Engine "Warning" Dash Light

[Dr4Film]

Folks,

I remember posting about this a few years back on the old Yahoo site but I don't remember the response that I received plus I believe the old Yahoo conversations are not available on this site as yet so I am posting this again.

On our trip north from Florida to western NY this past week I had two instances where the "warning" light came on for less than one minute before it reset itself and went off. The first time it happened was on I-77 upon exiting a rest area and this was after spending two + hours on the road so the engine was well warmed up. The second time was after we had stayed overnight at the Ironto Safety Rest Area on I-81 northbound. Upon exiting the rest area that morning the "warning" light came on once again. What is ironic is that this was the same location where it had happened before a few years ago.

According to my manual the explanation for the "warning" light is as follows: "Indicates out of range condition exists within the engine protection circuits. Stop coach and check all fluids."

I did check all fluids at a rest area we had stopped at a couple of hours up the road however everything was OK. Plus it never happened again for the balance of the trip over the next two days of travel.

Has any member had a similar experience with their dash "warning" light coming on for whatever reason and then going off?

I have a Cummins 350 ISC with a Banks Power Pack

[Ray Davis]

 Richard ,

I have had my warning light come on 2 or 3 times on our 03 Windsor ISL it was always when coming down a mountain pass . 

I attributed the light coming onto letting my RPMs getting to high 

Maybe when accelerating out of the rest stop your RPMs got a little hi .

 However in my case the light would not go off until I restarted the engine .

There seems to be so many things that can cause a warning light that if it doesn't stay on you may never know the cause .

 

[philcarrell]

Richard I came down Raton in (NM-CO) pass headed North last year with my engine brake on and the check engine light came on.   I called friend of mine and explained what was happening.  He said the exhaust brake being on for a period of time caused the engine to operate in a unusual state caused it.  He said when you shut it down and restarted the light would go off, sure enough it did.  It happened one more time on that trip.  This Wednesday came down Raton Pass  and the light came on again, stopped for the night and on startup the light went out.   I gues with the engine RPM's running a little high without a load is the issue.. 

[DavidL]

Depending on which specific "warning light", the engine controller may have recorded the event.

You would get a scan tool compatible with your vehicle's communication system.  If this is a newer diesel, then probably J1939 protocol is used.  J1708 is typically used on older than 2002 ish.

No one is going to give you good insight into what the light came on for without knowing the Diagnostic Trouble Code that may have been set.

Any decent truck repair facility can pull the codes.  The diagnostic connector will most certainly be located near the steering column.  Many DPs also have an additional in the engine bay.

Edited July 17, 2020 by DavidL

[Robert U]

Richard,

I had warning light off and on and it turned out to be overheating. There are six conditions that can cause light to come on.

Coolant temperature

Coolant level

Oil Pressure

Intake manifold temperature

Engine overspeed

Fuel temperature

This info is for ISC engine. Don't about other engines

Bob U  2000 Dip

[Hypoxia]

As mentioned, there are many causes for the light and for it extinguishing.  Some codes will keep the light on if the problem is active more than a certain amount of time.  I carry a bootleg copy of Cummins Insite and it is always running when the engine is running.  I can immediately see any codes, run tests etc.  For the small investment you can see the problem, see the Cummins troubleshooting chart and even if you cannot repair it you can tell the mobile tech what's going on so he can bring the part along.  It recently saved my bacon when I lost two cylinders due to a fuel timing actuator.    I repaired it myself and was on the way in a few hours.  It saves all codes, shows if they are active, how many times it happened etc.

Code readers are not all equal.

[dandick66]

I’ve had the warning light come on about 3 or 4 times now.  The first time it was less than 1/2 mile after starting out from home.  I immediately stopped and shut down.  Checked all gauges, etc.  Manual said it was OK to drive so I did.  The light went out after about 5 miles.  Fast forward 3 months and the light came on again when leaving the Tampa gathering this year.  I shut down ,waited a few minutes and started up and the light did not come on.

It’s happened twice since then and every time, it is within 10 minutes of initial startup. The interesting thing is that no codes are ever logged on the Scangauge.  I’ve decided that the next time it happens I’m going to fire up the laptop with Service Max software and see if there is a code in that software.

My engine is a Maxxforce 10, EPA 2010 model.  The other problem I have is the Medallion instrumentation.  When that warning light comes on, I also get an audio alarm and it goes the whole time.  I’ve contacted REV, Navistar and Medallion.  No one can provide details on the interface between the Maxxforce engine and Medallion instrumentation.  
 

Dan D, 2012 Diplomat 43DFT 

[bgbranch1]

Richard,

Your problem most likely is  the water level is slightly low. What happens is the water is high enough to show full in the sight glass even when cold, but when the water is cold or cooled down while idling in the rest area and you throttle hard to enter the highway, because the sending unit is on the front of the expansion tank,  the water runs away from the sender just slightly which is enough to set the alarm. Add a couple cups of water and you will no longer have that problem.

Ron B 07 Camelot 42PDQ

[Jon__C]

On 7/18/2020 at 7:00 AM, Hypoxia said:

As mentioned, there are many causes for the light and for it extinguishing.  Some codes will keep the light on if the problem is active more than a certain amount of time.  I carry a bootleg copy of Cummins Insite and it is always running when the engine is running.  I can immediately see any codes, run tests etc.  For the small investment you can see the problem, see the Cummins troubleshooting chart and even if you cannot repair it you can tell the mobile tech what's going on so he can bring the part along.  It recently saved my bacon when I lost two cylinders due to a fuel timing actuator.    I repaired it myself and was on the way in a few hours.  It saves all codes, shows if they are active, how many times it happened etc.

Code readers are not all equal.

Hey Hypoxia id like to get the insite like you have do you have any advice? Im having low power issues with my 98 ISB and also would like to create the iso file for backup. Thanks in advance Jon. 

[Hypoxia]

15 hours ago, Jon__C said:

Hey Hypoxia id like to get the insite like you have do you have any advice? Im having low power issues with my 98 ISB and also would like to create the iso file for backup. Thanks in advance Jon. 

Here's one Chinese Cummins Insite 6 with Inline 7.6  I  don't trust it virus wise and have it on a dedicated computer along with Silverleaf.  The computer will not be connected to the internet ever.  It is not a simple plug & play as you have to go through the setup steps.  I don't know what style diagnostic port you have so check to make sure that adapter is included.

[Jon__C]

6 hours ago, Hypoxia said:

Here's one Chinese Cummins Insite 6 with Inline 7.6  I  don't trust it virus wise and have it on a dedicated computer along with Silverleaf.  The computer will not be connected to the internet ever.  It is not a simple plug & play as you have to go through the setup steps.  I don't know what style diagnostic port you have so check to make sure that adapter is included.

Thank you!

 

[bgbranch1]

Why not purchase it from Cummins instead of supporting the Chinese theft of Intellectual property, just to save money?

Ethics matter!!!!!

Ron B 07 Camelot 42PDQ

[dl_racing427]

I agree with Ron.

I try to avoid sending my money to China, especially when it's for counterfeit products.

David

[ken.knutson100]

On 7/18/2020 at 9:13 AM, bgbranch1 said:

Richard,

Your problem most likely is  the water level is slightly low. What happens is the water is high enough to show full in the sight glass even when cold, but when the water is cold or cooled down while idling in the rest area and you throttle hard to enter the highway, because the sending unit is on the front of the expansion tank,  the water runs away from the sender just slightly which is enough to set the alarm. Add a couple cups of water and you will no longer have that problem.

Ron B 07 Camelot 42PDQ

That’s been the problem with our 08 Camelot and our 09 Dynasty...low coolant level (even though it’s full) when going up and down hills it will come on. I’ve tried replacing the sensors and it didn’t make a difference. Just live with it 

[Ivan K]

23 hours ago, bgbranch1 said:

Why not purchase it from Cummins instead of supporting the Chinese theft of Intellectual property, just to save money?

Ethics matter!!!!!

Ron B 07 Camelot 42PDQ

Agree but also know that the $1200 for a genuine Cummins piece is a ripoff in comparison. Unless you run a HD truck shop, hardly justifiable. Add a $89 cable for my 6 pin style connector that just  isn't included. Plus you still need an expensive yearly software license if you go that way. No wonder people go for the comparable cheaper stuff from eBay or Amazon that works for personal use. Having said that, I snatched a used genuine piece for much cheaper.

[bgbranch1]

Ivan,

I understand, like they say the only difference between men and boys is the cost of their toys. 
I do own a heavy truck repair shop and we spend upwards of 15,000. A year for all the computer software licenses to cover all the engine builders along with truck manufacturers. 
 

Ron B 07 Camelot 42PDQ

2 hours ago, Ivan K said:

Agree but also know that the $1200 for a genuine Cummins piece is a ripoff in comparison. Unless you run a HD truck shop, hardly justifiable. Add a $89 cable for my 6 pin style connector that just  isn't included. Plus you still need an expensive yearly software license if you go that way. No wonder people go for the comparable cheaper stuff from eBay or Amazon that works for personal use. Having said that, I snatched a used genuine piece for much cheaper.

 

[Steven P]

I get one on my 06 Dip with the 400isl Cummins.   My scan gauge gives me a code that I searched and found related to a voltage spike.  I have a feeling my alternator regulator may be going bad.  

[vanwill52]

3 hours ago, Steven P said:

I get one on my 06 Dip with the 400isl Cummins.   My scan gauge gives me a code that I searched and found related to a voltage spike.  I have a feeling my alternator regulator may be going bad.  

Steven, what code number did you get?  I recently had one that showed on my VMSpc as "251--Power Supply Data Invalid".  The Cummins code was 434.

[Steven P]

22 minutes ago, vanwill52 said:

Steven, what code number did you get?  I recently had one that showed on my VMSpc as "251--Power Supply Data Invalid".  The Cummins code was 434.

This is a pic.  But I don't think its a Cummins code.  The first time it popped up, we called Cummins and they said it wasn't theirs.  I may be wrong though. 

[vanwill52]

If you know someone with a Cummins engine manual for your particular engine, their fault code list gives the "generic"  SID or PID codes, along with the Cummins code numbers.  My SID 251 crossed to Cummins 434.

[Steven P]

That's good to know.  I have a diesel shop nearby.  I will see what I can find out.  Thank you.

[Frank McElroy]

Code 223-3 translates to either Cummins code 293 or 297.  You would need Cummins Insite software to know which one.

Code 293 is fault for aux temperature sensor input #1.

Code 297 is fault for aux pressure sensor input #2.

Both of those Cummins codes will display 223-3.

[Frank McElroy]

For future reference, I posts one of the better list of PID/SID FMI fault codes and how they map over to OEM fault codes.  Covers, Cat, Cummins, DD and our ABS systems.

 

[Steven P]

2 hours ago, Frank McElroy said:

Code 223-3 translates to either Cummins code 293 or 297.  You would need Cummins Insite software to know which one.

Code 293 is fault for aux temperature sensor input #1.

Code 297 is fault for aux pressure sensor input #2.

Both of those Cummins codes will display 223-3.

Frank, this is from Scan Gauge D's manual.  I'm not sure about the 223, but the 3 under FM implies the voltage reading is too high?  

This is what I came across looking at Cummins isl 400 codes--this site at least, does not show a 223.  I looked in the manual you shared, @Frank McElroy, and it's dated 2004 and my engine is 2006 so I am not sure if it correlates.  But this is all new to me and I am still learning all of this and appreciate all input.  

[Frank McElroy]

Steve - When looking up Cummins fault codes you need to use the Cummins fault code number.  223 is not a Cummins Number - it is a PID/SID number.  A 223-3 code maps over to either Cummins number 293 or 297.  So, using the other file for troubleshooting cummins fault codes, 297 pops up on page 65.  It is for the OEM Pressure Sensor Circuit.

But I would first use the Cummins Insite software to determine the exact Cummins fault code directly and then if you verified its actually fault code 297, follow the Cummins Troubleshooting procedure page 265 to resolve the issue.