Tire Age Conundrum

[Paul J A]

*****NEW***** Toyo M144 295-80-22.5 dated 2020. *****YES 2020.*****

Just installed on a friend's coach, 10-2023.

Would you replace in 2027, or 2030?  

PLEASE, no comments on why did he buy them or how much did he pay for them. 

Thank you.

[Dr4Film]

Depends on how the tires were handled and stored for the past three years.

[vito.a]

I'd go to 2027 and have them inspected.  

[Analyte]

3 minutes ago, vito.a said:

I'd go to 2027 and have them inspected.  

I second this, and just replace if necessary. It looking ok in 2027, keep running them and then inspect again the following years up to 7.

[Dr4Film]

To inspect tires they have to be removed and inspected by someone other than the tire jockey doing the manhandling. Then you have to weigh the cost of having that done every year plus the possibility of edge damage removing and installing each time they are inspected.

Either trust an exterior inspection only or spend the bucks.

OMHO!

[Mark Holt]

It is not a conundrum. 7 years from date of mfg  not date of install. If you save hundreds of dollars and take the gamble and one blows it will cost multiplayer thousands to fix the body damage And suspension damage. If a steer tire it may cost your life

[tmw188]

They can only give you their opinion at the time of inspection. Really who’s going to put them self out there? 

[Tom Cherry]

I agree that "breaking them down" and asking someone that has not had any "tire inspection" training or certification is probably useless.

BUT....from a practical standpoint....when to replace depends...

Where were the tires stored?  Were they sitting on an outside lot, stacked up like donuts and left there for 3 years?

Are they going to run with the proper pressures based on the weight?  and NOT overinflated....just to be SURE...

Where are they going to spend the BULK of their life?  If in the SW where mega UV rays abound....then their life will be shorter.

Ideally, if they MH is stored in a semi climate controlled COVERED building, the UV damage will be minimized.  Just as, for prolonged periods of camping or storage have covers over them.

Driving them at least once a month for say 100 miles will also allow the natural oils in the rubber compound to extrude or be released to the surface....thereby helping to protect them

Will they be driven on roads where a Duce and a Half fears to go?

Did the driver often CURB them or run over barriers and weaken, visible or not, the ribs or the sidewalls.

OK....bottom line....  Folks, me included, have run tires for longer than the perfunctory 7 years.  One seasoned individual, I think, due to Covid and lack of use and his almost controlled barn ran his maybe 8 years.  I put on Bridgestones in August 2012.  I had to replace, due to an INTERNAL ISSUE, and NOT abuse or misalignment, the steers in 2018.  Thanks to Covid and some health issues, I did not put a lot of miles...maybe 6 K more on them until the spring of 2022.  OPPS...almost 10 years and they were technically about 10.75 years old...from their molding birthday.  BUT, I quit driving the rig on trips in the late summer of 2021....when they were 9 years old and had only 10 miles to drive to get the rears on in 2022.  The tires LOOKED fine.  Being in a side by side carport covered area, the UV rays don't hit the tires.  I would drive it frequently and occassionally put some "semi gloss" tire shine on them.

BUT, I knew the history of my tires and they were never stored on an open lot.  I did curb one...and replaced it.  BUT, the other 2012 tires looked as good, on the inside as well as I was curious, as they did when new...

If everything is OK...as being stored inside and the tires are treated properly and protected from UVA rays....then MAYBE push until 2028 or so...  We do NOT have good data on the long range life expectancy of the Toyo's....and that will be more evident as time goes on.  Tell the owner to follow the above and check back here.  If the Toyo's start to checker or dry rot like the Michelins did....then 2026 will be when he needs a full line of credit on his AMEX or VISA....

[Analyte]

You guys have a point, I do my own inspections. My tires are still young, but I do take a look at the exterior of them before each long drive. Once they hit 5 years, I'll probably have them removed and inspect myself for peace of mind.

 

No way would I trust someone else, many tire guys will probably just want to sell you another set. I'll look for age/heat cracks or other potential damage myself.

[Jim Pratten]

I suspect all of us have faced this question, balancing risk v cost with less than adequate data to analyze. Over the years I’ve discussed this subject with various knowledgeable folks. I know of no industry recognized inspection criteria that can rebaseline remaining useful life of a tire. Most suggest a 7 year limit from date of birth is a prudent time to replace a tire, regardless of when it was mounted, how many miles or how it was cared for.
Can a failure occur prior to 7 years, sure but most would consider it “rare”.  As the tire ages to say 10 years, probability of failure increases and may be considered “unlikely”. In my career, we commonly used Risk Matrixes as a decision support tool. If the impact of failure was potentially “severe” we’d try hard to reduce or eliminate the probability of failure.

In this attached risk tool, if we assume an impact of “severe”, a probability of “rare” yields a MEDIUM risk. A probability of “unlikely”, yields a risk of HIGH. You may not agree with my example and can apply different probabilities based upon your understanding of the impact and probability.

My risk tolerance is low, but obviously not zero as we choose to drive all around North America.  We do choose to follow the 7 year tire replacement schedule as it’s one area we think we can influence risk.
 

 

[96 EVO]

2 hours ago, Paul J A said:

*****NEW***** Toyo M144 295-80-22.5 dated 2020. *****YES 2020.*****

Just installed on a friend's coach, 10-2023.

Would you replace in 2027, or 2030?  

PLEASE, no comments on why did he buy them or how much did he pay for them. 

Thank you.

Steers... 2027

Rears... 2030

[Jim Pratten]

33 minutes ago, 96 EVO said:

Steers... 2027

Rears... 2030

This certainly makes sense from a risk perspective and less painful to the pocketbook.

[jacwjames]

3 hours ago, Analyte said:

You guys have a point, I do my own inspections. My tires are still young, but I do take a look at the exterior of them before each long drive. Once they hit 5 years, I'll probably have them removed and inspect myself for peace of mind.

 

No way would I trust someone else, many tire guys will probably just want to sell you another set. I'll look for age/heat cracks or other potential damage myself.

5 years,

Wow

If I had the tires installed, kept a TPMS working all the time, know they were never run low on pressure, know they weren't run overloaded or abused,  I'd not worry about it until 7 years.  Then consider just changing the front.   I'd run the rear for 9 years.  But the risk is up to the owner along with the cost of ownership.

 

[RoadTripper2084]

I've got some very high quality Michellins on my rig that I am hoping to run 9 years. Pressures / temps monitored via TPMS, tires are always covered when stored, and rig rests on the jack stands during prolonged winter storage. Will be keeping a close eye one them for sure for any signs of deviance from previous behaviour, cracking, etc.

 

[dl_racing427]

On 10/25/2023 at 10:07 AM, RoadTripper2084 said:

I've got some very high quality Michellins on my rig that I am hoping to run 9 years. Pressures / temps monitored via TPMS, tires are always covered when stored, and rig rests on the jack stands during prolonged winter storage. Will be keeping a close eye one them for sure for any signs of deviance from previous behaviour, cracking, etc.

 

I'm also of the opinion that, in addition to protecting tires from the sun and weather, keeping the coach weight off the tires during storage makes a big difference in tire life.
I've had several cars over the years that sat for extended periods.  Invariably, the tires cracked the worst at the bottom, where they were flexed by the load.
This is even worse if they're allowed to get low on air.

I have a a set of heavy duty jack stands that I keep my coach on whenever parked at home.  I think it saves air bags as well as tires.

[SUCHESTOM]

Here is Michelin's white paper on RV tires.  There are lots of factors going into the tire life.  How long they sit without rolling, are they parked on concrete without a plywood or rubber buffer between them and the concrete, are they exposed to UV light, are they aired to maximum pressure for storage and aired down to correct pressure for travel?   

rv-tires-whitepaper.pdf

[tmw188]

How do you open these files I never can open these on my iPhone. 

Edited October 26, 2023 by tmw188

[Tom Cherry]

13 minutes ago, tmw188 said:

How do you open these files I never can open these on my iPhone. 

You DON’T.  You have to SAVE it to FILES when it asks “Do YOU want to download…..?”.  Then go to files and find the downloads and hope it is there….PC’s work better….not an iPad or a iPhone..  

[Venturer]

My practice in the past has been to run new tires for 5 years. Then replace them with new and sell the takeoffs to a seasonal trucker hauling produce from field to processing plant. The trucker puts them on a trailer and can run them for several years. This keeps me in new tires every 5 years at a discounted price.

[tmw188]

What size are popular for most OTR trailers? 

[Venturer]

Mine were 295/80/22.5, however, I think 275 is more popular along with the 11R/22.5. At $100-$150 per tire, it takes the sting out of a new set.

[tmw188]

Absolutely! How do you find a buyer?

[Ivan K]

21 minutes ago, tmw188 said:

Absolutely! How do you find a buyer?

I sold my used 11R tires twice so far, posting on Facebook marketplace. Craigs list would be an alternative too but i haven't used it a long time now. First round I asked for $150 per and it took few days. Next time I needed them gone quick so I posted $150 for one or $600 for all 6. Gone to the first guy in line the next morning. There were more parties that just could not make it so early.

[jacwjames]

3 hours ago, tmw188 said:

What size are popular for most OTR trailers? 

When I was having my Yokohama's installed  in 2021 an older truck driver backed in to have one of his tires checked for a leak.  Evidently he had done a lot of business there as the shop manager ran out and yelled at his guys to get on that truck ASAP. 

I struck up a conversation, as he was running Firestones on the front steer tires but the Yokohama's on the rears of his cab.  He said that he liked the Yoko's and had them on all of his trucks (so I assume he had a fleet).  His rig was older but flawless, a beautiful truck, well taken care of.  

 

My old tires (Brigestones) were well aged out (covid) so I didn't even bother trying to sell them BUT I have no doubt in my cavernous mind that the shop owner sold them.  If someone didn't bother to check the DOT dates you'd thought they were almost new.  I inspected each one as they pulled them off, all looked great, no signs of weather cracking, no cuts, tread depth was great, the insides all looked good.  

For myself I would not felt right selling that old of tire.   

[Venturer]

A lot depends on what the extended use will be. Our WI home is in the middle of irrigated cash crop farming. Sweet corn, potatoes, beans, and  peas are grown for processing. Independent truckers and farmers haul these crops from field to storage or processing plants. I was one of those farmers for 20 years. The trucks were only used for a few months and rarely over 15 miles loaded per trip, so older tires were good far longer than what an RVer would call safe, especially on a semi trailer, as the loaded weight on any one tire is only 4,000#. Checking with independent truckers will lead to someone who has a need/use for RV takeoff tires.