroy the Inverter as that relay is part of the main board, typically, so new board or new Inverter.  At best, it would pop the pin breakers on the Inverter.

All our inverters were never designed to supply TWO full line load (15 Amps each) circuits.

I assume you have a dedicated line from the main 50 Amp AC panel and it only can be used when on Genny or Shore.  That is the proper way...and the way that Monaco did them on the all Electric MH, UNLESS they added a second, standalone, Inverter..

Just want to reinforce this as the mythical circuitry of the Inverter and how it HAS to work to get 120 VAC power inside is a but overwhelming...

Thanks for the post.

Thanks. The conversion was done in 2018, your assumption is accurate, as it is supported by a dedicated line from the main 50 AMP panel. The only problem we’ve had was the Tru-Induction which went out after exactly one year; we replaced it with the Empana brand which has been problem free ever since. 

[GringoScot]

"The Chef" wanted as much counter/preparation area as possible, so I decided to utilize soft close drawer slides with the Cuisinart dual convection cooktop.  This allowed the device fans (bottom mounted) to fully vent, unobstructed.  We use the Microwave outlet, which is a single outlet.  Yes, a cord swap here and there, but the microwave/convection oven has a battery backup for the clock.

Edited August 29, 2023 by GringoScot
Hit the wrong keyboard button.....

[dennis.mcdonaugh]

Your set up is different than mine. I replaced the propane stove a few years back after the 12 volts for the igniter shorted out and caught fire.

Here's the link to what I did on iRV2

https://www.irv2.com/forums/f115/do-you-smell-smoke-411575.html

[hitechpete]

On 8/25/2023 at 3:54 AM, Romeo84 said:

This was on the list of things to do this year! So funny. The only thing we Use in our camper was the stove. I wanted to remove the tank and make a giant tool storage compartment.  Saw someone at a campground last This year that did the exact same thing so I know it's possible. 

Like the other guy said Need to do a little research on power... in my signature I have an outlet under the sink for a subwoofer. Pretty sure it's a downstream run that could be turned independent. Curious how much a small 2 burner induction stove uses. Can't be more than a microwave?

 

What do you do for heating without the Propane tank?

[Pduggs]

Aqua-hot or heat pump. 

[Pduggs]

On 8/26/2023 at 8:24 AM, Raymond said:

We replaced our propane with electric in the same space. A new circuit had to be added otherwise it would share the same circuit as the microwave. We kept the propane tank and use it to run our outdoor bbq. Love it!

Hey Raymond, can you please tell me which model Empava you have and where you purchased it?  I suspect we have the same set in our 2008 Dynasty coaches. My original gas Amana cooktop just malfunctioned. I need to replace but can’t find a cooktop that will fit the cutout. 

[Raymond]

Hope this pic helps…

[Pduggs]

Thanks it does help. Thing is my cutout depth is 15.5” and that cooktop is only 14-1/8” wide. Did you make a modification to fill the gap?  According to the Amazon page. 
 

Edited September 6, 2023 by Pduggs

[Raymond]

A larger section of the corian countertop was added to make the bottom shelf into which the cooktop drops directly into. May be impossible to find that same countertop material and pattern—we were lucky. A section of stainless steel or butcher block could serve the same purpose and retain the aesthetic value.   Good Luck!

[dennis.mcdonaugh]

The first counter place I walked into sold Corian and had a scrap just the size I needed in my pattern. He said it was still current even though it’s a 2000 coach.