Broken kitchen sink drain

[Gary Petersen]

My problem is with the kitchen sink drain in our 2002' Signature Centurion which has the drivers side kitchen slide-out. We started getting  sink water running across the floor whenever we drained the kitchen sink. I thought at first, this sounds like a reasonably easy plumbing issue to fix. Wow, was I wrong.

I located the white colored, and stiffly corrugated 1 1/2" PVC Flexible drain pipe. I found that due to the lack of cabinet space, I could see that the pipe had been abruptly kinked to 90 degrees against the inside wall of the cabinet, specifically when the sink is in the "slide-in" position. Question: Could this possibly be Monaco's original design? Or did I find some after market repair? 

This sharp 90 degree kinking occurs just after the transition from ABS to the flexible drain. It must have happened so many times that it fractured the flexible corrugated  pipe. (photo below)

This design requires that the drain pipe be flexible so as to maintain the the integrity of the drain while constantly flexing as it maintains the 180 degree turn as the "slide-out" travel makes the pipe move several inches.

I cut out the "kink" and tried to reconnect the piping using a Fernco fitting with double hose clamps but the drain pipe pulls out of the Fernco when the Slide is sent out.

Is this the original plumbing system and has anyone else had to deal with this? I am north of Seattle; can anyone suggest a shop that may be  familiar with this Monaco system? 

Thanks, Gary

 

 

 

 

[Dr4Film]

Gary,

I would make an appointment at Elite RV Repair in Harrisburg Oregon. They are ex-Monaco techs and do a great job.

https://eliternr.com/

[joefromperry]

That is the worst design. I have the same thing on my 2003 signature kitchen slide, only it's on the passenger slide. Mine didn't kink like yours, but the flexible pipe pulled away from the solid pipe, and the clamps that held the kitchen drain pipe to the wall pulled away, causing lots of extra movement.  It's not too difficult to fix yourself.

I have a slider / pulley type system that rolls with the flexible pipe when slide is pulled in and out. Is yours the same? 

[Gary Petersen]

Joe,

It is comforting to know that one is not alone with this problematic  system.

I do not see any pulley type system which would roll, or assist the movement of the  flexible pipe in my system. 

Do you recall if your hose system had a "Glued" 45 degree PVC fitting as shown in my photo?

Any advice as to what you did to solve your problem?   My Furnco connector did not work.

Were you able to use the existing pipe or did you have to replace the existing pipe with something new? 

Thanks,

[Romeo84]

Has no one pointed out the artwork on the graph paper! Like I know this doesn't aid to your fix and I apologize but he took the time to draw it out on graph paper!!! High five bud!

 

[Gary Petersen]

Richard,

I appreciate the tip; If I can't figure out a permanent fix in the next few days, I will give Elite a call.

Thanks,

[vito.a]

Harry posted a great how to thread on replacing the flexible drain hose. Several of us have had to replace it.
There should be a trolley that carries the hose when the slide goes in/out.

I used industrial reinforced blue PVC tubing I found at American Hose and Rubber Co.
The hose ID is 1 1/2". The steel barb fitting is a Dixon ST20.
However, I was not able to use the long steel hose barb on the top because it interferes with the door that covers that section of the cabinet. I ended up using the short nylon hose barb from Home Depot.  This short hose barb really helped stop the kinking with the slide in.  
The hose is part number BW150X100 108HO PVC S&D. Four feet.
Post # 79 (lots of pictures in this thread)
https://www.irv2.com/forums/f115/kit...-383127-6.html

Edited September 15, 2021 by vito.a

[Ivan K]

To me it looks like someone's quick fix. In my case the flexible piece at the bottom was longer towards the sink and no 45 degree elbow is involved. Because of our floor plan, my access was through bathroom cabinet below bathroom sink but same principle. 

[jacwjames]

Here is a parts breakdown of my kitchen slide plumbing, which provide a good visual and shows the trolley that aids it the extend/retract function.  The trolley is nothing more then a pocket door hardware kit, with comes with the track, two of the roller systems, and attaching hardware.   My guess is someone just decided to free style it. 

There have numerous posts on IRV2 on this and some seem to have found a better hose. 

1 Kitchen slideout plumbing.pdf

[Bob Jones]

It's a common issue. Mine broke with the same kink as you had. That aluminum rail in your pic should be the trolley. You can redesign it so that it moves better without much hassle. I did a fair bit of rearranging when I did mine and when done the slide operated much better so it was binding in a number of areas. By the looks of it you have easy access...

[Gary 05 AMB DST]

Gary, I think the problem is the 45 elbow. It is changing the parallel movement of the hose.

Gary 05 AMB DST

[Paul Busch]

I repaired mine with the heavy PVC glue fitting and SPA hose from Ace Hardware. Standard PVC fittings and glue work on the flexible PVC hose.

paul

[georgecederholm]

20 hours ago, Gary Petersen said:

My problem is with the kitchen sink drain in our 2002' Signature Centurion which has the drivers side kitchen slide-out. We started getting  sink water running across the floor whenever we drained the kitchen sink. I thought at first, this sounds like a reasonably easy plumbing issue to fix. Wow, was I wrong.

I located the white colored, and stiffly corrugated 1 1/2" PVC Flexible drain pipe. I found that due to the lack of cabinet space, I could see that the pipe had been abruptly kinked to 90 degrees against the inside wall of the cabinet, specifically when the sink is in the "slide-in" position. Question: Could this possibly be Monaco's original design? Or did I find some after market repair? 

This sharp 90 degree kinking occurs just after the transition from ABS to the flexible drain. It must have happened so many times that it fractured the flexible corrugated  pipe. (photo below)

This design requires that the drain pipe be flexible so as to maintain the the integrity of the drain while constantly flexing as it maintains the 180 degree turn as the "slide-out" travel makes the pipe move several inches.

I cut out the "kink" and tried to reconnect the piping using a Fernco fitting with double hose clamps but the drain pipe pulls out of the Fernco when the Slide is sent out.

Is this the original plumbing system and has anyone else had to deal with this? I am north of Seattle; can anyone suggest a shop that may be  familiar with this Monaco system? 

Thanks, Gary

 

 

As mentioned, this is a moderately common issue, and there are write-ups in the Files section on Monacoers and various threads on other sites.

It’s not terribly hard to replace the “flex” hose. The transitions from the white PVC to the black ABS should be threaded. Cut the “flex” hose close to the fitting and unscrew the PVC. You can get replacement PVC fittings and the hose (called “spa hose”) at Home Depot or equivalent.

You can also make things a bit easier by using more flexible hose. I used the 1” plastic hose and a simple step-down PVC bushing with a barbed adapter. Much easier to replace if anything bad happens in the future, and plenty of capacity for whatever goes down the kitchen sink.

Your pictures and diagram (+) appear to show the “trolley” that’s supposed to slide in and out and stabilize the hose when moving. You’ll want to make sure that moves freely and address any issues with movement. This would also be a good time to make sure that movement hasn’t caused any excess stress on the entire ABS pipe back towards the stove and sink. Ours developed a crack behind a cabinet that had to be replaced.

https://ourrvrepairs.blogspot.com/2015/01/kitchen-sink-drain-fix-round-2.html

Or, on Monacoers web site, navigate to Home > Downloads > Water Systems and you’ll find a couple of files on Kitchen Sink Drain issues.

George C, 2005 Exec
 

Edited September 16, 2021 by georgecederholm
Added info on Monacoers Downloads section

[Gary 05 AMB DST]

Gary, all my OEM pipe is black pvc. Is the white pipe connected to black pipe?

Gary 05 AMB DST

[willbo777]

37 minutes ago, georgecederholm said:

 

You can also make things a bit easier by using more flexible hose. I used the 1” plastic hose and a simple step-down PVC bushing with a barbed adapter. Much easier to replace if anything bad happens in the future, and plenty of capacity for whatever goes down the kitchen sink.

George C, 2005 Exec

I also replaced ours with 1" hose about 3 years ago and it gave way again.  In the interest of time I replaced it again with 1" hose, but my wife complains about the reduced drainage so one of my projects this winter will be to go back up to either 1 1/2" or possibly 1 1/4".  I agree it isn't a terribly hard project.
 

 

[Jobert]

We have experienced the same problem, twice, so I went to a auto parts store and looked up a flexible radiator hose the length and diameter I needed.  I put slip on connectors at each end of the plumbing plastic and used double hose clamps on each end. That has worked for 4 years now.  You need a parts person experienced in looking up something by size and not by application.  Those types are getting harder to come by with everything by application on a computer.  Hope this may help and have a great day. Happy trails Bert

[JohnC3]

On 9/16/2021 at 1:52 PM, Jobert said:

We have experienced the same problem, twice, so I went to a auto parts store and looked up a flexible radiator hose the length and diameter I needed.  I put slip on connectors at each end of the plumbing plastic and used double hose clamps on each end. That has worked for 4 years now.  You need a parts person experienced in looking up something by size and not by application.  Those types are getting harder to come by with everything by application on a computer.  Hope this may help and have a great day. Happy trails Bert

I have found that the NAPA Associates seem to be better at this (Finding matches for parts by size)  than others. Especially if you can find a NAPA Auto and Truck parts store!  I replaced all my Radiator hoses after I had a hose part on I-90 on Labor day (and roadside service was pretty much unavailable).

John

[Dr4Film]

Mike,

Great fix and excellent job well done. That would be well worth it to me also to never have to deal with it EVER again.

Can you explain  how the fitting swivels and does not leak? Do they use special seals that allow it to move but still keep the water in the pipe?

Can you point me to the web page where you purchased the special slip fitting? I did a quick search and didn't come up with any hits.

[Gary 05 AMB DST]

Mike, so you used the existing hose? How did you connect the hose to the new elbow?

Gary 05 AMB DST

Quote

 

 

[Dr4Film]

Mike,

Thanks for the link. So the new fitting is the grey colored pipe in your photo which is barely noticeable. The white pipe fittings and elbow are all standard items.

Many members are going to thank you for this tip and idea.

Great job!

 

[Hypoxia]

Mike, that's a good idea.  I'm sure everyone will want a long term report as that spa hose gets very stiff in cold weather and has stymied more than a few of us.  My Signature drain line is routed completely different so I don't think I can use the swivel but I'll certainly look at that the next time I'm in there.

[Gary Petersen]

Drain pipes under the kitchen slide keep coming apart | The RV Forum Community.pdfDrain pipes under the kitchen slide keep coming apart | The RV Forum Community.pdfDrain pipes under the kitchen slide keep coming apart | The RV Forum Community.pdfDrain pipes under the kDrain pipes under the kitchen slide keep coming apart | The RV Forum Community.pdfDrain pipes under the kitchen slide keep coming apart | The RV Forum Community.pdfDrain pipes under the kitchen slide keep coming apart | The RV Forum Community.pdfDrain pipes under the kitchen slide keep coming apart | The RV Forum Community.pdfitchen slide keep coming apart | The RV Forum Community.pdfOk, it has been since Sept when I posted my plea for help with my sink drain issue. Well, due to "supply chain" issues, and a busy schedule, I was just finally able to install a new drain hose with an 1 1/2" Aluminum drain swivel. I am "attempting" to attach a copy of the article from the RV Forum which I stumbled across (where are the techie grand kids when you need them?) and what I think is an excellent solution to the hose kinking problem.

The source mentioned in the article for the Aluminum swivel, I found was no longer available so, our local industrial hose store was able to order a comparable 1 1/2" Wedgon brand Aluminum Swivel. I wish I had found Mike's flexpvc.com source as I could have saved a bunch of cash. As a prevent maint. I replaced all the ABS from the "P" trap to the swivel's male aluminum threads. So, coming onto the Swivel, I put a 1 1/2" female ABS threaded coupler.  Coming out of the 90 degree swivel is a Male threaded PVC coupler which transitioned to accept the new PVC spa hose (from Home Depot). I tried to follow the design and process of the article and although it required some minor adaptations, and some cramped working conditions, so far. I feel please with the results and would recommend using a swivel to others who have this issue.

Drain pipes under the kitchen slide keep coming apart | The RV Forum Community.pdfDrain pipes under the kitchen slide keep coming apart | The RV Forum Community.pdfDrain pipes under the kitchen slide keep coming apart | The RV Forum Community.pdf

[lake49068]

Just noticed something in the basement/laundry area at home...anyone ever tried adapting a washing machine discharge hose?  Diameter may need to be adapted but the hose sure is flexible, will handle "gravity" water pressure, readily available and probably reasonably priced.  

Adam

[georgecederholm]

1 hour ago, mike_fluharty said:

The problem I think with that is you are necking down from 1.5” to about 1” and you will get a tremendous build up of gunk at the dam created by adapting that small.  Just MHO.

Mike, 

I decreased hose size several years ago after my second failure (first the spa hose; second in the ABS by the stove — write-up in the Files). I used 1” ID reinforced plastic line with bushings down to barbed fittings. Haven’t really experienced any decreased flow due to buildup or other restrictions. But I really like the idea floated above about washing machine drain hose for the next iteration. I also have some flexible bilge line I used to replace the water gravity fill a couple of years ago, which is much more flexible than the spa hose.

Our plumbing design is a little different that many who have commented, as it elbows from the sliding cabinets much further back in the fixed cabinet. Changing to the swivel fitting would require increasing support for that part of the fitting before the flexible line. But, I might see if that could work, “next time”.

[moxy1962]

On 9/15/2021 at 12:24 PM, Gary Petersen said:

My problem is with the kitchen sink drain in our 2002' Signature Centurion which has the drivers side kitchen slide-out. We started getting  sink water running across the floor whenever we drained the kitchen sink. I thought at first, this sounds like a reasonably easy plumbing issue to fix. Wow, was I wrong.

I located the white colored, and stiffly corrugated 1 1/2" PVC Flexible drain pipe. I found that due to the lack of cabinet space, I could see that the pipe had been abruptly kinked to 90 degrees against the inside wall of the cabinet, specifically when the sink is in the "slide-in" position. Question: Could this possibly be Monaco's original design? Or did I find some after market repair? 

This sharp 90 degree kinking occurs just after the transition from ABS to the flexible drain. It must have happened so many times that it fractured the flexible corrugated  pipe. (photo below)

This design requires that the drain pipe be flexible so as to maintain the the integrity of the drain while constantly flexing as it maintains the 180 degree turn as the "slide-out" travel makes the pipe move several inches.

I cut out the "kink" and tried to reconnect the piping using a Fernco fitting with double hose clamps but the drain pipe pulls out of the Fernco when the Slide is sent out.

Is this the original plumbing system and has anyone else had to deal with this? I am north of Seattle; can anyone suggest a shop that may be  familiar with this Monaco system? 

Thanks, Gary

 

 

 

 

Been there done that, has to repair twice in 7 years, the trolly system needs to slide smoothly and everything needs to stay in alignment