Rear tires rubbing '98 Dynasty

[Eddy B]

Last year my coach suddenly became really hard to control, the rear was wandering all over the road. The bushings in the rear were all falling apart. All bushings in the rear were replaced and the coach drove great again.

Fast forward to this year's state inspection and the inboard tires are rubbing on bolt heads on the frame. They are only touching lightly but the tires are rubbing on driver's and passenger's sides on bolt heads through the frame. There are no broken welds or signs of bent components, nothing is loose. Tires are the correct size and I believe it has the original rear wheels. 

Anybody have a similar experience?

[John Haggard]

I would start by checking the ride height.

 

Are the arns and gussets on adjustment arms good. ?

 

Im scheduled to have our 99 at josam Orlando Tuesday at 9 am. for chassis go over, alignment and front wheel bearing service myself. 

Ride height , level check.

[Dennis H]

Three things to check. 1. Are the bolts the correct bolts and installed correctly? 2. Is your ride height correct? and 3. Are your tires aired up to the correct PSI? Any one or all three could contribute to your issue. It needs to be corrected or you might find yourself changing that inside dually....Dennis

[Hotrod]

11 hours ago, Eddy B said:

Last year my coach suddenly became really hard to control, the rear was wandering all over the road. The bushings in the rear were all falling apart. All bushings in the rear were replaced and the coach drove great again.

Fast forward to this year's state inspection and the inboard tires are rubbing on bolt heads on the frame. They are only touching lightly but the tires are rubbing on driver's and passenger's sides on bolt heads through the frame. There are no broken welds or signs of bent components, nothing is loose. Tires are the correct size and I believe it has the original rear wheels. 

Anybody have a similar experience?

How are the Panhard bar bushings ?

bill g 06 Dynasty

[dandick66]

I noticed the tires on my 2012 Diplomat were rubbing on the wheel wells.  I changed the shocks and no longer have the problem.  I think they only rubbed when porpoising.

[Ivan K]

It seems to me that your bracket with the bolt head in picture is part of the H-frame and therefore always permanently positioned in respect to the axle end and there is no adjustment to help it. In fact, our axle housing is welded to the lower side of the same bracket. Unless a weld broke and the axle shifted or the H-frame weirdly twisted, I would seriously look at the rim backspacing. You say the tires are correct size. Is the same thing happening on both sides? Same steel rims? On ours, there appears to be more than 1/2 inch space between the tire sidewall and the bolt, the tire would have to be seriously underinflated to deform and flap that much, at the top. No ride adjustment or shocks have effect on this. Pic of ours for comparison, may or may not be the same.

BTW, this had to be some serious state inspection, getting under the bus... but good they found it.

 

[Ray Davis]

If you can't find the cause maybe a spacer would work .   Truck tire shops probably have them.

Something like this   

               

[Eddy B]

Thanks for all the input. I was 'out of pocket' today, so only getting to this now.

I only have the information I shared, but I am going over to the shop tomorrow to look at this with the mechanic.

Ray Davis, I discussed spacers with the mechanic, but I only have 3/8" of stud protruding from the lug nut, so I would have to change all the studs to add a 1/2 " spacer and it does not feel like we are addressing the root cause of the issue.

Ivan K, looking at your bottom photo, I would agree, there does not look like there is a way to adjust that as everything is welded. Looking at the photo I have it looks like the same bolt. I'll know for sure tomorrow. I called the prior owner, he didn't know of any repairs or issues in the rear and I dug through the repair history I had from the owner that preceded him. There is no record of damage or repairs on the rear. I think they must be the original wheels, but I do not know for sure. Both sides are rubbing, and I am super attentive to tire inflation (manual gauge check every day before driving and TPMS). I'm pretty sure Pennsylvania requires a wheel pull and brake pad measurement, I'm glad they found it too.

Hotrod, They replaced all the bushings in the rear last year (I think the total was 18 bushings). I specifically asked if he saw any issues with them and he said not, I'll look for myself tomorrow.

John Haggard and Dennis H, I don't think there is a ride height issue, but I will look at that tomorrow. I am confident it is not tire pressure related. I am thinking the offset on the wheels or some other tire/wheel issue is at play as well.

John Haggard, good luck on your checkout!

Thanks again for the input. I'll follow up more tomorrow after I see it.

Edited December 14, 2020 by Eddy B

[Chargerman]

I would also think that this is a wheel offset issue. How much space is in between the inner and outer tire?  If is looks excessive then maybe the inner wheels where swapped out at some point. This could have happened at a tire replacement by accident and therefore there would not be record of it. 

[Eddy B]

I discussed the problem with the lead mechanic at the shop today. He dismissed the offset saying the rims are not available in the rear with varying offsets. The bolt heads that are rubbing are attached to the H member and axle, there is no adjustment possible because it is all welded.

They are going to pull it back in the shop in a week or so, pull the wheels and go over everything with fresh eyes. I will update after that investigation.

I was really hoping we could swap in a 1/2" different offset wheel and be done, nope. Perplexing.

[Chargerman]

I wasn’t aware that there was only one wheel offset but it does make sense as it avoids the potential wrong wheel being put in place as I had thought might happen. So strange.  What size tires are currently on the rear?

[Ivan K]

Are the inside rims steel like they came with the rig? Aluminum wheel can be ordered with different backspace/offset. Not sure about steel, would make sense to have a standard for those.

[Eddy B]

It has aluminum wheels on inner and outer of the duals. The tire size on the coach is 295/75R 22.5

I was looking on Alcoa and buytruckwheels sites, looks like the wheels for the rear all have the same outset and inset. The data plate on my RV from Roadmaster says my tires are supposed to be the 295/75R size, but Alcoa says that tire can be installed on a 8.25" or 9" rim. If it has 9s on it dropping to 8.25s might buy me 3/8" of clearance. Still not going to get me the clearance Ivan K has in the photo above, but it might get me by.

[Ivan K]

Hmm, I thought they all came with steel inner with zero offset but maybe not. If you cleanup the dish side of the rim, you'll find a part number and a date. If they match the date of the outside wheel, it may have come like that. Either way, you could lookup the offset of the wheel.

[Dr4Film]

I also thought that the inner set of dually wheels were steel. That's what I have on my coach. This is the first time I have heard of aluminum wheels used on the inner dual's.

[Ray Davis]

2 hours ago, Dr4Film said:

I also thought that the inner set of dually wheels were steel. That's what I have on my coach. This is the first time I have heard of aluminum wheels used on the inner dual's.

That's what I have as well.  If steel inner wheels are pretty much the norm you may have stumbled onto the cause. 

I wonder if other coaches out there have aluminum inner wheels?

 

[Chargerman]

I’ve never seen aluminum inner wheels. Agree with others that this may be your issue

[John Haggard]

I would start by checking the ride height.

 

Are the arms and gussets on the ride height  adjustment arms good. ?

 

Im scheduled to have our 99 at josam Orlando Tuesday at 9 am. for chassis go over, alignment and front wheel bearing service myself. 

Ride height , level check.

 

We are back from josams now

All was good

The bi was under $600.

I would recommend this shop anytime.

Very impressive 

[Eddy B]

John Haggard, that place looks GREAT!

[John Haggard]

It was very impressive 

Very knowledgeable staff.

 

Some have been employees for 20 to 30 plus years.

 

Clean a a dining room table.

[CTerry]

Looks as though you have greased wheel bearings on the front. I would recommend changing those out to oil bath and using synthenic lube. The seals are the same. No need for yearly repacking and they will run cooler. If a bearing does get loose the lube will leak out and you will know. They did away with the greased bearing in the trucking industry years and years ago. 

[dl_racing427]

On 12/20/2020 at 10:36 AM, cterryl@sbcglobal.net said:

Looks as though you have greased wheel bearings on the front. I would recommend changing those out to oil bath and using synthenic lube. The seals are the same. No need for yearly repacking and they will run cooler. If a bearing does get loose the lube will leak out and you will know. They did away with the greased bearing in the trucking industry years and years ago. 

The seals are not the same, and all the old grease must be cleaned from the bearings and hubs.
Also, the bearings must be properly preloaded to prevent leaks and improve handling.
I made the change on mine years ago.

[John Haggard]

57 minutes ago, dl_racing427 said:

The seals are not the same, and all the old grease must be cleaned from the bearings and hubs.
Also, the bearings must be properly preloaded to prevent leaks and improve handling.
I made the change on mine years ago.

Correct dl

We run 22 semi tractors hauling grain, stone, fertilizer and hay.

All have grease packed front bearings and probably always will.

I did ask the josams service manager about my Monaco.

 

He said

Leave it grease

 

From my perspective 

Ane many years of farming, trucking.

I agreed 👍 

My Monaco will stay grease packed.

[Chargerman]

On 12/20/2020 at 10:36 AM, cterryl@sbcglobal.net said:

Looks as though you have greased wheel bearings on the front. I would recommend changing those out to oil bath and using synthenic lube. The seals are the same. No need for yearly repacking and they will run cooler. If a bearing does get loose the lube will leak out and you will know. They did away with the greased bearing in the trucking industry years and years ago. 

Not really true, many fleets stay with grease packed bearings as they continue to feel that they provide better longevity. Also, there is not a need to repack them annually on a MH considering the extreme low mileage that they see. Certainly over the road trucks that run daily will consider this to be part of a regular maintenance list. I wonder how many folks actually ever repack bearing on a large MH during their ownership. I decided to have mine done last year as I don’t have a lot of the 3/4” drive tools needed for this big stuff. The local place that I took it to does a lot of MH service as well as big truck stuff. When I told him what I wanted done his comment was “nobody has that done”. Of course he was referring to MH owners. I think that in the case of most MH situations repacking every 5 years is plenty enough but I’m sure there will be others that will comment to the contrary. It’s a personal choice, do what you are most comfortable with. 

[Chargerman]

Eddy

Just wondering how you are making out with your tire rubbing issue?